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So clarification and I know this might sound simple but became a topic of debate.

"Your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls when shooting at Raven Guard units with this tactic if they are more than 12" Away"

For example a marine shooting at a raven guard unit from 12+ away with a BS of 3+, Would he need a 2+ or a 4+ to hit the raven guard?

 Phillyguy413 wrote:
So clarification and I know this might sound simple but became a topic of debate.

"Your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls when shooting at Raven Guard units with this tactic if they are more than 12" Away"

For example a marine shooting at a raven guard unit from 12+ away with a BS of 3+, Would he need a 2+ or a 4+ to hit the raven guard?

You roll to hit. You subtract 1 from this hit roll, just like the rule says.
The To-Hit characteristic is never modified.

 Phillyguy413 wrote:
So clarification and I know this might sound simple but became a topic of debate.

"Your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls when shooting at Raven Guard units with this tactic if they are more than 12" Away"

For example a marine shooting at a raven guard unit from 12+ away with a BS of 3+, Would he need a 2+ or a 4+ to hit the raven guard?

That's really the dumbest thing I have seen in a while. Anyone trying to "interpret" it as making it easier to hit them is malicious, there is no room for a mistake here.

In any case, you don't subtract from the characteristic, you subtract from the roll. You still need a 3+ to hit, you just need to get a 3 on D6-1 instead of D6.

Hanskrampf wrote:

 Phillyguy413 wrote:
So clarification and I know this might sound simple but became a topic of debate.

"Your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls when shooting at Raven Guard units with this tactic if they are more than 12" Away"

For example a marine shooting at a raven guard unit from 12+ away with a BS of 3+, Would he need a 2+ or a 4+ to hit the raven guard?

You roll to hit. You subtract 1 from this hit roll, just like the rule says.
The To-Hit characteristic is never modified.

BaconCatBug wrote:

 Phillyguy413 wrote:
So clarification and I know this might sound simple but became a topic of debate.

"Your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls when shooting at Raven Guard units with this tactic if they are more than 12" Away"

For example a marine shooting at a raven guard unit from 12+ away with a BS of 3+, Would he need a 2+ or a 4+ to hit the raven guard?

That's really the dumbest thing I have seen in a while.

In any case, you don't subtract from the characteristic, you subtract from the roll. You still need a 3+ to hit, you just need to get a 3 on D6-1 instead of D6.

Thank you. I never played against a Raven Guard player and got into a debate with them about it and got into a whole thing.

Chapter tactics are supposed to help you, not to punish you. Unless you are ultramarines, your flyers get -1 to hit when shooting after fallback. Other SM chapter flyers dont get that penalty.

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t Chapter Tactics only apply to <INFANTRY>, <BIKER>, and <DREADNOUGHT> units. So an <ULTRAMARINE> flyer would be able to fall back and still shoot at its normal balistic skill because it does not have any of the previously mentioned keywords.

 Longshadow7 wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t Chapter Tactics only apply to <INFANTRY>, <BIKER>, and <DREADNOUGHT> units. So an <ULTRAMARINE> flyer would be able to fall back and still shoot at its normal balistic skill because it does not have any of the previously mentioned keywords.

Yes, but not all units with the FLY keyword are vehicles. Ever heard of JP infantry ?

p5freak wrote:

 Longshadow7 wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t Chapter Tactics only apply to <INFANTRY>, <BIKER>, and <DREADNOUGHT> units. So an <ULTRAMARINE> flyer would be able to fall back and still shoot at its normal balistic skill because it does not have any of the previously mentioned keywords.

Yes, but not all units with the FLY keyword are vehicles. Ever heard of JP infantry ?

Either the Flyer battlefield role or the Fly keyword should have been named something different. Far too ambiguous in conversational usage. We need to start saying Fly-units or something to be clear that we aren't just talking about aircraft (Flyers).

 Scott-S6 wrote:

p5freak wrote:

 Longshadow7 wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t Chapter Tactics only apply to <INFANTRY>, <BIKER>, and <DREADNOUGHT> units. So an <ULTRAMARINE> flyer would be able to fall back and still shoot at its normal balistic skill because it does not have any of the previously mentioned keywords.

Yes, but not all units with the FLY keyword are vehicles. Ever heard of JP infantry ?

Either the Flyer battlefield role or the Fly keyword should have been named something different. Far too ambiguous in conversational usage. We need to start saying Fly-units or something to be clear that we aren't just talking about aircraft (Flyers).

"Flyers"
"Units with FLY Keyword"

Easy! Precision is all that's needed.