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Made in us
Slaanesh Havoc with Blastmaster





Denver, CO

I'm annoyed and frustrated by The Inquisition! I feel like they should be the Haemonculous Freakshow of the Imperium yet they seem plagued by an aimless Index which has forsaken them to rules which do not easily lend themselves to Inquisitorial expeditions. I like 8th Edition, for the most part. I feel like the rules for Inquisition and its former staples are at odds with this edition. I want to fix this. How would you fix the Inquisition within the framework of 8th Edition? What changes would you make to bring this army into the fold of 8th, keeping in mind the history of the army and how it was constructed in earlier editions, how it functioned and what mechanics of the army did to differentiate it from other Imperium armies. What niche can it fulfill?

To start:

1. Allow any unaligned Ministorum unit to add the Ordo [*] Keyword to it's list. (Ie. no SoB, Grey Knight or Deathwatch Units.)

1a. My immediate problem with this is how out of hand it would get with the current Ordo Traits of rerolling failed Hit AND Wound rolls if this was applied to Sobs/GK/DW, but how else to make them feel more integrated?

2. Fold the Scions back into the Inquisition or otherwise allow them to be taken as [Troops] for a detachment with an Inquisitor as Warlord.

2a. My thinking is that, requiring the Warlord to be an Inquisitor would curb any abuses of Scions as [Troops]. Though, it may be best to replace their AM Keyword with an Ordo [*] Keyword under the same circumstance.

3. Addressing Acolytes, would 2 wounds aid in bringing them back into prominence? They could only form very small units to begin with so a points adjustment may be a better solution to whatever problems were being addressed... though I don't recall hearing about any problems. (Some information regarding the thinking behind the nerf and what problems were being headed off would go a long ways towards aiding in fixing the rest of the army and bringing it inline with a specific design philosophy.)

4. More intrusively would be fixing points costs for Ministorum units and finding a role for Crusaders. There seem, to me anyways, to be some issues with fielding almost ANY of the non-SoB Ministorum selections.

I think the "niche" question is really the biggest problem to tackle. Finding the right niche would decide the design approach and create the parameters which would help to determine which fixes flow naturally and keep the army from feeling shoehorned together. Personally I think the Freakshow tact is the way to go. Any help would be appreciated. I'd like to create solutions that are well reasoned and work with a minimalist philosophy to show that they can be designed well as a stand alone army that integrates well with 8th Edition. What's the least amount of change that can be made while effecting the best (not the most powerful) outcome?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This line of reasoning broke 7th edition in Fantasy. The books should be as equal as possible, even a theoretical "Codex: Squirrels with Crustacean allies" should have a fair chance to beat "Codex: God".

 Redbeard wrote:

- Cost? FW models cost more? Because Thudd guns are more expensive than Wraithknights and Riptides. Nope, not a good argument. This is an expensive game. We play it knowing that, and also knowing that, realistically, it's cheaper than hookers and blow.
 
   
Made in no
Powerful Ushbati





Bergen

The problem with the inquestion is that every new iquisitor wants to fix the iquesition. And this it is always fighting againdt itself.

I am a dyslectic, so bear with me.

Dyslectics in a text based environment? Dakka is aware of you and sympathises with any troubles you have: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/505863.page

Kronos biovore box fresh sporemines. Denying psykick powers since 2017.

 
   
Made in ca
Renegade Inquisitor with a Bound Daemon





Tied and gagged in the back of your car

The problem with the Inquisition is that as it is, it's just so poorly designed that it needs to be completely redesigned from that ground up.
   
Made in gb
Warp-Screaming Noise Marine





Realistically, I think any Inq codex should have acces to everything Imperium related, transports, troops, etc. No need to include all the entries in one codex just make reference to the unit, etc and refer to the relevant codex/index.

Saying that. GW are probably salivating at the prospect of how many books you would need to buy to run a mixed, yet battleforged, force.

GW said "Forge the Narrative". This means "we are too lazy to write a comprehensive and balanced rule set, just make something up to plug the gaps" - Ch 4, Page 13387 of the Lexicanus Bullshitticus Translatorum. 
   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon






Easiest fix for the Inquisition? Remove them from the game and release more variation of armies and models rather than more Imperial junk.

That, or make the Inquisition the first 'Primaris only' Imperial faction.
   
Made in dk
Longtime Dakkanaut




Just remove inquisition from the game. The game does not need another pointless half-assed imperium faction. Or just roll deathwatch, inquisition, and grey knights together and call it the Imperial Buffet Faction.
   
Made in us
Missionary On A Mission



Eastern VA

To me, the entire point of Inquisition, as a force, is that they're weird. They're not a large force with blobs of disciplined infantry backed up by tanks - that's the Imperial Guard. They're not a super-elite force of one-man-armies - that's the Astartes (though the crunch doesn't reflect the fluff, but hey). They're not wielders of faith-based miracles - that's the Sororitas.

No, what the Inquisition is all about, from a tabletop army perspective, is oddness. They somewhat lack synergy, and they should lack synergy in some respects. They have things other Imperials wouldn't use because it's xenos tech, or it's daemonic, or it's too hard to keep supplied in a large campaign. They should have specialists, almost on the level of Eldar. Their generalists should be more pick-a-specialty than actual jack-of-all-trades units - look at how Acolytes worked in 6/7e for an example. Those weren't perfect, since the costs were all wrong, but the idea was solid - they're just basic guys, but they can take all kinds of funky wargear to tool up for whatever problem you really need them to solve, augmented by psykers or Jokaero weaponsmiths at the squad level.

Inquisitors also have the power to requisition other Imperial forces. So, how do you do that without just making more soup? Well, maybe give an inquisitor a buff, based on their Ordo, that applies to a single unit of another faction. Make it a big buff, but only applicable to one unit (plus maybe one dedicated transport per unit). For example, an Ordo Xenos inquisitor could add a single Deathwatch unit to their detachment, give it the Ordo Xenos keyword, and give it some kind of big buff - but if you want to buff another Deathwatch unit, you'll need another Inquisitor.

As for the Inquisitors themselves, go with weird wargear on fairly glassy guys. Don't try to make them combat monsters as a general rule - leave that up to the Space Marines, they do it better. But by the same token, they're not individually useless guys that just give orders to their troops, like Guard officers. Maybe a set of mutually exclusive options to let them pick how they operate, but that'd be hard to balance.

Long story short, make Inquisition all about bringing the right tool for the job and having a big, weird toolbox.

~4500 -- ~4000 -- ~2000 -- ~5000 -- ~5000 -- ~4000 
   
Made in us
Walking Dead Wraithlord






I'm with Pismakron.

Most of the small and specialized Imperium forces need to be compiled into a proper Imperial Agents codex and call it a day. Inquisition may get hammered in whatever Codex they come in, because they don't even have a real proper miniature line, etc.

 
   
Made in us
Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





I've said before that they should roll many of the smaller factions into a single faction. Deathwatch, Inquisition, GK, sisters of silence, custodes assassins. I think a lot of these forces would function better under a unified banner where they could be specialized units in an overall faction rather than specialized factions.
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Havoc with Blastmaster





Denver, CO

Okay, so jade_angel is in agreement with me, Freakshow is kinda their schtick.

I also, generally agree with rolling the minor Imperial Agents/Power Armoured factions into 1 book. But that doesn't really address fixing the mechanics and units to create a playable faction.

U02dah4 made some excellent points as to why Acolytes should remain at 3 wounds per model (his explaination is on the 3rd page of the thread in Tactics, about half way down) and I agree.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This line of reasoning broke 7th edition in Fantasy. The books should be as equal as possible, even a theoretical "Codex: Squirrels with Crustacean allies" should have a fair chance to beat "Codex: God".

 Redbeard wrote:

- Cost? FW models cost more? Because Thudd guns are more expensive than Wraithknights and Riptides. Nope, not a good argument. This is an expensive game. We play it knowing that, and also knowing that, realistically, it's cheaper than hookers and blow.
 
   
Made in au
Deadly Dark Eldar Warrior





In several threads around the release of 8th, people complained about a blandness. More recently we had a thread wherein I postulated that 40k would be improved by stronger theming for how each army plays; I think that’s the same point you’re making here. [i will link the thread later; I’m on my phone.] I don’t think your complaint can be addressed without identifying themes for each army.

In that thread someone identified that one challenge to creating and maintaining strong themes is the availability of “soup”. Soup destroys themes by allowing armies to fill gaps and multiply their strengths. Keep in mind that soup exists for sales reasons, so the rules need to continue allowing it. My suggested way of facilitating both goals was to put a flat percentage points tax (e.g. 10%) on any unit chosen from a secondary codex (where primary is determined by some sane mechanism; probably the codex that the warlord is from.) With this solution the sales guys are happy because you can field whatever you like, and the rules guys have any easier job balancing codex Vs. codex, knowing that choosing units from outside of the primary will be inefficient automatically.

In this fantasy, where I get to set a theme for Inquisition, the theme would be that they uniquely get to choose units from other imperium codexes either with no tax, or with a discounted tax. Hence they become the only soup army by design. To add to that, they would have a bunch of specialists in their codex - but an assassin can’t fight a war for you, so I’d make it so they materially had to soup-up to be effective.

Edit: thread to which I was referring: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/742031.page

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/12/29 12:42:35


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Bird from Hell






How to fix the inquisition: delete them from the game entirely. The inquisition is about sneaking around uncovering plots and executing heretics, it has zero relevance on a battlefield. Save the inquisition for the RPGs where they belong and can be done right.

Laying low in a blood filled trench
Kill time 'til my very own death
On my face I can feel the falling rain
Never see my friends again

In the smoke, in the mud and lead
Smell the fear and the feeling of dread
Soon be time to go over the wall
Rapid fire and end of us all


SELL ME YOUR FORGEWORLD ATLAS 
   
Made in fi
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






I'm pretty shocked by the amount of people who want to delete one of the most flavourful factions of the game.

That being said; I don't think Inquisition needs to be a working faction on their own (beyond small games anyway.) Inquisitors have power to take command of other imperial forces, so any larger Inquisition army will naturally contain elements from other imperial armies.

I think Inquisition should be a small faction with bunch of flavourful units. It should be designed to work as an ally to other imperial factions. There should be a lot of customisation, this is faction for hobbyists. They should have access to basically every imperial weapon in existence. The IG codex already showed a bunch of kitbashed regiments, and Inquisitors and their acolytes could work in the same way. With all these new Necromunda models coming, there will be more options for normal human sized plastic models than ever before.

Game wise Inquisitors should offer some benefits for Imperial armies they join (They have the leadership bubble, but they need more.) If these benefits end up being powerful, it is fine, just give the inquisitors appropriate point cost. Inquisitors currently are too weak and too cheap; these are rare and powerful individuals, and that should be reflected in the game. Inquisitors should not be just cheap, spammable smite machines.

Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. 
   
Made in gb
Instigating Incubi




The dark behind the eyes.

 Elbows wrote:
I'm with Pismakron.

Most of the small and specialized Imperium forces need to be compiled into a proper Imperial Agents codex and call it a day. Inquisition may get hammered in whatever Codex they come in, because they don't even have a real proper miniature line, etc.


This.

The main problem with Inquisition is that they're not a full army, nor were they supposed to be.

At the very least, they need to be able to take some IG, SoB and/or GK stuff (without losing any faction bonuses they might get).

In terms of other issues:

- Daemonhosts are a nice idea, but really botched in their execution. You've got these individual models that are not characters and nowhere near resilient enough to survive enemy fire. Also, they have just 2 attacks and poor WS and BS. I think they need to be made into more expensive characters with better stats, more wounds etc. and either less-random powers or powers that aren't random at all. I mean, do they really need a ~2/3 chance of getting a useless power each turn?

- Weaponsmiths have okay shooting, but they're T3 models with 3 wounds and 5++ saves. It seems like they need to be able to join units of Acolytes or such - so that they can't be individually targeted.

- Acolytes really need to be cheaper (5-6pts at most).

Akiasura wrote:
I hate to sound like a serial killer, but I'll be reaching for my friend occam's razor yet again.
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

"Prepare to open fire at that towering Wraithknight!"
"ARE YOU DAFT MAN!?! YOU MIGHT HIT THE MEN WHO COME UP TO ITS ANKLES!!!"



 insaniak wrote:

You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.

Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Bird from Hell






 Crimson wrote:
I'm pretty shocked by the amount of people who want to delete one of the most flavourful factions of the game.


They may be "flavorful", but their flavor is a complete mismatch for the battlefield combat of 40k. They should 100% remain in the fluff, and in games where they are appropriate, but they don't belong in this game.

Laying low in a blood filled trench
Kill time 'til my very own death
On my face I can feel the falling rain
Never see my friends again

In the smoke, in the mud and lead
Smell the fear and the feeling of dread
Soon be time to go over the wall
Rapid fire and end of us all


SELL ME YOUR FORGEWORLD ATLAS 
   
Made in gb
Sagitarius with a Big F'in Gun




UK

After many years of absence from 40k, it looks to me like the scale of the game has moved on from Inquisition warbands. It seems a shame to remove them from the game, but without a big rework and new units, I don't see how you make them work without Imperial Souping them or playing 500 point games.

On the other hand, they work well for fluffy narrative campaigns, so ceasing the line completely seems premature.

Imperial Soup
2200pts/1750 painted
2800pts/1200 painted
2200pts/650 painted
217pts/151 painted 
   
Made in fi
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






 Peregrine wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
I'm pretty shocked by the amount of people who want to delete one of the most flavourful factions of the game.


They may be "flavorful", but their flavor is a complete mismatch for the battlefield combat of 40k. They should 100% remain in the fluff, and in games where they are appropriate, but they don't belong in this game.
Some would say the same about your beloved super heavy tanks.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
phillv85 wrote:
After many years of absence from 40k, it looks to me like the scale of the game has moved on from Inquisition warbands. It seems a shame to remove them from the game, but without a big rework and new units, I don't see how you make them work without Imperial Souping them or playing 500 point games.

On the other hand, they work well for fluffy narrative campaigns, so ceasing the line completely seems premature.
Why would they need to work without the imperial soup? Fluffwise inquisitorial taskforce is probably the most logical explanation for such a soup army. I think Inquisitors should be explicitly designed to work as the leaders of mixed imperial forces.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/29 13:24:18


Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Bird from Hell






 Crimson wrote:
Some would say the same about your beloved super heavy tanks.


They would be wrong, given the clearly established direction of 40k where the game is all about massive vehicles and god-like characters. Mechanically and thematically a Baneblade is no different from a squadron of LRBTs, a unit which has been in the core game since way back in 5th edition (and present as single-tank units much earlier). You can argue about them from a balance point of view, but a pitched battle between hundreds of infantry, whole squadrons of tanks, etc, is exactly the sort of place in the 40k fluff where you'd expect to find a Baneblade. The same is not true of the inquisition. Forget the game mechanics, from a fluff point of view they should never be present on the kind of battlefield that a 40k game represents. They should be sneaking around investigating stuff and executing suspected traitors/tainted psykers/etc, not forming up whole armies and engaging in a frontal assault against an enemy army.

Laying low in a blood filled trench
Kill time 'til my very own death
On my face I can feel the falling rain
Never see my friends again

In the smoke, in the mud and lead
Smell the fear and the feeling of dread
Soon be time to go over the wall
Rapid fire and end of us all


SELL ME YOUR FORGEWORLD ATLAS 
   
Made in fi
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






 Peregrine wrote:

They would be wrong, given the clearly established direction of 40k where the game is all about massive vehicles and god-like characters. Mechanically and thematically a Baneblade is no different from a squadron of LRBTs, a unit which has been in the core game since way back in 5th edition (and present as single-tank units much earlier). You can argue about them from a balance point of view, but a pitched battle between hundreds of infantry, whole squadrons of tanks, etc, is exactly the sort of place in the 40k fluff where you'd expect to find a Baneblade. The same is not true of the inquisition. Forget the game mechanics, from a fluff point of view they should never be present on the kind of battlefield that a 40k game represents. They should be sneaking around investigating stuff and executing suspected traitors/tainted psykers/etc, not forming up whole armies and engaging in a frontal assault against an enemy army.

I actually agree with you about the tanks, but you're completely wrong about the Inquisitors. Sure, they indeed sneak and investigate, but they also commandeer imperial armies when needed. Inquisitor lead armies and task forces are certainly a thing in the fluff.

Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Bird from Hell






 Crimson wrote:
I actually agree with you about the tanks, but you're completely wrong about the Inquisitors. Sure, they indeed sneak and investigate, but they also commandeer imperial armies when needed. Inquisitor lead armies and task forces are certainly a thing in the fluff.


But then you're talking about the really boring situation of an inquisitor sitting in the back issuing orders. Rules-wise that's an IG officer or space marine captain or whatever with an inquisitor model, they don't need a whole faction for that. Giving the inquisition it's own rules is only relevant when you want to do stuff like having an inquisitor leading a whole army of "weird inquisition stuff" onto the battlefield.

Laying low in a blood filled trench
Kill time 'til my very own death
On my face I can feel the falling rain
Never see my friends again

In the smoke, in the mud and lead
Smell the fear and the feeling of dread
Soon be time to go over the wall
Rapid fire and end of us all


SELL ME YOUR FORGEWORLD ATLAS 
   
Made in fi
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






 Peregrine wrote:

But then you're talking about the really boring situation of an inquisitor sitting in the back issuing orders. Rules-wise that's an IG officer or space marine captain or whatever with an inquisitor model, they don't need a whole faction for that. Giving the inquisition it's own rules is only relevant when you want to do stuff like having an inquisitor leading a whole army of "weird inquisition stuff" onto the battlefield.

And there really doesn't need to be seven thousand different IG tanks with their own rules, yet there are. Commissar has different rules than a Company Commander or a Tech-priest Dominus, and sure as hell Inquisitor should have their own rules as well. And of course even is such a commandeered army the inquisitor would probably bring along his trusted retinue of weirdos, they just would not make up the entire army.

Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. 
   
Made in us
Liberated Grot Land Raida




Inquisition currently consists of Inquisitors, "A guardsman but bad", a weird monkey, and a man tied to a pole.

I personally think all the "weirdo imperial" armies should have a list of factions that they're compatible with, where you can sub them into the detachments and you don't lose subfaction benefits. Then just give whatever special rules they would get directly to the models.

I'd apply this to Inquisiton, SOS, Adeptus Custodians and Assassins alike.

For example: Ordo Xenos units (Inquisitor, Jokaero) can go in Deathwatch or Astra Militarum detachments

Assassins can go in Astra Militarum and all Astartes detachments with a few exceptions like Culexus in GK, etc.

SoS can go in non-psychic astartes detachments, Astra Militarum, SoB.

Etc, etc. Don't leave them as tiny weird factions, don't shoehorn them all into an "imperial weirdos" faction where you have to take SOS as your infantry, Inquisitors as your HQs and Custodians as your heavy supports or whatever. Just give them rules to add to certain detachments without losing you benefits (obviously you don't gain them for the Imperial Agents you add in but they act like Regimental Advisors or Auxiliaries etc) and then any stratagems or whatever you'd give them, just do so.
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut





Peregrine wrote:They may be "flavorful", but their flavor is a complete mismatch for the battlefield combat of 40k. They should 100% remain in the fluff, and in games where they are appropriate, but they don't belong in this game.


Not every game is some 2500 point battle with a 100+ miniatures per side. Loads of people play 500, 750 or 1000 point games and an inquisitor and some other stuff like that fit perfectly. Not only that, 8th edition works really well in smaller games, just like Age of Sigmar. And I would argue that it fits in larger games as well, which you address below:

Peregrine wrote:
But then you're talking about the really boring situation of an inquisitor sitting in the back issuing orders. Rules-wise that's an IG officer or space marine captain or whatever with an inquisitor model, they don't need a whole faction for that. Giving the inquisition it's own rules is only relevant when you want to do stuff like having an inquisitor leading a whole army of "weird inquisition stuff" onto the battlefield.


In the fiction the inquisitor leading an attack is often at the forefront of the action. Like when Eisenhorn is leading guardsmen and space marines and fending off hordes of mind controlled imperial citizens while trying to figure out a way into a shielded noble estate.

The way forward is not to remove them, but to adjust them so they are not the list of units you try to fill a detachment with. if they just gave them rules that says that their inclusion in detachments doesn't count towards what faction the detachment is and then a bit of a points adjustment and some relics and stratagems of their own and they'd work fine. Anyone who wants to run a 3rd ed style Inquisitor + Inquisitorial Stormtroopers + tanks + weird stuff could do so while still getting the full menu of interesting options that the Astra Militarum codex provides.

What they don't need to be is a stand alone full codex army that can fill detachments without going to another book. They should be an add on like assassins. in fact, a single Codex of add on type units would make the most sense.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/29 17:32:44


Current painting project: Mixed nurgle 40k army
Current terrain project: DIY Zone Mortalis terrain
Current rules project: 40k Skirmish 
   
Made in us
Sister Vastly Superior




Tacoma, WA, USA

We can talk about the appropiate rule specifically for Inquistors and their associated units until the 42nd Milliemum. As for getting them on the battlefield I think we need a simple rule added to the various Inquistors:

Inquistorial Mandate: If this model is the only model with Inquistorial Mandate in the detachment, this unit and all INQUISTION units in this detachment are not included when determining the type of detachment. For this rule to be in effect, all ORDO units in the detachment must have the same ORDO as the Inquistor.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/29 16:29:29


 
   
Made in gb
Instigating Incubi




The dark behind the eyes.

 alextroy wrote:
We can talk about the appropiate rule specifically for Inquistors and their associated units until the 42nd Milliemum. As for getting them on the battlefield I think we need a simple rule added to the various Inquistors:

Inquistorial Mandate: If this model is the only model with Inquistorial Mandate in the detachment, this unit and all INQUISTION units in this detachment are not included when determining the type of detachment. For this rule to be in effect, all ORDO units in the detachment must have the same ORDO as the Inquistor.


I'd suggest that that model also has to be your Warlord.

Akiasura wrote:
I hate to sound like a serial killer, but I'll be reaching for my friend occam's razor yet again.
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

"Prepare to open fire at that towering Wraithknight!"
"ARE YOU DAFT MAN!?! YOU MIGHT HIT THE MEN WHO COME UP TO ITS ANKLES!!!"



 insaniak wrote:

You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.

Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
 
   
Made in us
Sister Vastly Superior




Tacoma, WA, USA

I considered that, but also thought that the Inquistor can make the forces go somewhere without needing to take overall command of the forces, like and Inquistorial Commisar of sorts:

"Colonel, you will move your battalion into this valley and engage the enemy. I will accompany you."
   
Made in gb
Posts with Authority




Right Behind You

 Crimson wrote:
 Peregrine wrote:

But then you're talking about the really boring situation of an inquisitor sitting in the back issuing orders. Rules-wise that's an IG officer or space marine captain or whatever with an inquisitor model, they don't need a whole faction for that. Giving the inquisition it's own rules is only relevant when you want to do stuff like having an inquisitor leading a whole army of "weird inquisition stuff" onto the battlefield.

And there really doesn't need to be seven thousand different IG tanks with their own rules, yet there are. Commissar has different rules than a Company Commander or a Tech-priest Dominus, and sure as hell Inquisitor should have their own rules as well. And of course even is such a commandeered army the inquisitor would probably bring along his trusted retinue of weirdos, they just would not make up the entire army.
Which isn't badly represented right now.

Tell me, what would YOU add?

Also, sorry, 7000 tanks? Firstly, that's an extreme exaggeration compared to what's happened to Space Marines, and secondly, for the Imperial Guard, it makes absolute sense. If any faction should be dripping in variety, it's the Imperial Guard.

I've got no issue with the Inquisition being a SMALL army, such as a lone Inquisitor and their retinue supplementing a full army, but I disagree that they should be a full army on their own right. They should practically NEED to be allied in to someone else - like the Sisters of Silence or Custodes or the Imperial Psykers.

I can see Peregrine's point: flavourful Inquisitorial forces are best suited to Necromunda-scale games. That's not to say that they can't be taken in full scale 40k games, but expecting them to be able to be a fully fledged army in a 2000 point game is absurd.

Personally, my fix would be giving the Inquisitor access to all manner of weird and wacky unique items, and some massive command/buff effects - perhaps influencing Strategems and Command Points in some way. Their acolytes should be able to similarly be upgraded in both armour, weaponry, and minor +1 stat upgrades for the whole unit (and should probably be limited to 1 per Inquisitor). Daemonhosts could be nasty, customisable like a 7th ed C'Tan, perhaps. Crusaders and DCAs seem fine as what they are. Nothing massive, but enough to create a retinue, which is all an Inquisitor needs to bring to an all-out battle.

So, really what would your fix be?

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
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Made in fi
Librarian with Freaky Familiar






 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

I've got no issue with the Inquisition being a SMALL army, such as a lone Inquisitor and their retinue supplementing a full army, but I disagree that they should be a full army on their own right. They should practically NEED to be allied in to someone else - like the Sisters of Silence or Custodes or the Imperial Psykers.

I can see Peregrine's point: flavourful Inquisitorial forces are best suited to Necromunda-scale games. That's not to say that they can't be taken in full scale 40k games, but expecting them to be able to be a fully fledged army in a 2000 point game is absurd.

Personally, my fix would be giving the Inquisitor access to all manner of weird and wacky unique items, and some massive command/buff effects - perhaps influencing Strategems and Command Points in some way. Their acolytes should be able to similarly be upgraded in both armour, weaponry, and minor +1 stat upgrades for the whole unit (and should probably be limited to 1 per Inquisitor). Daemonhosts could be nasty, customisable like a 7th ed C'Tan, perhaps. Crusaders and DCAs seem fine as what they are. Nothing massive, but enough to create a retinue, which is all an Inquisitor needs to bring to an all-out battle.

So, really what would your fix be?


Your suggestions sound good. I already said I don't need them to be a full army beyond small games. They need a lot of customisation options just like you suggested and they need an ability to be easily fielded either in their own mini detachments (without costing command points) or being integrated into imperial sub faction detachments without breaking the army bonuses. They also should bring buffs for their allies, this can be in form of stratagems that can be used on other imperial units. So basically we agree.

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How to fix inquisition:

Inquisitors get access to a 3+ and an invuln through upgrades.

Dominate works on single models

Fix prices for more inquisitorial gear like force swords.

Acolytes get either 2 wounds a 3+ be or cost 5-6 points.

Inquisitions can be an HQ in any imperial army without affecting
requirements for key words. You could still be a Cadia detachment with an inquisitor.

Monkies get character key word

Inquisitiors get a 2+ in CC and shooting.

Terminator armor is avalible for all inquisitor types.

Make the -1 leadership and +1 leadership spells auras.

Make it so using the inquisitor leadership only happens if your leadership is lower.

Give angry chair his ability to blow up his own men and those close to said men.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/29 18:15:04


 
   
Made in us
Calm Celestian






Make the different types of Inquisitors part of the Imperial armies that they would usually attach themselves. Allow Ordo Hereticus Inquisitors to be part of the SoB list as an HQ with an Elite bodyguard type unit appropriate to the Ordo. Xenos Inquisitors to Deathwatch, Malleus to the Grey Knights. They would be themed by being available to the armies they associate with. If you wanted an I quisitir to join your Space Space Marines, field a detachment of that army with an Inquisitor in it.

Inquisition are interesting, but they don't need to be stand alone where we are creating an entirely seperate army to get them on the table top.

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