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Hey,
I'm planning on trying this list next in a semi-competitive environment. Does it feel viable enough or is there any big flaws that jump right out? I was considering between 2x thunder hammers and 2x swords with the DC blob, but somehow I find that four power swords with 2 fists have more flexible damage output with the same points. Power swords with red thirst can penetrate and it's 8 power sword attacks more. Mephy gets wings, rage and quickening.

Is the balance between the chaff vs. Armour good? Plasma cannon is there for the signum overheat denial.

Thoughts?


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [37 PL, 689pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Gametype: Matched

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback [5 PL, 116pts]: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback [5 PL, 120pts]: Twin lascannon

+ HQ +

Captain [6 PL, 123pts]: Inferno pistol, Jump Pack, Thunder hammer

Chief Librarian Mephiston [8 PL, 145pts]: Sanguinary Discipline, Smite

+ Troops +

Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Tactical Squad [5 PL, 75pts]
. 3x Space Marine
. Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy bolter
. Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol and boltgun

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [29 PL, 552pts] ++

+ Heavy Support +

Baal Predator [8 PL, 166pts]: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon
. Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

Devastator Squad [8 PL, 141pts]: Armorium Cherub
. Space Marine: Plasma cannon
. Space Marine: Lascannon
. Space Marine: Lascannon
. Space Marine: Boltgun
. Space Marine Sergeant: Boltgun

Predator [9 PL, 182pts]: Predator autocannon
. Two lascannons: 2x Lascannon

+ HQ +

Lieutenants [4 PL, 63pts]
. Lieutenant: Chainsword, Master-crafted boltgun

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [61 PL, 759pts] ++

+ HQ +

Astorath [8 PL, 143pts]

+ Elites +

Death Company [27 PL, 260pts]: Jump Pack
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power fist
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power fist
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power sword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power sword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power sword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power sword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword

Sanguinary Ancient [6 PL, 99pts]: 3. Soulwarden, Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword, Standard of Sacrifice, Warlord

Sanguinary Guard [20 PL, 257pts]
. Sanguinary Guard: Inferno pistol, Power fist
. Sanguinary Guard: Inferno pistol, Power fist
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword

++ Total: [127 PL, 2000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

Well, as a semi-competitive list it is fine.
I think that BA can put only semi-competitive lists on the table.
In a competitive setting its only low-tier.
If you want a more competitive army, then ally with AM.

So,
as for mono-BA list that's solid all-comers list?

But, if I want to make it better I just need allies. Sniff, I prefer mono-builds more.

IMO, Tac squads are pointless in BA lists, Scouts can fill same role cheaper. I also prefer Lemmy to Astro for DC, you can get Astros No Fear ability for a Warlord Trait, say on a Sang Priest Warlord for example...

Also think you'd be better going for Brigade, drop the Razorbacks (or a Razorback and the LT's), get attack bikes for FA.

I don't do index, so JP sang priest is excluded. Looking at my FA choices, I only got bikes and assault squads. Couple melta assault squads and a attack bike could do, but I still would need to get three more troop choices.

I got both Lemmy and Astorath, but Astorath is also a beast and I can use the SG ancient as the warlord to buff the SG blob on a hopefully different flank and target. I've discovered that Forlon's "Fury" is better used as a distraction to force your opponent to deploy his units to answer a possible free move for the DC. In some games you don't really need to use the stratagem at all.

Maybe the gunline is too much to be a all comers, I could skip that and drop a razor and a predator for another batallion to get 10CP. Hmm.

Tac squads are a way to bring more lascannons to the party. That's not trivial. Plus they are cheaper 2+ saves in cover than camo scouts.

For fast attack I like scout bikes. They have great mobility, put out a lot of dakka, and are fairly cheap compared to everything else. They are great for clearing out chaff before you're DC/SG DS and can grab objectives later. I also like to use scouts with melee weapons over boltguns to take advantage of red thirst. I like devastator squads but considering that captain can pretty much take out a baneblade by himself, i like to take 3 dev squads with 1 ML/HB in each for the hellfire/flakk missile strat. It lets you throw some mortel wounds down range and helps deal with pesky things like mortarion. It also free's up points for more DC/SG to field.

Using scout bikes, scouts, and devs like that you can get a brigade BA detachment that's pretty effective for those sweat ass CP which they need imo. Also, I like lemartes over astorath to. He just buffs the DC a lot better with rerolls and what not. Also, if you can find a way to work in Sanguinor he really helps out the DC. At that point I usually take 1-2 TH. They have 4 attacks on the charge rerolling to hit and wound pretty much everything in the game on 2+ for a flat 3 damage. They hurt a lot. If you have that LT a JP to stack near them even better. I still throw in a couple power fist to.

Just food for thought though. As far as semi-competitive I think this is fine.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And not sure what relic you plan to use but throwing the wings on the captain is my favorite. Reroll charges and denying overwatch is awesome.

Thanks for feedback!

Sadly I don't own any scout bikes, but that's not really an issue. I've been struggling to create a mono-BA brigade with BA punch and still struggling even with not-yet-owned scout bikes. I take your suggestions and I pulled something like this, but I still think it starts lacking real punch, isn't the 8-10CP you get from a double batallion and vanguard or batallion with vanguard and spearhead enough. I feel like I lose the punch after I force a brigade. FW stuff is not an option. My gaming group has restricted it.

Anyways, did I understood your thoughts and do you agree it lacks the punch the above less CP'd lists have?

Brigade 2000

HQ

Mephiston
Sanguinor
Lemartes

TROOP

4x 5man scout squad (combat knives)
2x 5man tactical squad with lascannon

ELITE

11man death company with jump packs + 2x fist + 4x sword + 1x axe + 4x chainsword + 11x boltgun
6man sanguinary guard + 2x fist & inferno pistol + 4x encarmine sword & angelus boltgun
Sanguinary ancient

FAST

3x 3man scout bikers

HEAVY

2x 5man devastator squad with cherub + 1x plasma cannon + 1x lascannon
5man devastator squad with cherub +1x missile launcher + 1x heavy bolter

Somehow I still feel that double batallion with a vanguard and couple razorbacks is better than the brigade, atleast in my mind, haven't tested so can't really tell

Or am I doing the brigade totally wrong.

I think you got the gist of it. To me it's not so much that it lacks less punch than you are relying more on CC which is were the BA excel. Also, the second list will give you a lot more board control compared to the first with the scouts being able to move out of the deployment zone during deployment and into a good position to move up and clear screens with bolters/shotguns. This has the added advantage of helping keep alpha striking stuff coming in from reserve and hitting your backfield if you space it properly. They are also a lot easier to keep in cover than a predator.

Captain - inferno pistol, jp, th (Angel's Wings or Hammer of Baal and Artisan of War warlord trait (+1 dmg to weapon) - 123 pts
Lemartes - 129 pts
The Sanguinor - 170

3 x Scouts with ccw - 165 pts
3 x Scouts with Boltguns - 165 pts

15 x DC - JP, 3 PF -336 pts
15 x DC - JP, 3 PF - 336 pts
2 x Company Vets - 1 power sword, JP -61 pts

3 x Scout Bikes - 100 pts
3 x Scout Bikes - 100 pts
3 x Scout Bikes - 75 pts

Devastators - 2 x HB - 85 pts
Devastators - 2 x ML - 90 pts
Devastators - 1 x ML - 90 pts

2000 pts/ 12 CP

This is the list I was looking at building. It also has some back up chaff/at in the ML's since they can do both decently and offer more versatility than a predator imo. Also, by spreading stuff out with redundent units it makes it harder for your opponent to focus fire down/lock in combat something like a predator or a razorback. This was the early stages of the list I was working on. Some tweaks I've made are replacing some of the PF in the DC squads with TH and giving the scout bikes shotguns. The pro to taking large blobs of DC like this is that it's easier to take advantages of strats. Downside is moral becomes an issue. To me though, they likely won't live long after their initial charge anyways or will be so worn down they won't be very effective. I'm still play testing this though. But, I will say that this list also reflect how I want to play BA and you may not enjoy it so take it all with a grain of salt. Just throwing it out there in case you like it. If you want, I'll post the refined list later. Cheers!

I would gladly see your ready list when you a happy with it.

I like lascannons for the punch so what about a compromise, the following list would have 10CP to spend on and would have couple lascannons. I have also Lemartes, but Astorath helps with the morale. These models I actually have so I wouldn't need to purchase anything. So, the question is which list you prefer, the initial in the post or the latter? Purchasing three boxes of scout bikes isn't really an issue, painting bikes is more of an issue I hate to paint bikes.. Even DA ravenwing with all the primer colour, it's still painful.


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [42 PL, 821pts] ++

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback [5 PL, 116pts]: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback [5 PL, 120pts]: Twin lascannon

+ HQ +

Chief Librarian Mephiston [8 PL, 145pts]: Sanguinary Discipline, Smite

The Sanguinor [9 PL, 170pts]

+ Troops +

Tactical Squad [5 PL, 90pts]
. 3x Space Marine
. Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Missile launcher
. Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad [5 PL, 90pts]
. 3x Space Marine
. Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Lascannon
. Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad [5 PL, 90pts]
. 3x Space Marine
. Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Lascannon
. Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol and boltgun

++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [23 PL, 371pts] ++

+ HQ +

Captain [6 PL, 123pts]: Inferno pistol, Jump Pack, Thunder hammer

Lieutenants [4 PL, 63pts]
. Lieutenant: Chainsword, Master-crafted boltgun

+ Troops +

Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout: Boltgun
. Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Tactical Squad [5 PL, 75pts]
. 3x Space Marine
. Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy bolter
. Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol and boltgun

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [61 PL, 808pts] ++

+ HQ +

Astorath [8 PL, 143pts]

+ Elites +

Death Company [27 PL, 309pts]: Jump Pack
. Death Company Marine: Thunder hammer
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power fist
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power fist
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power axe
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Power sword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword

Sanguinary Ancient [6 PL, 99pts]: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword

Sanguinary Guard [20 PL, 257pts]
. Sanguinary Guard: Inferno pistol, Power fist
. Sanguinary Guard: Inferno pistol, Power fist
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword
. Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Encarmine sword

++ Total: [126 PL, 2000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

I definitely like this second list. I feel like it's a good mix.

And i'm right there with you. I play DA and have to be in a mood to paint their bikes haha. I still have 2 attack bikes I just can't make myself finish. Also, there's a blood angels group on facebook that has a lot of good incite on list for BA. This list was posted on there that is going to LVO that seems similar to what you want to do. I just saw it and actually like it more than the one I was working on haha.

++ Brigade Detachment +9CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [137 PL, 2000pts] ++

+ HQ +

Captain [6 PL, 129pts]: Jump Pack, Storm shield, Thunder hammer, Warlord

Brother Corbulo [5 PL, 94pts]

Lemartes [7 PL, 129pts]

+ Troops +

5x Scout Squad [4 PL, 59pts]: Combat knife, Bolt pistol, Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Power sword

5x Scout Squad [4 PL, 59pts]: Combat knife, Bolt pistol, Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Power sword

5x Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]: Boltgun, Bolt pistol

5x Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts] Shot gun, Bolt pistol

5x Tactical Squad [5 PL, 65pts] Bolt pistol and boltgun

5x Tactical Squad [5 PL, 65pts] Bolt pistol and boltgun

+ Fast Attack +

3x Inceptor Squad [10 PL, 135pts]: 2x Assault bolter

3x Inceptor Squad [10 PL, 135pts]: 2x Assault bolter

3x Scout Bike Squad [4 PL, 75pts] Twin boltgun, Shot gun, Combat knife, Bolt pistol

+ Elites +

Company Ancient [4 PL, 65pts]: Relic Standard of Sacrifice, Storm bolter

10x Death Company [18 PL, 224pts]: Jump Pack, Thunder hammer, 2x Power sword, Boltgun, 7x Chainsword, Boltgun

6x Sanguinary Guard [20 PL, 210pts] 2x Angelus boltgun, Power fist, 4x Encarmine sword

+ Heavy Support +

6x Devastator Squad [11 PL, 168pts]: Armorium Cherub,
3x Missile launcher, Heavy bolter, Boltgun, Bolt pistol

6x Devastator Squad [11 PL, 183pts]: Armorium Cherub, 4x Lascannon, Boltgun,
Bolt pistol

Whirlwind [5 PL, 95pts]: Whirlwind castellan launcher
++ Total: [137 PL, 2000pts] ++