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So I have a unit of the quick-build aggressors and the datasheet mentions that by default each model has two weapons; a boltstorm gauntlets weapon and a fragstorm grenade launcher. The sheet says you can (for the usual number of points) upgrade them by replacing the Boltstorm Gauntlets and Fragstorm grenade launcher with flamestorm gauntlets. Unfortunatly I can't determine if its one or two gauntlets that I receive. Context seems all over the place.

Might be One:
The weapon profile is already plural (flamestorm gauntlets)
Doesn't say 'two flamestorm gauntlets'
Inceptors, [do] say '2x Plasma Exterminators' in their swap text

Might be Two:
You are swapping two weapons
Swap text is in plural
Doesn't say 'one flamestorm gauntlets'
Inceptors, [do] say '2x Plasma Exterminators' in their swap text

Anyone know how this should work?

Flamestorm Gauntlets are always a paired weapon (i.e., two gauntlets is a single weapon).

 Ghaz wrote:
Flamestorm Gauntlets are always a paired weapon (i.e., two gauntlets is a single weapon).

Correct.It's just a single weapon that is called "Flamestorm gauntlets", just like how "Siege Drills" are a single weapon.

Your "might be two" has the logic backwards.

It is that it does not say: exchange for 2 flamestorm guantlets. That matters here.

Flamestorm guantlets is the weapon that you are exchanging for the auto boltstorm guantlets(and un-associated fragstorm launcher; which is the bit on the back).

Both arms combine into 1 weapon system.

The fact that you are giving up 2 separate weapons for the single flamestorm does matter at all.

Think of it this way: Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets and Fragstorm Grenade Launcher is a set of equipments, much like Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield.

Its not that you're replacing [Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets] and [Fragstorm Grenade Launcher], but instead replacing [Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets and Fragstorm Grenade Launcher]


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Flamestorm guantlets is the weapon that you are exchanging for the auto boltstorm guantlets(and un-associated fragstorm launcher; which is the bit on the back).

Both arms combine into 1 weapon system.

The fact that you are giving up 2 separate weapons for the single flamestorm does matter at all.

This is incorrect.

Each Aggressor is "armed with auto boltstorm gaunlets and a fragstorm grnade launcher" and as per wargear options, it allows you to "replace their auto boltstorm gaunlets and fragstorm grenade launcher with flamestorm gaunlets."

The key here is to read the sentence as:

replace their [auto boltstorm gaunlets and fragstorm grenade launcher] with [flamestorm gaunlets].

you're trading 18" Assault 6+d6 with 9" Assualt 2d6 auto hits.

Nothing that I said was incorrect.

The key here is to read the OPs question, and actually read my response.

OP stated that the model was both giving up 2 weapons, and that Flamestorm Guantlets were not written as 1 Flamestorm guantlets.

The logic on that is backwards; it could only be 2 Flamestorm Guantlets, if it was written as 2 Flamestorm Guantlets.

I then went on to explain both which bitz on the model are being exchanged, and did mention the Fragstorm Grenade Launchers as simply being lost unrelated to the Guantlets themselves.

I fully understand the ranges and number of shots involved; they mostly even out with the auto-hitting lower ranged.

Same as the 2 arms on the base model are a single instance of Auto Boltstorm Guantlets, the exchanged arms are a single instance of Flamestorm Guantlets. You just happen to also lose the Fragstorm in that exchange.

I see that you were only referring to the modeling standpoint.

My correction was only in reference to the "FG replaces ABG, and FGL is simply lost in the process" part.

ABG and FGL forms one wargear option comprised of multiple weapons. FG is the weapon that replaces the [ABG and FGL] weapon system.

Hi,

Sorry to drag up this month-old topic, but I was wondering which rule states that the auto-boltstorm gauntlets and fragstorm grenade launcher can all be fired together as one attack (resulting in 6 + D6 dice)? And if this is indeed how it's supposed to work, do all dice have to be rolled against the same target unit, or can the fire from the auto-boltstorm gauntlets and the fragstorm grenade launcher be split?

I'm sorry if this is a simple question - I have 8th edition for some time, but didn't actually get to play yet, so I might easily have missed this somewhere in my read-throughs :-).

Thanks, Zeus

ZeusEQ wrote:
Hi,

Sorry to drag up this month-old topic, but I was wondering which rule states that the auto-boltstorm gauntlets and fragstorm grenade launcher can all be fired together as one attack (resulting in 6 + D6 dice)? And if this is indeed how it's supposed to work, do all dice have to be rolled against the same target unit, or can the fire from the auto-boltstorm gauntlets and the fragstorm grenade launcher be split?

I'm sorry if this is a simple question - I have 8th edition for some time, but didn't actually get to play yet, so I might easily have missed this somewhere in my read-throughs :-).

Thanks, Zeus

There isn't one, it's a practical convention for speed. If firing them all at the same target the weapons have the same S, AP and damage, so you can roll all shots from both together without running into any issues.

Thanks for your quick reply! Actually, the part I don't get is not so much rolling the 2 attacks at once rather than separately - it's the fact that you roll 2 attacks at all, instead of choosing one weapon to fire. In the codex, the two weapons have separate stat lines, without any mention (as far as I can see) that they're somehow lnked or count as 1 weapon, and that you can fire both in the same shooting phase... what am I missing? I assume (hope ) that it's not the case that any model can always fire all of its weapons? So an Intercessor can fire both its bolt rifle and its bolt pistol every shooting phase?

It's in the main rule book which I don't have with me right now but any model can shoot all its weapons with the exception being pistols. But they have exceptions to the normal shooting rules aswell.

Thanks a lot guys, I'll look for this again in the section on shooting!

BRB page 179. or battle primer page 4

3. Choose Ranged Weapon
The weapons a model has are listed on its datasheet. If a model has several weapons, it can shoot all of them at the same target, or it can shoot each at a different enemy unit. Similarly, if a unit contains more than one model, they can shoot at the same, or different targets as you choose. In either case, declare how you will split the shooting unit’s shots before any dice are rolled, and resolve all the shots against one target before moving onto the next.

Emphasis mine.