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Two questions:

1) Does the Lhamean deal Mortal Wounds on a 4+ since it gets +2 to wound rolls and already inflicts MWs on a 6?

2) What is this thing good for? What about the other bodyguards? Are their ways to make them useful and/or are there situations where they're worth having?

 Kharneth wrote:
Two questions:

1) Does the Lhamean deal Mortal Wounds on a 4+ since it gets +2 to wound rolls and already inflicts MWs on a 6?

2) What is this thing good for? What about the other bodyguards? Are their ways to make them useful and/or are there situations where they're worth having?

1) No, it needs a 6+ on D6+2. Normally this means you would need to roll a 4 or more on the physical dice for it to trigger. Yes, this is pedantic but it DOES make a difference and it's a bad habit that almost everyone, myself included, fall into.

2) It rips apart heavy infantry and anything with an invulnerable save. What's that Gulliman you're T7 and have a 3++ do ya? NOT ANYMORE YOU DON'T! 3+ re-rolling to hit (with a +1 to hit on Turn 3+), wounding 5/6 of the time and Ignoring ALL Armour and Invulnerable saves on 3/6 of them AND INFLICTING THE NORMAL DAMAGE is frankly bananas. Not to mention it starts with 6+++ and just continues from there, because of Power From Pain.

The downside is that you're now limited to only 3 of them (Thanks GW for that stellar balance there!) and they haemorrhage VPs in certain missions due to being single model units that aren't all that durable. The 3 limit is the real kick in the teeth there. Even though they don't use any slots, they are still datasheets and not troops, thus the Organised Play limit everyone seems to take as gospel applies.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Kharneth wrote:
Two questions:

1) Does the Lhamean deal Mortal Wounds on a 4+ since it gets +2 to wound rolls and already inflicts MWs on a 6?

2) What is this thing good for? What about the other bodyguards? Are their ways to make them useful and/or are there situations where they're worth having?

1) No, it needs a 6+ on D6+2. Normally this means you would need to roll a 4 or more on the physical dice for it to trigger. Yes, this is pedantic but it DOES make a difference and it's a bad habit that almost everyone, myself included, fall into.

2) It rips apart heavy infantry and anything with an invulnerable save. What's that Gulliman you're T7 and have a 3++ do ya? NOT ANYMORE YOU DON'T! 3+ re-rolling to hit (with a +1 to hit on Turn 3+), wounding 5/6 of the time and Ignoring ALL Armour and Invulnerable saves on 3/6 of them AND INFLICTING THE NORMAL DAMAGE is frankly bananas. Not to mention it starts with 6+++ and just continues from there, because of Power From Pain.

The downside is that you're now limited to only 3 of them (Thanks GW for that stellar balance there!) and they haemorrhage VPs in certain missions due to being single model units that aren't all that durable.

Your answer confuses me. So, yes, it does inflict mortal wounds when the dice shows a 4, 5, or 6?

 Kharneth wrote:
Your answer confuses me. So, yes, it does inflict mortal wounds when the dice shows a 4, 5, or 6?

Correct. But it doesn't change the mortal wounds to happening on a 4+. That's a handy shortcut but not the correct way of doing it. You need a result of 6+, but instead of only rolling a D6, you roll D6+2, for a result between 3 and 8 (though the 3 fails because a roll of 1 always fails to wound irrespective of modifiers).

The reason I say it's a bad habit is because when you apply that logic to hits with re-rolls, you end up making mistakes.

Example: BS3+, Reroll Misses, -1 to hit. You roll a 1,2,3,4. You can't re-roll the 3, but if you say in your mind "Hitting on 4s, rerolling misses", you'll tend to slip up and re-roll the 3 as well.

You either need to remember that it's hitting on 3s on a D6-1, or train yourself to consider "re-roll miss" effects to be "Re-roll 1's and 2's" (for BS3+).

And as I am sure you can guess, I am a stickler for rules.

Yeah, I always appreciate your responses because they're RAW AF.

I just learned that weird little thing about the rerolling -1 misses last night. I'm worried about explaining it to my friends lol. I feel like it'll be a loooong conversation. But anyway, it's good to know that it does get the +2 to its mortal wounds as well.

Also, the 3 fails not because it's a 1 but because it needs a 4+ to wound. When you add +2 to the roll it becomes a 2+, so the 1s are failing anyway.

Oh wait a second... if you advance on a rhino with a combi-plasma and shoot both the plasma and the bolter you're looking at -2 to hit? So a 1, 2, or 3 will pop the tank?

 Kharneth wrote:
Yeah, I always appreciate your responses because they're RAW AF.

I just learned that weird little thing about the rerolling -1 misses last night. I'm worried about explaining it to my friends lol. I feel like it'll be a loooong conversation. But anyway, it's good to know that it does get the +2 to its mortal wounds as well.

Also, the 3 fails not because it's a 1 but because it needs a 4+ to wound. When you add +2 to the roll it becomes a 2+, so the 1s are failing anyway.

Oh wait a second... if you advance on a rhino with a combi-plasma and shoot both the plasma and the bolter you're looking at -2 to hit? So a 1, 2, or 3 will pop the tank?

1) Fair enough, but if you somehow had +6 to wound, generating a number between 7 and 12, the 7 will fail because the physicial dice is a 1. Swings and Roundabouts!

2) Well, the fact you can't shoot Rapid Fire after advancing helps. But yeah if you fired a Combi-Plasma, both profiles, at something that is -1 to hit, you have a total of -2 to the roll, so explode on a 1, 2 or 3. Make sure to target those squishy Eldar or supersanic jets! The daemons possessing the Plasmaguns are scared of the dark and effeminate aliens!

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Kharneth wrote:
Yeah, I always appreciate your responses because they're RAW AF.

I just learned that weird little thing about the rerolling -1 misses last night. I'm worried about explaining it to my friends lol. I feel like it'll be a loooong conversation. But anyway, it's good to know that it does get the +2 to its mortal wounds as well.

Also, the 3 fails not because it's a 1 but because it needs a 4+ to wound. When you add +2 to the roll it becomes a 2+, so the 1s are failing anyway.

Oh wait a second... if you advance on a rhino with a combi-plasma and shoot both the plasma and the bolter you're looking at -2 to hit? So a 1, 2, or 3 will pop the tank?

1) Fair enough, but if you somehow had +6 to wound, generating a number between 7 and 12, the 7 will fail because the physicial dice is a 1. Swings and Roundabouts!

2) Well, the fact you can't shoot Rapid Fire after advancing helps. But yeah if you fired a Combi-Plasma, both profiles, at something that is -1 to hit, you have a total of -2 to the roll, so explode on a 1, 2 or 3. Make sure to target those squishy Eldar or supersanic jets! The daemons possessing the Plasmaguns are scared of the dark and effeminate aliens!

Yes, 1s always fail. That's like a basic dice rule, I think (or at least shared with D&D). My buddy tried to cheese me with that the other day. My berzerkers rolled snake eyes for a charge roll (and again on their reroll!), luckily they were 1" away, and he's like "but 1s always fail, so you fail your charge, don't you?" He wouldn't believe me so we had to ask another friend who just laughed.

Oh, duh. All right. None of my friends bring any -1 to hit guys :( it's just me and my smoke launching rhinos. Plus, I refused to blow up my rhino for a turn 1 charge because it's a dumb rule and a plasma overheating shouldn't blow up a tank! I just had a brain fart lol.

BCB has already handled your rule question, so I'll just answer this:

 Kharneth wrote:

2) What is this thing good for? What about the other bodyguards? Are their ways to make them useful and/or are there situations where they're worth having?

Lhamaeans are great against monsters, heavy infantry and anything with an invulnerable save.

I like putting 3 of them in a Venom with a (non-warlord) Archon and sending them straight towards a hard target.


In terms of the rest of the Court:

- Sslyth are decent bodyguard units, though a bit pricey. I don't normally bother with them, but they might be useful if your warlord wants to join in the fray. I'd probably only take 1-2 of them at most.

- Ur-Ghuls are melee anti-infantry units, but aren't great even in that role. Usually not worth bothering with.

- Medusae seem to be aimed at doing damage at very short range, but for a Court unit their weapon really isn't anything special. They seem to be designed as a suicide unit, but only get rerolls if you put an expensive HQ with them. And on top of that they still don't get the rerolls unless they all disembark and stand 9" from the enemy, begging to be charged. And their weapon isn't even a pistol, so melee locks them down completely. Frankly, they're a horribly-designed unit and you'd be far better off with Kabalites or Mandrakes.

Excellent.

My buddy plans to take 4 Lhameans with an Archon with a Huskblade in a Venom to hunt heavy infantry. His warlord will be the other Archon with 9 Warriors in a Raider.

 Kharneth wrote:
Excellent.

My buddy plans to take 4 Lhameans

Does the beta rule of 3 apply to these guys? Are you guys not using beta rules?

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

 Kharneth wrote:
Excellent.

My buddy plans to take 4 Lhameans

Does the beta rule of 3 apply to these guys? Are you guys not using beta rules?

The "Rule of 3" is not a beta rule, it's an organised play suggestion. It does NOT apply to normal matched play rules.

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

 Kharneth wrote:
Excellent.

My buddy plans to take 4 Lhameans

Does the beta rule of 3 apply to these guys? Are you guys not using beta rules?

Suggestions are not rules, lol.

I don't mean for that to sound condescending. Honestly, GW's suggestion is to prevent people from bringing really cheesy lists. I, frankly, don't think having a 4th Lhamean is very cheesy. It'd be one thing if he took 3 patrols with 3 Archons each with 4 Lhameans. But taking an Archon with 4 bodyguards and having them all be the 1 bodyguard that is actually useful isn't a problem for me.

We do play by the beta rules, but we completely ignore that suggestion. My friend takes 3 Hammerheads in every list, even his 1,000pt list. My other friend takes 3 Leman Russ in all lists, including his 1k list.

A few weeks ago we did 2v2 and I was against 5 Leman Russ and 4 Hammerheads. It was an insanely fun and unique experience. My Blood Slaughterer and Demon Prince died on turn 1.