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This is a 2k list that I've come up with for a monthly tournament. CSM, Black Legion.

---Battalion detachment (5 cp) - Black Legion---

HQ:
Daemon Prince, MoNurgle, wings, warpbolter, 2x malefic talons, miasma of pestilence
Daemon Prince, MoNurgle, wings, warpbolter, 2x malefic talons, warptime
Sorcerer with jump pack, force axe, MoSlaanesh, delightful agonies, death hex

Troops:
40x cultists with autoguns, MoSlaanesh
33x cultists with autoguns, MoSlaanesh
10x cultist with autoguns and one heavy stubber, MoTzeentch

---Spearhead detachment (1 cp) - Black Legion---

HQ:
Abaddon the Despoiler, Warlord (2 cp)
Daemon Prince, MoSlaanesh, wings, warpbolter, 2x malefic talons, diabolic strength, intoxicating elixer

Heavy Support:
Defiler, defiler scourge, reaper autocannon, MoSlaanesh
3x Obliterators, MoSlaanesh
3x Obliterators, MoSlaanesh
3x Obliterators, MoSlaanesh

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Abaddon marches upfield behind the 73x cultists (making them fearless), Black Legion trait lets folks advance and still shoot their rapid fire weapons, Defiler and 3 daemon princes follow/protect. The obliterators deploy if needed or drop in turn 2+ for a beta strike. 11 cp so I can use tide of traitors once, cacophony several times, and veterans of the long war. I was skeptical about defiler's until I played one in my last game. They are tough as nails and pack a PUNCH! What do you guys think?

I like the list. I would cut the warp bolters and the heavy stubber and just take more cultist bodies.

I think you really are gonna want prescience to buff the defiler.

You could potentially run into trouble against lists with lots of long range shooting because it wouldn't be terribly difficult to bubble wrap your oblits out of range and the only other anti armor you have is the unreliable defiler cannon and the DP's.

That said it looks solid and should be fun to play.

I think you're right about the stubber. I took it out and went up to 34 cultists in the second blob.

At this point the only thing that I could cut would be the warp bolters. That would give me 9 points and two extra cultists. I think with Abaddon making them fearless and with tide of traitors that 2 extra cultists might not make a huge difference. The warp bolters however adding 6 AP-1 Damage 2 shots seems stronger than just adding two T3 bodies to the field.

I'll be playing this list next weekend and can give a summary of how it preformed. I'm pretty excited to get Abaddon on the field again. This will be my first time trying him with huge cultist blobs bubble wrapping him. I've only played the Defiler in a practice game but it really put in some work. I was up against a less shooty army though so it may not work as well against a gun line. We'll find out on the 9th.

You don't need Prescience. My buddy takes a defiler and uses Demon Forge every turn. Reroll all hits and wounds.

The shooty parts are fine, though are you intending to deep strike your oblits into your own deployment zone turn 1, or wait until turn 2 ?

If turn 2, a smart opponent will push forward his screens to deprive you of midboard space to deep strike your oblits into.

If turn 1, deep striking them in your own deloyment zone may mean they don't have many good targets to shoot at (probably just screen fodder).

Another question, how are you planning to get your 3 flying daemon princes up the board? You can only cast warp time once a turn. Your cultists can't move so fast. So, are you flying all 3 up the board without any fodder in front of them? That will invite a lot of shooting...

your list isn't optimized, depending on what your collection is you should have a third detachment to reach the limit to have more CP.

 ragetastic wrote:
your list isn't optimized, depending on what your collection is you should have a third detachment to reach the limit to have more CP.

The only way that I could add a detachment is to:

move 2 HQs to a supreme command, but then I'm missing a third HQ for that detachment which I do not have points for
I can move 2 HQs and some troops to another battalion detachment but I would have 6 small squads instead of 2 large cultists blobs making tide of traitors worse and it's much easier to wipe out a unit of 10 cultists for objectives each turn. You have to pump a lot of fire into 40 fearless cultists with FNP 5+. I wanted to have two huge fearless blobs in front of abaddon and the princes for a screen and that I can use tide of traitors on to get the most bang for my buck.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Eldenfirefly wrote:
The shooty parts are fine, though are you intending to deep strike your oblits into your own deployment zone turn 1, or wait until turn 2 ?

If turn 2, a smart opponent will push forward his screens to deprive you of midboard space to deep strike your oblits into.

If turn 1, deep striking them in your own deloyment zone may mean they don't have many good targets to shoot at (probably just screen fodder).

Another question, how are you planning to get your 3 flying daemon princes up the board? You can only cast warp time once a turn. Your cultists can't move so fast. So, are you flying all 3 up the board without any fodder in front of them? That will invite a lot of shooting...

I use the oblits differently depending on the opponent. If they are a smaller/elite force, I will hold them in DS for turn 2 so that I can Beta-strike key targets.
If they have a lot of chaff/screens on the field I will deploy 1 or 2 squads to advance and help clear chaff, using terrain to block them from high strength fire.
The daemon princes hide behind the 74 cultists, 40 with FNP, all fearless. You have to clear my screen/chaff before you can target the princes or Abbadon. Warptime is used when a key target gets into striking distance or is caught out of position. I don't use it to move/warptime/assault on T1/T2 because that just ends up with a dead prince because it has no screen. With black legion the cultists can advance and still fire so they move on average 9-10" per turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Brettila wrote:
You don't need Prescience. My buddy takes a defiler and uses Demon Forge every turn. Reroll all hits and wounds.

I take prescience but not to use on the defiler. I use it on the cultists or Oblits. If a full group of cultists get in rapid fire range, you can get prescience and VotLW up for 80-160 (cocophony) +1 to hit and +1 to wound shots. The defiler takes snap shots or just advances mostly and wrecks face in melee.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I played 2 rounds with this list.

First round I played against was a mixture of Astra Militarum, 2x Blood Angels HQs (the jump pack/thunder hammer ones) with 3 scout sqads, and 2x Custodes shield captains. There were 6 units of 9 man infantry with mortars, a mortar team, two basilisks, a manticore, 2 sentinels, and several IG HQs. The army held it's own for the first 3 turns and I was able to take out both blood angel HQs, 1 shield captain, the sentinels, half the scouts, and several IG infantry. I could not however get a good firing line due to terrain to the basilisks and manticore. We were tied 14/14 at the bottom of 3 and then it fell apart. I lost most of my cultists, all HQs, and was left with the Defiler and Oblits but they were no further than midfield. The remaining shield captain ran amok with support fire from the guard and I lost 36/16.

Second round I played against Death Guard/Thousand Sons. He had 5 daemon princes (3 from thousand sons, 2 death guard), typhus, necrosius, close to 40 poxwalkers, and 3 bloat drones. I was ahead probably 17/4 on the start of turn 4 and after we traded a bunch of HQs, he had more princes left alive and two poxwalker units that I had a hard time getting a line of sight on. He scored the bonus objective for 3-4 turns in a row with the princes and was able to pick my remaining units off one or two at a time with no return fire (the poxwalkers were closer but out of line of sight so I couldn't shoot his princes with Oblits). The game ended with a loss 30/28.

Third round -BYE-

The guy I played in round one ended the tournament in 1st place and the guy from round two placed 2nd.

I feel that the list was strong early, but really lost punch in turns 4-6. With the new strike rules it's hard to place Obliterators. I may shift away from Black Legion and go for a more aggressive list with Alpha Legion. Replace the obliterators with Butcher Cannon/Havoc Launcher Contemptor dreadnoughts or some Heldrakes. Infiltrate the cultists instead of marching them and maybe add some Berserkers to infiltrate. I think this list is too slow.