Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Just curious. I seem to have plenty of them, but I don't know of they would be worthwhile at all when it comes to Fleshborer and Devourer Termagants.

Thanks

SG

My gut says no. They are best used as cheap, cheap bodies.
4 points a model is a sweet deal.

Nah - they are really only worth it on big monsters like hive tyrants and trygons.

Nope

Run Hormagaunts and termagants without upgrades

No, not worth it on Termies. Keep em cheap!

On Hormies the Adrenal Gland is tempting, but a tough choice still. One of those to take if you got an awkward number of points to fill. If you are deep striking them (Trygons, Tyrannocyte, Enemy Below) then it probably is worth it.

I always take AGs on any Monster that wants to get into melee, like Trygons and Hive Tyrants.

Toxin Sacs I don't really ever take.

Absolutely not.

I guess if you’re playing a Gorgon army for some reason, then toxin sacs might be worth it on some decent combat units, but never on termagants. 1 attack is not worth the investment.

That 4pts per Termagant is not that great compared to 4pts per Guardsman.

 Nurglitch wrote:
That 4pts per Termagant is not that great compared to 4pts per Guardsman.

Very few infantry choices in the game look good next to Guardsmen though to be fair!

I think Hormagaunts at 5pts stack up worse...

^They have a great deployment advantage though. Getting guardsmen anywhere you either have to march them there on foot, or buy expensive transports that can only carry 10 at a time. Tyranids have easy ways to flood far corners of the table with hordes of models through tunneling there. Pretty neat.


Hormagaunts are a pretty different unit than either Guardsmen or Termagaunts. At 5 I think they're definitely a solid buy.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Hormagaunts are a pretty different unit than either Guardsmen or Termagaunts. At 5 I think they're definitely a solid buy.

I have 30 of them painted and ready to go... maybe another 5 or so that still could be painted if I wanted to.

SG

 Insectum7 wrote:
^They have a great deployment advantage though. Getting guardsmen anywhere you either have to march them there on foot, or buy expensive transports that can only carry 10 at a time. Tyranids have easy ways to flood far corners of the table with hordes of models through tunneling there. Pretty neat.


Hormagaunts are a pretty different unit than either Guardsmen or Termagaunts. At 5 I think they're definitely a solid buy.

Well... Sort of. Trygons are pretty expensive if all you're going to use them for is Termagants. You need the Prime really too for Synapse, so you're talking about 200pts. Guard have the Valkyrie.

Or you have to be Jormungandr. Which is sort of like saying Space Marines are fine because Raven Guard are decent. That's not really fair.

Stux wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
^They have a great deployment advantage though. Getting guardsmen anywhere you either have to march them there on foot, or buy expensive transports that can only carry 10 at a time. Tyranids have easy ways to flood far corners of the table with hordes of models through tunneling there. Pretty neat.


Hormagaunts are a pretty different unit than either Guardsmen or Termagaunts. At 5 I think they're definitely a solid buy.

Well... Sort of. Trygons are pretty expensive if all you're going to use them for is Termagants. You need the Prime really too for Synapse, so you're talking about 200pts. Guard have the Valkyrie.

Or you have to be Jormungandr. Which is sort of like saying Space Marines are fine because Raven Guard are decent. That's not really fair.

Trygons themselves are pretty good units, as opposed to lots of other delivery methods which are mostly just a transport (Rhinos, Chimeras, etc.) 2 Trygons gets you 60 models deep striking, which can be a shock. For Synapse you could potentially fly a Flyrant over, or use one of the move-twice stratagems to get a Broodlord or whatever over there.

The Termagaunts can be upgraded to Devgaunts too, if you're looking for more bang for your transport-buck.

But yes, I use Jormangunder, so I can just use Raveners and get the same results, and use more CPs to bring in Synapse or whatever else.

You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

100% NO! And as soon as IG gets to be 5ppm we will see a value in them!

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

They are a very, very fast tarpit though. That 6" pile in/consolidate is crazy. Coupled with an 8" move and access to charging after Advancing. They can be a game-winning unit by virtue of just being able to connect with so much stuff.

 Insectum7 wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

They are a very, very fast tarpit though. That 6" pile in/consolidate is crazy. Coupled with an 8" move and access to charging after Advancing. They can be a game-winning unit by virtue of just being able to connect with so much stuff.

But Guardsman can Move Move Move, are 5+, can shoot and melee, Cat can be S4 melee as well, who cares about extra piles in when you can flood the board with literally 33% more bodies with 16.7% more durability, that can shoot and melee.

Sigh. . . are we going to turn this into a Guard-whine thread? Is that what you want?

 Insectum7 wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

They are a very, very fast tarpit though. That 6" pile in/consolidate is crazy. Coupled with an 8" move and access to charging after Advancing. They can be a game-winning unit by virtue of just being able to connect with so much stuff.

T3 6+ is literally the worst profile in the game to take damage...paying 5 points for it and having no deal "damage" output (even when you combine multiple stratagems and buffs) is astonishingly bad. They should be 4 pts like Termagants and Gargoyles 5 pt (I can take Neophyte Hybrids for 5 pts and I can assure you that they are MUCH STRONGER than 'gants variants)

KurtAngle2 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

They are a very, very fast tarpit though. That 6" pile in/consolidate is crazy. Coupled with an 8" move and access to charging after Advancing. They can be a game-winning unit by virtue of just being able to connect with so much stuff.

T3 6+ is literally the worst profile in the game to take damage...

1 point of armor less than Guard, which are lauded as some of the toughest troops in the game around these parts.

KurtAngle2 wrote:
paying 5 points for it and having no deal "damage" output (even when you combine multiple stratagems and buffs) is astonishingly bad.

You're not generally buying them to knock wounds off things. You're buying them to stop the enemy from damaging you, by locking up units or forcing them to fall back/not fire next turn.

KurtAngle2 wrote:
They should be 4 pts like Termagants and Gargoyles 5 pt (I can take Neophyte Hybrids for 5 pts and I can assure you that they are MUCH STRONGER than 'gants variants)

But not nearly the potential speed, which is sorta their entire point.

 Insectum7 wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Stux wrote:
You make some good points.

I'm certainly not complaining about Termagants though, they're perfectly decent for a 4pt model

As many people said elsewhere the problem lies in gardsmen being too cheap (only Guard apologists will tell you otherwise)
Hormagaunts are definitely overpriced and not worth 5 pts per model (being a tarpit and nothing more)

They are a very, very fast tarpit though. That 6" pile in/consolidate is crazy. Coupled with an 8" move and access to charging after Advancing. They can be a game-winning unit by virtue of just being able to connect with so much stuff.

T3 6+ is literally the worst profile in the game to take damage...

1 point of armor less than Guard, which are lauded as some of the toughest troops in the game around these parts.

KurtAngle2 wrote:
paying 5 points for it and having no deal "damage" output (even when you combine multiple stratagems and buffs) is astonishingly bad.

You're not generally buying them to knock wounds off things. You're buying them to stop the enemy from damaging you, by locking up units or forcing them to fall back/not fire next turn.

KurtAngle2 wrote:
They should be 4 pts like Termagants and Gargoyles 5 pt (I can take Neophyte Hybrids for 5 pts and I can assure you that they are MUCH STRONGER than 'gants variants)

But not nearly the potential speed, which is sorta their entire point.

Guess what, 1 point more and literally not saving any wound...1/6 to 1/3 doesn't even compare man

Guess what? Then don't take them.

Tyranid troops are overshadowed by Guard, yes, but everyone's troops are overshadowed by Guard, to an insane degree.

Hormagants aren't worthless. They can kill Eldar and Dark Eldar fairly well.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Guess what? Then don't take them.

Cool way to have a discussion, if you dont want to talk about it,then you get out.

 Amishprn86 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Guess what? Then don't take them.

Cool way to have a discussion, if you dont want to talk about it,then you get out.

Wow, dude. Might want to take it down a notch or two.

As I said in my first post about them. Hormagaunts are not intended to work like Guard, and their strengths (and weaknesses) reflect that. You can spend all day complaining that they aren't Guard, but that's not their purpose. Since you don't seem to bee keen on even acknowledging their strengths, it's pretty clear that this isn't going to go anywhere.

They are fast. They are excellent at exploiting a break in opponent lines and at dashing in and contacting as many units as possible in order to shut them down. They can do this better than Guardsmen, and Acolytes, because again, they are fast. If you're looking for a unit to do something else (like imitate Guardsmen) then don't take them. Easy peasy.

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Guess what? Then don't take them.

Cool way to have a discussion, if you dont want to talk about it,then you get out.

Wow, dude. Might want to take it down a notch or two.

As I said in my first post about them. Hormagaunts are not intended to work like Guard, and their strengths (and weaknesses) reflect that. You can spend all day complaining that they aren't Guard, but that's not their purpose. Since you don't seem to bee keen on even acknowledging their strengths, it's pretty clear that this isn't going to go anywhere.

They are fast. They are excellent at exploiting a break in opponent lines and at dashing in and contacting as many units as possible in order to shut them down. They can do this better than Guardsmen, and Acolytes, because again, they are fast. If you're looking for a unit to do something else (like imitate Guardsmen) then don't take them. Easy peasy.

You said what you needed to say, we all know we dont have to take units we dont like, you added nothing to the discussion.


Back onto topic;
Hgants dont do enough damage or are reliable enough for TX, so they dont need TS. They already are fast, so they dont need AG for what you are paying for already, 5 points for them is too high already (for now).

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Guess what? Then don't take them.

Cool way to have a discussion, if you dont want to talk about it,then you get out.

Wow, dude. Might want to take it down a notch or two.

Insectum, I'd recommend not engaging with this guy. He consistently posts factually incorrect stuff about Tyranids and will never, ever, ever backdown no matter how wrong he is, and instead just gets more and more hostile per reply, until he eventually gets to the point where he says "okay this is why I'm right now let's get back on topic" as if any disagreement with his was simply not on topic. There's not a worthwhile discussion to be had, when he posts, if it's wrong I've taken to just expressing quietly that I disagree without quoting him, and trying not to get roped into some argument with a brick wall.




So, in this case I disagree.

Hormagants are great. Their tarpitting ability and Tyranid strats just makes them good. A unit of 19 can tarpit like they were Genestealers except they cost only 95 pts. Nick Nanavati listed them as one of the biggest threats in the meta right now, combined with Nids/GSC psychic support, I too think they are a great unit, I run one and am considering going up to 2 just for consistency, they are cheap enough to get away with it too. And they provide semi decent assault coverage too to help pull threats off things like Fexes or even HG.

Termagants are 4 pt fearless bodies with good mobility thanks to Kraken. That's everything it needs to be. 18" range on the guns would be nice, but you can definitely include Devourers in larger units.

Guardsmen are obviously OP but it doesn't make Tyranid units worse in a broad meta.

 Amishprn86 wrote:

You said what you needed to say, we all know we dont have to take units we dont like, you added nothing to the discussion.

Sure sure, why discuss the strengths of a unit in the OPs faction when we can just create another thread where we sit around and whine about Guardsmen.
. . .

I'd make a case for occasionally putting Adrenal Glands on Hormagaunts, but I wouldn't glue them onto the models if you know what I'm saying.

To stay on topic, If you are going to DS them (tho i'd rather DS other uits) i would put AG on them, AG in a Behemoth army to have a 8" re-rolling charge, sadly you can only DS 20 units unless its with Trygons, or Jormungandr and Stratagems.


@SHUPPET