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I have a sizeable Dark Angels army already. They were my first army, and I probably have 3000 to 4000 points of them. And, I believe I'm going to focus this army to be mostly Primaris (as I have almost 2000 points of Primaris DA painted with the exception of bikers, land speeders, Darkshroud, Dark Talon, and others that just don't have Primaris counterparts).

So, while 7th Edition was around, I created a Soul Drinkers army just for the Skyhammer Annihilation Force Formation. That was a nasty Alpha Strike formation. Anyway, with only 30 marines and two drop pods, it wasn't going to make for a really good start in 8th edition. Per the fluff, the Soul Drinkers are already dead and couldn't have gotten the Primaris upgrade anyway. So, I decided to strip the paint on the entire formation.

Now, I'm left with two five man assault squads, two 10 man devastator squads, and two drop pods. I also have other space marine models from other sets. Anyway, I can't decide which would be best. Should I paint up all my remaining unpainted Space Marines as Dark Angels so that I have a wide selection to choose from (over 6000 points by that time), or do I start another chapter that I'm interested in with the remaining unpainted Space Marines I have? I was thinking of starting some Black Templars.

In my situation, would you attempt a new army or just continue to build on your current space marines army?

Thanks

SG

I would take it as a little lesson about how you should never ever buy, build and paint miniatures for the express purpose of getting the rules they provide.

Because that time investment is going to be gone in usually one edition rules change. Sometimes less if they FAQ it or get a new codex mid-edition.

I'd say on average if you buy a miniature you have 4-6 months before the rules they provide change in some significant way and they either become more or less competitive.

Unless your income is large enough and disposable enough that that's not a problem, and the time you invest in assembly and painting is really small, just don't do it.

Man I wish someone told me that before I started, having 6 months to buy, paint and play with an army before it gets nerfed seems mindblowing.

This is why you make your own chapter and play with the rules that you like most. That is what I would suggest here too.

Afaik Templar’s could ally with DA? So go with Templars and ally them.

the_scotsman wrote:
I would take it as a little lesson about how you should never ever buy, build and paint miniatures for the express purpose of getting the rules they provide.

Because that time investment is going to be gone in usually one edition rules change. Sometimes less if they FAQ it or get a new codex mid-edition.

I'd say on average if you buy a miniature you have 4-6 months before the rules they provide change in some significant way and they either become more or less competitive.

Unless your income is large enough and disposable enough that that's not a problem, and the time you invest in assembly and painting is really small, just don't do it.

I don't disagree with you in theory. In practice, though, buying models for the rules they provide makes a lot of sense... at least to a point. As a hobbyist, I don't play much. I really enjoy the fluff of the 40K universe and want to get into playing more often. The problem is knowing what to buy and paint.

First of all, I'm not competitive. I'm there to have fun, but I would like to win about as many as I lose. All the above said, I know a good bit about most of the 40K armies now that I've been in the hobby three and a half years, but I don't know what to pick to build a 50% win army. And, I don't have the time to play test (married, stepson, and closest game store being 35 to 45 minutes away depending on traffic).

While Formations definitely weren't the end-all-be-all of how to play Warhammer as they did grant some insane abilities for the points spent, they were an easy way to know which models you need to create an army that would have about a 50% chance of winning. You could look around at people saying, "X Formation is really good" and know that if you put together that formation or detachment (depending on how big it was) as well as knowing your rules, you had a good chance of winning 50% of games.

Now, it's entirely opposite. Yes, you could netlist, but I am just not that kind of person (not competitive, shorter on time and money now that I'm married... wouldn't trade my wife or stepson for any piece of plastic, though). And, I definitely don't have the money to keep up with the meta. But, let's say that I really enjoyed a book I just read about... pick a Space Marine chapter. I go to GW, buy a few hundred dollars worth of models, paint them like that chapter, put them on the table, and they just get torn to shreds almost every game because I didn't pick quite the right synergy. I built a fluff list not a true gaming list.

I will not fault anyone for not keeping an eye on or helping me with army lists over on the 40K Army List forum here as I do post several lists. But, I have the models to build those lists (mostly all bought before I got married)... it's just a matter of taking the time to sit down and paint them. That said, without any feedback (or very limited feedback), it's impossible to know if the list I have is going to be worth the time to assemble and paint or just better left for the next FAQ, CA, or edition. Formations fixed that problem completely. All you had to do was scan the army list forum wherever you frequented, and you'd find several people with lists based around the same Formation. All you had to do was buy the needed models for that formation, and you were set.

Alas, it's based solely on play testing now which someone like me doesn't have the time to do.

tl;dr - Buying models for the rules they provide isn't always a bad thing regardless of how long you have before those rules are changed. If you are short on time and/or money, it's especially helpful. I do agree that it can bite you in the butt, but it makes things so much easier.

SG

You should have kept them as soul drinkers man. That sounded like a cool concept (unless you were unhappy with the paintjob of course).

Moriarty wrote:
Afaik Templar’s could ally with DA? So go with Templars and ally them.

Could Black Templars ally with DA per the rules, absolutely. Per the fluff, I doubt it. They are such a huge chapter plus the fact that they hate all psykers, I don't see it easy to get them to ally with anyone. I could be wrong, though.

SG

Didn't the DA blow up a BT strike cruiser, because they saw some fallen?

Gitdakka wrote:
You should have kept them as soul drinkers man. That sounded like a cool concept (unless you were unhappy with the paintjob of course).

Soul Drinkers were awesome, and I liked the paint job. But, per the fluff, they are already all either dead or lost to the warp. They were labeled as heretics by the inquisition but showed that they were loyal before they faced their final battle. They have an excellent backstory, but now that the overall 40K story is moving forward, they may be more and more left in the past (though I do see several people who have posted pictures of Soul Drinker armies online). So, per game rules, could Soul Drinkers ally with other space marine chapters? Certainly. Per the fluff, most loyalist chapters would probably shun them. Very cool concept, yes. Could you make an army out of them? Sure! If you wanted to be true to the fluff, many of them would need deformities as they were pulled closer and closer to chaos. But, if you're into sculpting or kit bashing, they would be excellent. I didn't have enough to form an army in 8th, so I just saw a better use for them in a new chapter (for me at least).

SG


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Karol wrote:
Didn't the DA blow up a BT strike cruiser, because they saw some fallen?

I must admit that the fluff of the Fallen is not something I've done a lot of research into. I know what and who they are, but I don't know why they seem to pop up as selections for Space Marine chapters in Battlescribe. Cypher may walk the line between loyalist and traitor... he's kind of tough to pin down as no one really knows his motives. It is possible that the DA did blow up a BT strike cruiser because of some Fallen... why the Fallen are with the BT in the first place.... I don't know.

SG

Karol wrote:
Man I wish someone told me that before I started, having 6 months to buy, paint and play with an army before it gets nerfed seems mindblowing.

Yes, it is mindblowing that people take a hobby that is as expensive and time consuming as warhammer and try to play it like a video game where you can easily swap from one competitive meta build and change over to another with a single mouse click.

The most cost effective way to play 40k is to find a group that works to keep their armies middle of the road and collectively removes the need for a competitive list building arms race.

It really is nutty going back and forth from Dakka to the group I actually play with, where we have things like a Catachan player who has no idea that his army is the current competitive hotness and doesn't care, just continues to use the same slowly growing collection of models he's used since 3rd edition, with such a random variety of equipment and vehicles that he has nowhere near a high winrate against people playing other completely casual armies.

Only collect and paint armies you like for visual, lore and thematic reasons. If your main priority is building the top list you'll get burned. The meta is always shifting.

If you intend to chase the meta it's certainly possible but it's very expensive.