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Swift Strike and Counter Offensive.

Swift strike is a stratagem for the Dark Angels Raven Wing that allows a unit to move or fall back immediately after figthing. Counter Offensive is a stratagem to attack an enemy who charged immediately after they attack.

Clashing timing is resolved by a d6 to see who gets to use their thing.

If counter offensive wins and the Dark angels unit survives the hit are they still required to use Swift Strike or can they decide not to? The original intent to use it was to avoid the retaliatory attack but that failed and now they don’t want to move.

Clashing timing?

If you mean two things that happen at the same time, then that is covered by sequencing and the active player (The player that is currently finishing his turn) determines the order they are resolved.

Gendif wrote:
Swift Strike and Counter Offensive.

Swift strike is a stratagem for the Dark Angels Raven Wing that allows a unit to move or fall back immediately after figthing. Counter Offensive is a stratagem to attack an enemy who charged immediately after they attack.

Clashing timing is resolved by a d6 to see who gets to use their thing.

If counter offensive wins and the Dark angels unit survives the hit are they still required to use Swift Strike or can they decide not to? The original intent to use it was to avoid the retaliatory attack but that failed and now they don’t want to move.

What's the wording on Swift Strike? Because, assuming it lets them Fall Back or move INSTEAD of consolidating, the two are NOT simultaneous.

 JNAProductions wrote:
What's the wording on Swift Strike? Because, assuming it lets them Fall Back or move INSTEAD of consolidating, the two are NOT simultaneous.

It is not instead of consolidating.

So basically the active player gets to choose the order.

So basically OP, since it was the Dark Angels player's turn (Since Counter Offensive is used to attack an enemy who charged), that person would choose the order and the Dark Angels would fall back before Counter Offensive can be played.

I cannot see the image.

The swift strike strat is a specific strat only useable by some Deathwing units.

You activate it after you attack and it lets you fall back out of combat immediately.


As such, your opponent wouldn't even get to use counter offensive on the unit that they fell back from unless it was also engaged with another unit, as they wouldn't be eligible to fight.

As usual we can't do anything to help unless you provide the EXACT wordings. The Swift Strike stratagem says "Use this Stratagem in the Fight phase afer an ATTACK SQUADRON unit from your army has fought." This can be simultaniously activated with the Counter Offensive stratagem, which states "This Stratagem is used right after an enemy unit that charged has fought." As such, the active player decides the order.

Active player determines order.

No roll off is mandated/required/necessary/allowed.

 skchsan wrote:
Active player determines order.

No roll off is mandated/required/necessary/allowed.

Technically the rules allow you to roll off on anything, all you have to do is disagree with the opponent :p

But I am being facetious, and for all practical and sane purposes you are correct.

Okay, thanks all for the responses so far. So I had the clashing timing wrong but that raises the same question in a different way.

Both players want to do their stratagem so the active player decides to resolve Swift Strike first and move the Ravenwing away.
Can the opponent now resolve counter offensive and attack the Ravenwing? Probably not, since the Ravenwing aren’t there any more.
Do they still have to try? They declared the action so are they just buying a pile-in and consolidate at this point?

I realise looking through that the rules really don’t seem to cover this so I guess it’s a talk with the opponent before the battle situation.

Gendif wrote:
Okay, thanks all for the responses so far. So I had the clashing timing wrong but that raises the same question in a different way.

Both players want to do their stratagem so the active player decides to resolve Swift Strike first and move the Ravenwing away.
Can the opponent now resolve counter offensive and attack the Ravenwing? Probably not, since the Ravenwing aren’t there any more.
Do they still have to try? They declared the action so are they just buying a pile-in and consolidate at this point?

I realise looking through that the rules really don’t seem to cover this so I guess it’s a talk with the opponent before the battle situation.

You can't select that unit because it is no longer "eligible" to fight, unless it is within 1" of a different unit. The rules do cover it, just fine.