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Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





United Kingdom

Hi all,

Bought some second-hand Eldar and started a list based on the models I have.


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [83 PL, 1,497pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ HQ +

Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Guide, 2. Doom, 6: Seer of the Shifting Vector, Craftworlds Warlord, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade
. Faolchu's Wing

Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 95pts]: 10x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Shuriken Cannon

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

+ Elites +

Fire Dragons [12 PL, 147pts]
. 5x Fire Dragon: 5x Fusion Gun
. Fire Dragon Exarch: Firepike

+ Heavy Support +

Dark Reapers [13 PL, 345pts]
. 9x Dark Reaper: 9x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher

Support Weapons [9 PL, 111pts]
. Support Weapon: Shadow Weaver
. Support Weapon: Shadow Weaver
. Support Weapon: Shadow Weaver

War Walkers [12 PL, 180pts]
. War Walker: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon
. War Walker: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon
. War Walker: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 167pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Bright Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 167pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Bright Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

++ Total: [83 PL, 1,497pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

Just a couple of comments:

1. I thought about expanding this to 2k by getting a Hemlock and a couple of Crimson Hunter Exarchs.

2. I get that most people advocate taking wave serpents barebones and using other units for AT. However, I found in my last game that my list as it was then really lacked AT and I couldn’t think of a better platform for bright lances. Open to suggestions however!

Thanks in advance!
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Los Angeles

 Krusha wrote:
Just a couple of comments:

1. I thought about expanding this to 2k by getting a Hemlock and a couple of Crimson Hunter Exarchs.
Can't go wrong with this.

 Krusha wrote:
2. I get that most people advocate taking wave serpents barebones and using other units for AT. However, I found in my last game that my list as it was then really lacked AT and I couldn’t think of a better platform for bright lances. Open to suggestions however!
Thanks in advance!
It's the extra points spent on Crystal Targeting Matrix and/or Biel-Tan (though you chose Alaitoc). Points on BLs are better spent on Dark Reapers, which you already have (and more couldn't hurt!). A fairly succesful player I know (finishes at Top Tables at GTs) upgrades WaveSes to having two Shuriken Cannons, so the assault 3 doesn't inhibit movement/shooting. And he fields 3 flyers.

Your Fire Dragons and DRs will take care of your A.T., which the Crimson Hunters will supplement. I think you've got enough.

"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






You could invest in an autarch. Small CP farm and re-roll 1s bubble. Your reapers would really benefit from that. Your guide will not go off 100% of the time. You can index option him and give him reaper launcher and mark of incomprable hunter trait for extra tricks. Well supplamented by the rangers to plink off weaker characters.

It Also would open up a spearhead for addiitonal 1 CP unless your scene only allows one detatchemnt. Your reapers & walkers would benefit greatly as a backline while everything else mocves up the board from the autarch.

WW offer a better platform for Bright lances I think because of the invuln and the fact they will be sititng well back. I play my spernets with vectrored engines/star engines & spirit stones as alitoic and 3 shuri cannons. Turn one just blast towards the enemy line and it always absorbs all the shooting because of its payload.

If your enemy sees a seprent packed with fire dragons zipping along on a suicide mission towards his armour they will be putting in all the guns into it.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





United Kingdom

 Argive wrote:
You could invest in an autarch. Small CP farm and re-roll 1s bubble. Your reapers would really benefit from that. Your guide will not go off 100% of the time. You can index option him and give him reaper launcher and mark of incomprable hunter trait for extra tricks. Well supplamented by the rangers to plink off weaker characters.

It Also would open up a spearhead for addiitonal 1 CP unless your scene only allows one detatchemnt. Your reapers & walkers would benefit greatly as a backline while everything else mocves up the board from the autarch.

WW offer a better platform for Bright lances I think because of the invuln and the fact they will be sititng well back. I play my spernets with vectrored engines/star engines & spirit stones as alitoic and 3 shuri cannons. Turn one just blast towards the enemy line and it always absorbs all the shooting because of its payload.

If your enemy sees a seprent packed with fire dragons zipping along on a suicide mission towards his armour they will be putting in all the guns into it.


What would you trim to fit in the autarch?

Thanks for your help btw.
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [34 PL, 8CP, 680pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [8CP] +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

Detachment CP [5CP]

+ HQ [8 PL, 165pts] +

Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 1. Guide, 2. Doom, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops [11 PL, 215pts] +

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 95pts]: 10x Guardian Defender [80pts]
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform [15pts]: Shuriken Cannon [10pts]

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger [60pts]

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger [60pts]

+ Elites [6 PL, 123pts] +

Fire Dragons [6 PL, 123pts]
. 4x Fire Dragon [96pts]: 4x Fusion Gun [56pts]
. Fire Dragon Exarch [27pts]: Firepike [17pts]

+ Dedicated Transport [9 PL, 177pts] +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 177pts]: Shuriken Cannon [10pts], Spirit Stones [10pts], Star Engines [10pts], Twin Shuriken Cannon [17pts], Vectored Engines [10pts]

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [39 PL, 1CP, 820pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [1CP] +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

Detachment CP [1CP]

+ HQ [4 PL, 99pts] +

Autarch [4 PL, 99pts]: Banshee Mask, Craftworlds Warlord, Forceshield [6pts], Reaper Launcher [22pts], Star Glaive [6pts]
. Faolchu's Wing

+ Heavy Support [26 PL, 570pts] +

Dark Reapers [7 PL, 175pts]
. 4x Dark Reaper [136pts]: 4x Reaper Launcher [88pts]
. Dark Reaper Exarch [39pts]: Tempest Launcher [27pts]

Dark Reapers [7 PL, 175pts]
. 4x Dark Reaper [136pts]: 4x Reaper Launcher [88pts]
. Dark Reaper Exarch [39pts]: Tempest Launcher [27pts]

War Walkers [12 PL, 220pts]
. War Walker [4 PL, 80pts]: Bright Lance [20pts], Bright Lance [20pts]
. War Walker [4 PL, 80pts]: Bright Lance [20pts], Bright Lance [20pts]
. War Walker [4 PL, 60pts]: Scatter Laser [7pts], Starcannon [13pts]

+ Dedicated Transport [9 PL, 151pts] +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 151pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix [5pts], Twin Shuriken Catapult [2pts], Twin Starcannon [24pts]

++ Total: [73 PL, 9CP, 1,500pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net

The second serpent is there to hide the reapers and characters as well a offer additional threat saturation.
The gimped walker is there to take the wounds and get removed first when the unit gets shot at.

The downsides to this list:

1. As you're creating a bit of a gunline in the backfield so might struggle with some mission types. You can counter this a bit by deploying the rangers in DS to capture those uncontested objectives potentially.
2. Also as a gunlineish, yu might be open to DS counter. Might be an issue if your seer is not close enough to offer Forewarned stratagem.
3. You sort of lack the screening. Once the guardians die, and die they shall as there is only 10 of them, you might be opening characters to pain.

I'm a huge fan and proponent of support weapons. Alas, as you are asking from a competitive standpoint, I don't think the shadoweavers offer anything in this instance that the dual tempest launchers wouldn't do better.

Caveat -
I personally wouldn't run fire dragons and use wraiths blades/guards instead. Alternatively banshees wold work as budget(points wise) blades to tie stuff up in CC. The dragons, as awesome as they are will fall over to a stiff breeze. Wraiths are very durable.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





United Kingdom

Thanks for the list.

I had thought about putting BLs on the walkers, but I was concerned that this would reduce their mobility and that they might be too fragile to act as static gunline units. Do you think they would do this well then?
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






 Krusha wrote:
Thanks for the list.

I had thought about putting BLs on the walkers, but I was concerned that this would reduce their mobility and that they might be too fragile to act as static gun-line units. Do you think they would do this well then?


The answer is. who knows lol.

If you deploy well back and use terrain to your advantage, there shouldn't be that much in range but it all depends on the enemy list. If they are AT heavy and go for them then yeah they might take a lot of dmg..not a lot you can do about it. If you use terrain might have to move and get -1 to hit in turn one depending on what the enemy is bringing to the table.

Hopefully their stuff should be too busy shooting at the serpents. They will not want to have to take all that fusion to the face, and try to pop the other serpent open to get at the reapers as they are the bigger threat.

WW seem to be fairly durable T6 W6 4+ 5++ and with alitoic -1. It's a good value for the points. If they get shot up T1 and deleted, you still have the reapers and fusion to counter.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in it
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.


From the list of models available, I think its better at 1500points to beef up the serpent to make sure it can deliver max mobility and durability then sinking it into less than 1 shadoweaver.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block





Yeh you can put heavy weapons on serpents, I ran mine with starcannons for a while and they did ok, but I find having vectored engines on them is so much better.

The extra -1 to hit when they advance (for -2 with alaitoc) makes them so durable, you just can't use heavy weapons with it, but shurikens are good chaff clearers anyway.

The dragons are fine I think, they do what they're supposed to do, just make sure to point them at the right target as they won't live long once they're out of the transport.

Definitely look at getting a hemlock, they just offer so much I always find them useful. Plus it can have jinx, so your warlock can use conceal on the reapers for another -2 to hit.

Crimson hunters can be hit or miss, I've had them do nothing and then other times 1 shot tanks, good if your opponent likes flyers though.

The 10 guardians won't do much, but they could be useful for spreading out to block deepstrikers. You could consider dropping them for more rangers if you want to save some points though.

I'd also consider putting the reapers into 1 big unit, for guide from the farseer, and split the walkers into 3 separate units instead, would make them a bit more difficult to shoot then as wounds wouldn't carry over.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/14 06:27:35


 
   
Made in it
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Argive wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.


From the list of models available, I think its better at 1500points to beef up the serpent to make sure it can deliver max mobility and durability then sinking it into less than 1 shadoweaver.

Serpent upgrades are usually a waste of points.
At least for me as I’m striving for target saturation.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in de
Devastating Dark Reaper





Biel-Tan

 wuestenfux wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.


From the list of models available, I think its better at 1500points to beef up the serpent to make sure it can deliver max mobility and durability then sinking it into less than 1 shadoweaver.

Serpent upgrades are usually a waste of points.
At least for me as I’m striving for target saturation.


I disagree i think beefing up a wave is a good move never leave your house without spirit stone that's what grampa always says

We are the Children of Eldanesh and Ulthanesh. The galaxy will be ours again.

My Instagram
My Blog
 
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






 Elian wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.


From the list of models available, I think its better at 1500points to beef up the serpent to make sure it can deliver max mobility and durability then sinking it into less than 1 shadoweaver.

Serpent upgrades are usually a waste of points.
At least for me as I’m striving for target saturation.


I disagree i think beefing up a wave is a good move never leave your house without spirit stone that's what grampa always says


I can see both sides of the coin and i understand the bare bones approach.. I find that very often i have spare 10 or 20 points. What am I going to spend it on instead that will matter? Another ranger/2 guardians/1 more DA? Is rather put it into the WS to make it more resiliant/mobile to ensure it can deliver its payload or deliver absorbing far more firepower than my opponent wants to shoot at it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Elian wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, I like the second list above better.
But no upgrades for the Serpent please and triple shuriken cannons.
Guardians can only be effective in a block of twenty and deep striking.


From the list of models available, I think its better at 1500points to beef up the serpent to make sure it can deliver max mobility and durability then sinking it into less than 1 shadoweaver.

Serpent upgrades are usually a waste of points.
At least for me as I’m striving for target saturation.


I disagree i think beefing up a wave is a good move never leave your house without spirit stone that's what grampa always says


I can see both sides of the coin and i understand the bare bones approach.. I find that very often i have spare 10 or 20 points. What am I going to spend it on instead that will matter? Another ranger/2 guardians/1 more DA? Is rather put it into the WS to make it more resiliant/mobile to ensure it can deliver its payload or deliver absorbing far more firepower than my opponent wants to shoot at it. Ive had a WS survive on 1 wound plenty of times to the horror and frustration of the enemy.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/18 13:11:03


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in hk
Steadfast Ultramarine Sergeant




If you are going competitive, why not take 3 flyers?
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Neophyte2012 wrote:
If you are going competitive, why not take 3 flyers?

They give you less ground control and are eventually more useful in larger games.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






Neophyte2012 wrote:
If you are going competitive, why not take 3 flyers?


If you read the OP thats the models he has.

Also im not sure 3 flyers in 1500 points is a good idea.. It would ne near impossible to deal with sure. However they cant hold objectives and would set you back nearly half the points...

Any player worth his salt will just play the mission and shoot at all the point scoring troops and pull ahead enough points wise before getting tabled. Especially if they are a bit hordy.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in de
Devastating Dark Reaper





Biel-Tan

3 CHE armed with lances are around 500 but yeas i totally agree with you personally i'll with some aspect but of course it is dependent on what OP have

We are the Children of Eldanesh and Ulthanesh. The galaxy will be ours again.

My Instagram
My Blog
 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





United Kingdom

I was planning on upgrading to three flyers for a 2k list.
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Krusha wrote:
I was planning on upgrading to three flyers for a 2k list.

Or take three Serpents with three shuricannons each.
Better ground control. Depends on whether you need anti-heavy-tank or not.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in de
Devastating Dark Reaper





Biel-Tan

To take them or not is dependant on what kind of format you're playing

If it's ITC or ETC take them absolutely, they are very difficult to destroy and they have a great damage output.

It you are planning to do the other missions i agree with Galadriel here take some wave serpents they are a tough cookie!

We are the Children of Eldanesh and Ulthanesh. The galaxy will be ours again.

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My Blog
 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





United Kingdom

One more Q guys:

(Assuming my opponent is ok with this) do you think it would be an idea to proxy my guardians as dire avengers?
   
Made in de
Devastating Dark Reaper





Biel-Tan

Yeah sure! Proxy is a good way to test unit before mounting and painting them

We are the Children of Eldanesh and Ulthanesh. The galaxy will be ours again.

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Made in us
Awesome Autarch





Dallas area, TX

And honestly, Guardians are just a helmet plume away from being Avengers already, so I doubt anyone would have issues

-

   
Made in it
Devastating Dark Reaper





Biel-Tan

They are our citizen though

We are the Children of Eldanesh and Ulthanesh. The galaxy will be ours again.

My Instagram
My Blog
 
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider






 Galef wrote:
And honestly, Guardians are just a helmet plume away from being Avengers already, so I doubt anyone would have issues

-


So true...
I would say ask in advance as a courtousy.

I would add if you will be using exarchs in DA squad, you'd need to have one of the guardians in each squad stand out to make it obvious so you dont forget and your opponent doesn forget. Maybe stick some tac on the side of the base or something temporary.
The inbuilt 4++ is very useful at tanking incoming firepower. You can take saves on him one at a time - like with weapon platform.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/06/21 18:10:45


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Elian wrote:
They are our citizen though

No, poets and philosophers.
Sending them to war is the last resort.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Los Angeles

 wuestenfux wrote:
 Elian wrote:
They are our citizen though

No, poets and philosophers.
Sending them to war is the last resort.
Okay, this calls for citing Vogon poetry, and considering its lethal qualities. Or, boring the enemy to death with 90s 'coffee house' beat poetry (which, one *could* go back to the 1960s for more ammunition, so to speak).

Plus, wuestenfux, you finished your post with a laughing ork.


"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
 
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