Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Regimental Doctrine: Big Game Hunters
Indigan sepoys are prized as monster-killers across the Ultima Segmentum. Hardened by the rampant mega-fauna and abhuman bandits of their home world, they focus fire to bring down the mightiest foes.

Re-roll wound rolls of 1 for models in units with this doctrine if the target has lost one or more wounds already in this turn. If an INFANTRY unit with this doctrine is issued the ‘Bring It Down!’ order and the target has lost one or more wounds already in this turn, re-roll all failed wound rolls for models in that unit until the end of the turn instead.

Warlord Trait: Shikari's Eye
The officer class of Indiga's regiments exhibit a knowledge of zoology that rivals even a Magos Xenologis. On the battlefield, they use this instinct for weakness to direct fire into the slightest vulnerability.
At the start of your Shooting phase, you can select one enemy unit that is visible to this WARLORD and includes a model with a Wounds characteristic of 3 or more. Until the end of the phase, this WARLORD has the following ability: 'Shikari's Eye (Aura): While a friendly INDIGAN unit is within 6" of this model, each time a model in that unit makes an attack, on an unmodified wound roll of 6, add 1 to the Damage characteristic of that attack. If that attack has a Damage characteristic of D6 or 2D6, add 2 instead.'

Stratagem: Monster Bait (1 CP)
The Indigan Praefects risk their lives to lure savage foes into position, where their mightiest guns can cut them down in a hunter's ambush.

Use this Stratagem after an enemy unit has declared a charge against one or more INDIGAN INFANTRY units from your army. Select another friendly INDIGAN unit within 6" of the unit that is a target of that charge. The selected unit can fire Overwatch as if it were a target of that charge. If the charging unit has a Wounds characteristic of 8 or more, any Overwatch attacks made against that unit in this phase will score hits on rolls of 5+.

Relic: Psy-Hooded Surpanaka
Among Indiga's more exotic fauna, the surpanaka bird projects cruel illusions to lure its victims into a swampy grave. Masked with a psy-hood like a hunting hawk, a tame surpanaka is an envied mark of noble favour.

INDIGAN model only. This model can attempt to manifest one psychic power in each friendly Psychic phase, just as if it were a PSYKER. It knows the Terrifying Visions and Nightshroud powers from the Psykana discipline. If this model would suffer Perils of the Warp, it instead loses the benefits of this Relic for the rest of the battle.

Regimental Order: Herd the fiends! (Tank Order)
Rather than long-distance bombardment, the tanks of Indiga are used in the close confines of mountain and jungle, to drive packs of exotic chimera away from isolated population centres.

The ordered model can make attacks with Blast weapons against units within Engagement Range until the end of the phase. In addition, each time the ordered model makes a ranged attack against an enemy unit that is within Engagement Range in this phase, re-roll a wound roll of 1.

Warlord trait is too good.

Order is weird as hell.

Looks cool, though.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Warlord trait is too good.

Really? I mean, it's only useful against things with 2+ wounds, and of those it's most useful against T6+ models using high-volume low-Strength shots like lasguns. The T'au Trait Through Unity, Devastation does the same thing but with +1 AP, which is much broader and still useful even when Ranger's Eye would be at its best. The main difference is that the T'au version has a 6" range and affects only one enemy unit each turn – but focus-fire is already something the Doctrine encourages, so I went with a shorter range. Against a Leman Russ, Ranger's Eye adds 0.55 wounds to a 10-man rapid firing infantry squad – a single plasma gun adds 0.83.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Order is weird as hell.

Yeeaaaaah I was kind of lost on this, not going to lie. I needed a Tank Order because Bring Them Down was such a shoe-in for infantry, and I couldn't think of anything obvious beyond Elimination Protocols for tanks. I see the Indigans as mostly using Hellhounds and Sentinels for vehicles, neither of whom can take Tank Orders, so I thought about working out some way to keep Leman Russes close to the front lines in the same way – which also works with the Stratagem.

The best idea I came up with was some kind of "drive giant monster away from troops" Order, which span out into "free vehicle charge" with a bonus effect; either the one above, which basically acts as a reversed Get Back In The Fight, or "roll 2D6, if it's less than the target's Wounds characteristic they take D3 mortal wounds". The latter felt too boring and specialized, and I was a little uncomfortable with Orders inflicting mortal wounds. Forced movement isn't something 8e really plays with, but I thought it could be interesting to put into play here – Indigan tanks ride to the rescue!

Except you can Fall Back towards the enemy.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Except you can Fall Back towards the enemy.

Yes, but you can't finish a Fall Back move within 1" of an enemy. So the intended use is that you have models in combat at the start of the turn, charge the enemy with your tank, and force the opponent to Fall Back from the combat, freeing up your models to shoot.

Of course, letting your opponent rush away deeper into your ranks isn't the intended outcome, and it was a pretty niche order to begin with, so it almost certainly needs a second look.

Maybe you could rephrase it to something like this:
"After a succesful charge roll, the ordered tank can move its full rolled charge distance, even if that exceeds the distance to the charged unit. Enemy models in the path of this movement are moved together with the ordered tank."

I think this would be what you intended. On the plus side this could enable to move multiple models away in a direction of your choice. On the other hand I think it is not too powerful since the Leman Russ would end the move in close comvat.

Honestly, I think the concept as a whole is probably too weird and niche to expend the time getting to work. Any other alternatives come to mind for a monster-hunting Tank Order that aren't just "reroll hits against monsters and vehicles"?

How about "The ordered tank can still shoot his weapons at a monstrous unit, even if it is within 1'' of said unit"

It would be a fluffy special effect besides a simple +1, would have its uses especially against carnifexes etc. and still be not to powerful.

Pyroalchi wrote:
How about "The ordered tank can still shoot his weapons at a monstrous unit, even if it is within 1'' of said unit"

It would be a fluffy special effect besides a simple +1, would have its uses especially against carnifexes etc. and still be not to powerful.

That would be a much better order. The doctrine and stratagem are very good imo. As long as the relic doesn't give deny the witch or smite, it's probably good too. Maybe make the warlord trait only affect one enemy unit visible to the bearer for units within 6, make it a bit more like the tau trait.

Pyroalchi wrote:
How about "The ordered tank can still shoot his weapons at a monstrous unit, even if it is within 1'' of said unit"

It would be a fluffy special effect besides a simple +1, would have its uses especially against carnifexes etc. and still be not to powerful.

That works!

I've updated the Warlord Trait to be a mirror of the T'au one, and tweaked the phrasing on the Stratagem.

I've also updated the Order to be more like your suggestion:
"Until the end of the phase, the ordered model can fire any of its weapons while it is within 1" of the enemy, regardless of the weapon’s type. If it does so, it must target enemy units within 1", even if friendly units are within 1" of these units. It cannot fire its turret weapon unless its target is a MONSTER or VEHICLE, and does not benefit from the Grinding Advance ability when doing so."

My concern was that limiting it entirely to monsters and vehicles would be too specific; outside of Tyranids and Daemons, that basically narrows the field down to Dreadnoughts and Dreadnought-equivalents, since most armies don't have monsters and most vehicles don't want to be in close combat anyway. So instead I removed the turret weapon except against giant enemies; it's usable against anyone, but best against monsters. I'm still a little concerned that allowing potentially three heavy flamers to fire on all cylinders against any unit in close combat is too much, though...

In that case simply edit to:

"Until the end of the phase, the ordered model can fire any of its weapons while it is within 1" of the enemy, regardless of the weapon’s type. If it does so, all weapons must target ONE enemy unit within 1", even if friendly units are within 1" of these units. It cannot fire its turret weapon unless its target is a MONSTER or VEHICLE."

Pyroalchi wrote:
In that case simply edit to:

"Until the end of the phase, the ordered model can fire any of its weapons while it is within 1" of the enemy, regardless of the weapon’s type. If it does so, all weapons must target ONE enemy unit within 1", even if friendly units are within 1" of these units. It cannot fire its turret weapon unless its target is a MONSTER or VEHICLE."

No, that's not really what I was getting at - I meant more that the infantry equivalent (Push them back!) allows for, what, 18 lasgun shots and a flamer? So against, say, Marines, that's 1.5 wounds. While this allows for a Leman Russ with three heavy flamers to toss out 3D6 S5 AP-1 hits into close combat, which against Marines is 3.5 wounds. Though I grant you that Marine infantry are unlikely to charge a Leman Russ to begin with, and this is a fairly pricey configuration. Hm.

Maybe i'm missing something, but would it not be simpler to say:

"Until the end of the phase change the weapon type for all weapons in this unit to PISTOL. This unit does not benefit from Grinding Advance in the turn that this order is issued. This order can only be issued when the unit it within 1" of any enemy units."

If you change it to "pistol", than the sponson weapons and the hull weapon do not suffer the -1 from moving and firing that they would usually have. This might be a bit powerfull (but I'm not sure)

Besides: back to your original concern

My concern was that limiting it entirely to monsters and vehicles would be too specific; outside of Tyranids and Daemons, that basically narrows the field down to Dreadnoughts and Dreadnought-equivalents, since most armies don't have monsters and most vehicles don't want to be in close combat anyway.

I don't know if that is really a concern. Yes, usually the other vehicles won't actively seek close combat, but that's the point, isn't it? This way the prefects would be rewarded for seeking close combat themselves.

Pyroalchi wrote:
If you change it to "pistol", than the sponson weapons and the hull weapon do not suffer the -1 from moving and firing that they would usually have. This might be a bit powerfull (but I'm not sure)

Well, that's not really a problem; you shoot before charging, so the only time you'd use this sort of Order is after you get charged and decide not to Fall Back, at which point you haven't moved by definition. Or two turns after you charged and neither side Fell Back, but same difference.

If you don't think the Order is too strong, I guess I'll leave it for now. At the end of the day, I guess most players would just steer clear of combat with their Russ to begin with, so this just encourages you to stay in range for the Monster Bait stratagem. I guess I'm just troubled by the prospect of enemy players having no way to shut down a Russ' shooting beyond bombarding it from afar. Which is pretty endemic to this whole edition anyway, so eh.

RevlidRas wrote:

Pyroalchi wrote:
If you change it to "pistol", than the sponson weapons and the hull weapon do not suffer the -1 from moving and firing that they would usually have. This might be a bit powerfull (but I'm not sure)

Well, that's not really a problem; you shoot before charging, so the only time you'd use this sort of Order is after you get charged and decide not to Fall Back, at which point you haven't moved by definition. Or two turns after you charged and neither side Fell Back, but same difference.

If you don't think the Order is too strong, I guess I'll leave it for now. At the end of the day, I guess most players would just steer clear of combat with their Russ to begin with, so this just encourages you to stay in range for the Monster Bait stratagem. I guess I'm just troubled by the prospect of enemy players having no way to shut down a Russ' shooting beyond bombarding it from afar. Which is pretty endemic to this whole edition anyway, so eh.

Personally I wouldn't worry about the enemy not being able to shut down the tank's shooting by charging it. If you use the PISTOL rules for the weapons then it can only target the unit in combat with it, so it isn't nearly as powerful as a tank with the FLY keyword and there are so many of those.

After some thought about it I think Aash's idea of changing the weapons type to pistol is really good and my concerns were not really necessary

But on the general topic: the whole concept is really interesting and I think it will lead to your regiment having a really individual feel to it.