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Skullcrushers of Khorne
Fast Attack for a Chaos Space Marine Army 12 power
75(?) 2 Skullcrushers M:8" WS:3+ BS:3+ S:6 T:5 W:4 A:3 LD:8 SV:3+
75(?) 1 Skullsmasher M:8" WS:3+ BS:3+ S:6 T:5 W:4 A:4 LD:8 SV:3+
The unit may include up 3 additional Skullcrushers (power +12)
All riders armed with Power Armor, Frag and Krak grenades, Bolt Pistols, and Power Spears
Juggernauts are armed with Bladed Horn
-Power Spear: S:User, AP:-3, D:1. On the charge: S:+1, AP:-4, D:1
-Bladed Horn: S:5, AP:-1, D:1, After the rider attacks the mount may make 3 attacks with this weapon. (*The mount may not fight again as per Blood for the Blood God.)
Abilities: Unstoppable Ferocity, Death to the False Emperor, Bolter Discipline, Devastating Charge, Blood for the Blood God*
---Blood For the Blood God: This unit can fight twice in each fight phase instead of only once
Faction Keywords: Khorne, Daemon(?), Chaos, Heretic Astartes, Chaos, World Eaters
Keywords: Cavalry, Khorne Berzerker, Skullcrushers of Khorne
Notes
---The unit's statline is the result of looking at the bonuses Bloodletters get for being on a juggernaut (+2 attacks, +3 wounds, +1 Toughness, +1 Strength) and adding those bonuses to the Khorne Berzerker. Not even technically as the unit should have 1 more attack across the board if that were the case.
---Bloodcrushers are a "good" unit. They are not absurdly OP I think. This is a little better for the cost not counting the meta factor of the opponent taking one look at the stat line and then throwing everything at them to hopefully kill them (and in 8E they'll drop pretty quick). I think for the points Khorne Berzerkers and especially Bloodletters are dramatically more offensively ridiculous but then I would call those units outright OP.
---A ? implies I'm very unsure about something. The cost is a huge debacle, and whether or not they should be daemons of Khorne (allowing for some disgusting synergy with every khornate HQ and the greater possessed) is an even greater one.

Thoughts?

AFAIK Bloodcrushers are at the very least bad, possibly still trash. Yours seem a lot stronger compared to them, I don't think it's too much. A M8 unit without a transport is going to get shot off the board as you said. To be truly competitive they probably need to go down to around 50, to be on the level of Zerkers, I'd say 60-75.

Look at the Chaos Lord on Juggernaut from the Chaos Index. I don't think Unstoppable Ferocity makes sense and I think Blood for the Blood God is overkill in terms of destructiveness, it's going to be annihilate or get annihilated, not the most fun IMO. If you compare with how the WHFB version worked, they were at least as much tanks as they were blenders and this version you've made is heavily weighted towards the blender side of things. They should definitely be Daemons of Khorne. Most buffs are only going to be half-effective, your S and A are irrelevant to the number of attacks and at what strength the Juggers attack so I wouldn't worry too much about that.

50 points? So for 10 points more than a Plague Drone, you get:

+1 WS
+2 Strength
+2 Attacks
AP-3 on the melee attacks

All for the cost of 10 points, 2" of movement, and losing FNP.

 JNAProductions wrote:
50 points? So for 10 points more than a Plague Drone, you get:

+1 WS
+2 Strength
+2 Attacks
AP-3 on the melee attacks
A minor shooting attack

All for the cost of 10 points, 2" of movement, and losing FNP.

Seems fair due to A) beeing a melee unit and B) beeing a melee unit and C) beeing a melee unit.

 JNAProductions wrote:
50 points? So for 10 points more than a Plague Drone, you get:

+1 WS
+2 Strength
+2 Attacks
AP-3 on the melee attacks
A minor shooting attack

All for the cost of 10 points, 2" of movement, and losing FNP.

*3+ sv vs FNP = somewhere between 1,33x - 0,67x durability.
*Khorne Daemon + World Eaters + Heretic Astartes = WE is useless on these boys, but the option for Warptime, +1 to wound, fight a third time makes these guys generally easier to support than Plague Drones.
*Plague Drones get 1+4=5 attacks, the proposed Skullcrushers get 2x(3+3)=12 attacks 12-5=7.

900 pts for 18 of these I'd pay that in a competitive event, you'd probably pop them turn 2 or 3, on the other hand I'd ram them so far down the battlefield with Warptime that you'd get no objectives and at least one of the units would probably destroy somewhere around 500 pts. 50 is only something I'd recommend if you want to take them against tournament lists, generally people that let you bring this sort of stuff don't care too much about the competitive side of things and may or may not be the best players, I think you'll create bad experiences if you try it out. On the other hand 75 should be completely safe if you warn your opponents that these are Zerkers on roided out unicorns.

*Edit: My math on 3+ Sv was off. It is 1,33x against AP0, 0,89x against AP-1, 0,67 against AP-2 or better.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
50 points? So for 10 points more than a Plague Drone, you get:

+1 WS
+2 Strength
+2 Attacks
AP-3 on the melee attacks
A minor shooting attack

All for the cost of 10 points, 2" of movement, and losing FNP.

Seems fair due to A) beeing a melee unit and B) beeing a melee unit and C) beeing a melee unit.

Wait-I forgot that Plague Drones also have a shooting attack. It also sucks, because guess what?

Plague Drones are a melee unit too!

 vict0988 wrote:
*3+ sv vs FNP = somewhere between 2x - 0,67x durability.
*Khorne Daemon + World Eaters + Heretic Astartes = WE is useless on these boys, but the option for Warptime, +1 to wound, fight a third time makes these guys generally easier to support than Plague Drones.
*Plague Drones get 1+4=5 attacks, the proposed Skullcrushers get 2x(3+3)=12 attacks 12-5=7.

3+ Save vs. a 5++/5+++ is, against AP0, less durable. A 5++/5+++ negates 5/9ths of all wounds, so they're slightly more durable to AP-1, and significantly more to AP-2.

But the Skullcrushers get a lot more higher-quality attacks, as well as all the buffs you mentioned (if you're willing to invest in them). Plague Drones can be buffed too, but only so far.

Don't Plague Drones have Fly though?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Don't Plague Drones have Fly though?

They do. They’re still way worse than these proposed Skullcrushers.

 JNAProductions wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
50 points? So for 10 points more than a Plague Drone, you get:

+1 WS
+2 Strength
+2 Attacks
AP-3 on the melee attacks
A minor shooting attack

All for the cost of 10 points, 2" of movement, and losing FNP.

Seems fair due to A) beeing a melee unit and B) beeing a melee unit and C) beeing a melee unit.

Wait-I forgot that Plague Drones also have a shooting attack. It also sucks, because guess what?

Plague Drones are a melee unit too!

 vict0988 wrote:
*3+ sv vs FNP = somewhere between 2x - 0,67x durability.
*Khorne Daemon + World Eaters + Heretic Astartes = WE is useless on these boys, but the option for Warptime, +1 to wound, fight a third time makes these guys generally easier to support than Plague Drones.
*Plague Drones get 1+4=5 attacks, the proposed Skullcrushers get 2x(3+3)=12 attacks 12-5=7.

3+ Save vs. a 5++/5+++ is, against AP0, less durable. A 5++/5+++ negates 5/9ths of all wounds, so they're slightly more durable to AP-1, and significantly more to AP-2.

But the Skullcrushers get a lot more higher-quality attacks, as well as all the buffs you mentioned (if you're willing to invest in them). Plague Drones can be buffed too, but only so far.

Obvious sarcasm is obvious, well normaly

 JNAProductions wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Don't Plague Drones have Fly though?

They do. They’re still way worse than these proposed Skullcrushers.

Do Plague Drones actually see play though? Like, are they actually good enough to be worth it, or are they a unit we shouldn't be comparing to in the first place because it needs buffs anyway?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Don't Plague Drones have Fly though?

They do. They’re still way worse than these proposed Skullcrushers.

Do Plague Drones actually see play though? Like, are they actually good enough to be worth it, or are they a unit we shouldn't be comparing to in the first place because it needs buffs anyway?

I use 'em.