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Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




Good afternoon all,

So I’ve (fairly) recently got back into 40k and have been steadily been building up two Imperium armies. I haven’t played any games yet so all my knowledge is based off 7th edition and when I last played about 7 years ago - as well as what I think looks cool and I enjoy building.

Basically, if I was to take either of these armies into a match, do you think there is anything I a missing that would cause a problem?

Space marines (ultramarines)
Captain in terminator armour
Librarian
2x tactical squads
2xscout squads (1 sniper squad and 1 general)
2 land speeders (1 with typhoon and 1 with auto cannon)
1x predator with auto cannon and Lascannon
2x rhino
1x razorback with heavy Bolter
1x Stormraven with auto cannon, missiles, Melta and the heavy Bolter sponsons
1x vanguard veteran squad fro close combat
1x venerable dreadnaught with auto cannon

Imperial guard (Cadian)
1x company commander
2x platoon/company commander
1x Tempestus prime
3x command squads
1x Tempestus command squad
5x infantry squads
1x heavy weapon squad (missile launchers)
1x squad of three Ogryns
2x chimera
1x leman Russ punisher with Pask
1x leman Russ Vanquisher
1x leman Russ main battle tank
1x baneblade
2x Valkyrie

My thoughts were a lack of close quarters and leadership in the space marines and insufficient fast attack in the imperial guard? Thanks for any tips team!
[Thumb - 26F4B81D-D918-474E-A6B0-0ED23E9C6A0D.jpeg]

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/09/13 17:02:12


 
   
Made in se
Regular Dakkanaut




Welcome back!
I do not play any Imperium so not sure what everyone is for type. 7th and 8th Ed is so far away from each other so I recommend that you read the rules for 8th including all BRB FAQs.

All armies are built up from detachment and all detachment have requirements and a maximum numbers of hq, troops, heavy and so on they can take. For each detachment you get a number of CP (command points) you can spend on stratagems so your army can do some fun stuff. Example, fight twice, shoot twice, start in reserve and deep strike.

So look at the BRB, build a list and have a go!
At our club we have a man who’s been having a stroke sadly but is so much better now that he wanted to play again. He only got a couple games in 8th before the stroke so he’s new to 8th as well and we are playing without any stratagems accept from reroll for 1CP just so he can come back and learn everything slowly at his own peace.

PS. Things dies in 8th Ed. Fast.
Hope I’ve been too some help.
   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

Welcome to Dakka, and back to 40k.

Your Ultras look like a nice balanced force. For a fun day at the FLGS it should do fine.

A lot depends on how competitive your local meta is. But a TAC list plays pretty much the same as it always has. Wins some, looses some, but rarely has a rock/paper/scissors bad match up.

Obviously, a list built utilizing all the latest hotness and optimized for the currant edition is going to have an edge. But legacy lists from previous times are still playable. Once you get some games in you can get a feel of the new edition and expand appropriately.

I can’t really speak for the guard part.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Competitive or friendly?
That list (I speak to the gaurd side here, as I am a gaurd player) ABSOLUTELY looks fun and useable in friendly play. (How do you get them to stay on the table upside down?)
I don't see the relic of lost cadia, which you will really, really want, or the warlord trait "old grudges". Those are somewhere between awesome and awesomeR in eighth.

If competittive, be aware that most competitive players are optimized to drop a 24 hp t8 s3/4+ knight (basically your baneblade with 4 up invulnerability) that is in cover (they stack them with admech faction to get that even when it stands in the open) in one turn's shooting. Not all can do this, but that is the standard shooty armies seem to meet. So you got to ask yourself "do I feel lucky?" -- and remember you will likely not go first as gaurd against many shooty foes (I am looking at tau's smaller horde size, here)
That same opponent is likely to have an answer for Pask, too, the second turn, which means you spend 600 ish points but only get to fire potentially 200 is of it one time. Similarly, any competitive player army is going to view your heavy missle squad as an obvious target for their entire anti-infantry weaponry section, and it will probably lose its points before it fires. If you distribute the missles among the squads, removing the HWS entirely, your odds of firing those missles go way up. The current meta has a LOT of hovertanks from the admech in it, that drop in a lot of indirect fire, strength 6 shots with some AP on them (each such hovertank fires 3d3 times even without line of sight, so its very hard to hide from them with a heavy weapon squad. They might not target a mortar squad as priority, but a rocket squad? If it were me, I would put enough firepower on it to knock it into next week.

The simple idea of it is, in competive play, everyone has a good bit of anti-armor and a good bit of anti-horde and a good of anti-invunerability if they want to take "all comers" -- and a balanced, fun imperial gaurd list suffers that they can point the anti horde at the troops and the anti tank at the tank. Competitive gaurd armies tend to be mixed in with stuff like a knight, custodes biker command spam, maybe thunderhammer wielding jetpacked marine captains, or similar. So yeah, the gaurd troops drop like flies in the midfield, but the knight or the captains are killing the snot out of whatever is doing it, while it happens, too. 3 Ogryn wouldn't cut that mustard by themselves, simply cause your mirror army? They would be assaulting a knight, or a couple squads of custodes, or a pair of marines with thunderhammers -- all things that laugh at a T5 defense centered around a decent melee save. (and that's just the empire, don't ask what genestealers are up to. ew.)

Certainly I haven't played that many tournaments myself, but I often get half a day off so I watch a couple rounds at the local tournaments. If I saw your army on the board in one I would immediately think "ok, so this guy went first once, maybe fought orcs once and slaughtered them, and just plain outplayed someone once" ... its quite possibly strong enough to do a lot of board control against many opponents, and be resilient against many. Just bear in mind that in competitive play eighth edition seems to punish things done by halves. 3 Ogryn is a suicide squad as they lack shields -- a rarely seen unit that is neither enough muscle to put the enemy down nor enough invulnerability to prevent light fire from picking them off, nor enough of a character to hide behind other units.

My own play, I tend to have "support troops" (at least a few) for their ability to augment the cannon line survival or infantry melee activity.
A single astropath can throw "+1 to save" on the banebeast, or, if it is wiped, on pask, or on the vanquisher (still a pretty powerful unit and a high priority target in your list). with careful positioning and terrain, its quite possiple any of those three will be shooting from around a corner at first, ie, quite possibly in cover vis a vis many enemies. So 3 up armor becomes 2 up becomes a GOOD 2 up that ignores ap-1 and blunts the rest. Suddenly your 3 vulnerable fire support units? Are REALLY hard to kill for a lot of people. (Even harder if you went all in with TWO astros to give the baneblade in cover a 1 up armor equivalency with a -1 to hit and the ability to repair itself 1 (strategem) + d3 (engseer) points per round while slaughtering enemies.) In that situation? People will whack your knight commander first and then maybe have an uphill time with your whole force. Would that much extra mileage from the armor be worth deleting 82 points of dakka? That is your call, of course. Just bear in mind that braketing in this edition tends to mean compettivie players whack a tank down to hit on 6+ only and then can pretty much ignore it. Not so if you do that repair and interlock fields of fire, suddenly 6 only is hitting on 4 up again from shifting back that lowest braket and being cadian.
A single enginseer, tucked behind those three tanks, can slap a few points repair onto whichever one is bracketed before it fires, potentially removing some nasty minuses to hit.
A single, simple index ministerium priest (40 points only) with a power axe? He can ride with the ogryn and give them each a swing extra in meelee, then drop back among the various gaurd groups to give ANY group that falls into combat an extra swing. Sure, its just gaurd ,but its literally a unit that (if you run him into the right spots) doubles the melee potential of your infantry, while using his character nature to avoid being shot, and can heroically intervene into multiple little melees in the midfield. He won't single handedly make your army a melee powerhouse, and tying up all your points in support characters like him, the astropath, the engseer, etc, isn't a great idea either, but if you picked just one and said "this will be my augment" it might stretch one or another capability of the army toward the competitive window. Suddenly being faced with genestealer ambushes means your screens WILL end in combat, for example. Fighting any sort of other imperial gaurd player (usually catachian) means you will want to get every meelee edge you could.

Do I like your army? Hells yes. I often run a mixed gaurdtroop/scion troop group with some armor and two valky (note that in eighth the multiple rocket pods are awesome). Just in competitive play, there are whole armies that are minus 1 to hit, or minus 2 (flyer spam eldar), that people have been playing against for a year. So (for example at NOVA in the GT tournament just recently) many gaurd players brought a couple of hydra along in their parking lot gunline, hoping to shoot eldar fly spam, or custodes biker spam, or those orcs with rockets strapped to their butts. In your list? You have only two things that fly -- so that will concentrate the attention of whatever antifly assets someone has naturally onto the valky transports. (Course, they are still made of hit points, fairly tough, good saves, etc. Note a -1 to hit warp spell from an astropath is awesome as heck on a valky as it rockets forward into the enemy horde's home zone.)

You have a lot of mobility there, which is great, but be aware that the tempest troops (if you deepstrike them in) miss out on turn one shooting, and because of the very odd way tempest troops arrive if deepstriking, they can't short range fire hotshot laswers beyond 9 inches, hotshot volleyguns fire at a minus after moving, so deepstruck psions tend to do their very best with command squads that favor plasma or meltas, dropping in at 10 inches and deleting something. I gather in previous editions this little technical wrinkle wasn't as big a hindrance for the t'squads.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/09/14 16:25:57


Guard gaurd gAAAARDity Gaurd gaurd.  
   
 
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