Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

If melts bombs were a cheap upgrade for chaos space marines I feel like it would actually make them fun to put on the table. Also make meltaguns cheap again... imagine running up the board, meltangunning a vehicle then slapping a melta bomb on that tank? You would average 8 wounds... this with properly priced meltaguns may make standard marines a viable troop option.

For Chaos Space Marines I just want the option back to take Bolter, Boltpistol AND Chainsword like you used to be able to. If they did, I'd Pay for it on all my base marines as my night lords would stand to benefit greatly from this.

I mean chosen are 1ppm more and get 1 more attack the Bolter pistol chai sword and all the special and melee weapons, and a heavy. The only thing they don’t get is troop perks.

I keep forgetting melta bombs exist to be honest. 5 points currently isn't too bad, it's the 3" range that kills it. If the range is that low at least let it auto hit

macluvin wrote:
I mean chosen are 1ppm more and get 1 more attack the Bolter pistol chai sword and all the special and melee weapons, and a heavy. The only thing they don’t get is troop perks.

Except therein lies the problem, They're just marines with an extra attack and a chainsword and nothing else. Sure they have the option to start taking special weapons but once you do they easily become a priority target because of the cost to effectiveness ratio.

This means you're either stuck with loaded up units that are going to be shot off the board first turn or you're wasting Elite spots on units that are just your core infantry with 2 extra melee attacks which is a pretty poor trade-off.

The advantage of having basic CSM with chainswords is that it is pretty easy for them to slip under the radar when your opponent is focusing other units and actually threaten units in all engagements.

I mean 3 melee attacks once you factor the free chainsword. Slap a combibolter on each one and you’ve basically what a chaos space marine squad should look like on paper this addition IMO. It’s cheap enough to not be a big deal if they shoot it off the table, but also nice and shooty and choppy. Chaos space marines need something though to make them viable the way they were meant to be. A 1ppm upgrade to a chainsword isn’t the right answer. And I doubt that GW will ever break from the 13ppm MEQ tax... ergo the cheap melta bomb. And the cheap meltaguns. At which point the bolters would be worthless in the squad anyways. Night lords need to get close and the Bolter is only holding the csm troop squad back with leadership debuff bubbles and melta bombs and 2 meltaguns.. But that’s assuming that it became cheap to turn a base chaos space marine squad into vehicle wreckers. It would also be nice if the Bolter and MEQ platform worked as well as they should. If you play casually, though, have you considered asking to run CSM with all three weapons at 14ppm? Maybe even provide a 7th edition codex to provide a precedent?

macluvin wrote:
I mean 3 melee attacks once you factor the free chainsword. Slap a combibolter on each one and you’ve basically what a chaos space marine squad should look like on paper this addition IMO. It’s cheap enough to not be a big deal if they shoot it off the table, but also nice and shooty and choppy. Chaos space marines need something though to make them viable the way they were meant to be. A 1ppm upgrade to a chainsword isn’t the right answer. And I doubt that GW will ever break from the 13ppm MEQ tax... ergo the cheap melta bomb. And the cheap meltaguns. At which point the bolters would be worthless in the squad anyways. Night lords need to get close and the Bolter is only holding the csm troop squad back with leadership debuff bubbles and melta bombs and 2 meltaguns.. But that’s assuming that it became cheap to turn a base chaos space marine squad into vehicle wreckers. It would also be nice if the Bolter and MEQ platform worked as well as they should. If you play casually, though, have you considered asking to run CSM with all three weapons at 14ppm? Maybe even provide a 7th edition codex to provide a precedent?

Why not eliminate chosen from the elites slot and give csm chosen stats and weapon options? Even if you kept the chosen price you at least get better troops.

Raptors should have vanguard veterans stats. Once again even with a points increase they would be more usable.

And a big yes to melta bombs. For both.

That isn’t a half bad idea. I have no idea why raptors don’t have at least more attacks on their profile. Melta bombs would be nice on them too.

Gadzilla666 wrote:

macluvin wrote:
I mean 3 melee attacks once you factor the free chainsword. Slap a combibolter on each one and you’ve basically what a chaos space marine squad should look like on paper this addition IMO. It’s cheap enough to not be a big deal if they shoot it off the table, but also nice and shooty and choppy. Chaos space marines need something though to make them viable the way they were meant to be. A 1ppm upgrade to a chainsword isn’t the right answer. And I doubt that GW will ever break from the 13ppm MEQ tax... ergo the cheap melta bomb. And the cheap meltaguns. At which point the bolters would be worthless in the squad anyways. Night lords need to get close and the Bolter is only holding the csm troop squad back with leadership debuff bubbles and melta bombs and 2 meltaguns.. But that’s assuming that it became cheap to turn a base chaos space marine squad into vehicle wreckers. It would also be nice if the Bolter and MEQ platform worked as well as they should. If you play casually, though, have you considered asking to run CSM with all three weapons at 14ppm? Maybe even provide a 7th edition codex to provide a precedent?

Why not eliminate chosen from the elites slot and give csm chosen stats and weapon options? Even if you kept the chosen price you at least get better troops.

Raptors should have vanguard veterans stats. Once again even with a points increase they would be more usable.

And a big yes to melta bombs. For both.

Eh. Something feels odd about assuming that all chaos marines are automatically more powerful than their loyalist counterparts. I get that some chaos marines are much more experienced, empowered by chaos, etc. But certainly not all of them. Why would a tac marine suddenly gain a veteran equivalent (chosen) statline just for twirling his moustache more? That said, straight up turning chosen into troops (possibly even upping their wounds to reflect plot armor) would be fine by me. There should probably be a way to play "veteran" chaos marines as well as a way to play the fresh-faced renegades.

9

Wyldhunt wrote:

Gadzilla666 wrote:

macluvin wrote:
I mean 3 melee attacks once you factor the free chainsword. Slap a combibolter on each one and you’ve basically what a chaos space marine squad should look like on paper this addition IMO. It’s cheap enough to not be a big deal if they shoot it off the table, but also nice and shooty and choppy. Chaos space marines need something though to make them viable the way they were meant to be. A 1ppm upgrade to a chainsword isn’t the right answer. And I doubt that GW will ever break from the 13ppm MEQ tax... ergo the cheap melta bomb. And the cheap meltaguns. At which point the bolters would be worthless in the squad anyways. Night lords need to get close and the Bolter is only holding the csm troop squad back with leadership debuff bubbles and melta bombs and 2 meltaguns.. But that’s assuming that it became cheap to turn a base chaos space marine squad into vehicle wreckers. It would also be nice if the Bolter and MEQ platform worked as well as they should. If you play casually, though, have you considered asking to run CSM with all three weapons at 14ppm? Maybe even provide a 7th edition codex to provide a precedent?

Why not eliminate chosen from the elites slot and give csm chosen stats and weapon options? Even if you kept the chosen price you at least get better troops.

Raptors should have vanguard veterans stats. Once again even with a points increase they would be more usable.

And a big yes to melta bombs. For both.

Eh. Something feels odd about assuming that all chaos marines are automatically more powerful than their loyalist counterparts. I get that some chaos marines are much more experienced, empowered by chaos, etc. But certainly not all of them. Why would a tac marine suddenly gain a veteran equivalent (chosen) statline just for twirling his moustache more? That said, straight up turning chosen into troops (possibly even upping their wounds to reflect plot armor) would be fine by me. There should probably be a way to play "veteran" chaos marines as well as a way to play the fresh-faced renegades.

Legion csm become votlw just like 7th. You could balance it with points especially if you do give them an extra wound.

Same with raptors. Especially if they're night lords. Was really hoping for a night raptors strategem in faith and fury like the world eaters red butchers strategem.

Nah, they would just need a different profile to regular Terminators if you're gonna design them similar to the 30k ones. Not everyone HAS to be Berserker level.

It would be nice to see raptors with 2 attacks base... 4 attacks on the charge would make them suck so much less in combat, which is where they are supposed to want to be. Terminators could use a bump there too... or a points drop.

macluvin wrote:
It would be nice to see raptors with 2 attacks base... 4 attacks on the charge would make them suck so much less in combat, which is where they are supposed to want to be. Terminators could use a bump there too... or a points drop.

Give raptors the night raptor's onslaught rule from hh. D3 extra attacks on the charge. That would make them work.

Nah, they need to be able to buy Power Weapons too. 3 attacks on the charge with a Power Weapon isn't a terrible deal at their price point.