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Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




Asking because of a rules interaction with the Repressor, a forge world vehicle, and possibly other vehicles that let you shoot out while embarked.
The Repressor, (and possibly others,) state:
"Up to 6 models embarked on this model can attack in their Shooting phase. Measure the range and draw line of sight from any point on this model. When they do so, any restrictions or modifiers that apply to this model also apply to its passengers; etc..."

(This is from the FW FAQ.)

So, is the word "Modifier" defined anywhere? Is replacing a stat completely, (For example, replacing the shots from a Flamer weapon with a 6) a modifier? If so, where is this defined?

Not looking for RAI interpretation, just a citation if one exists. If it's up to RAI, I'll ask TOs on a case-by-case basis.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Waaaghpower wrote:
Asking because of a rules interaction with the Repressor, a forge world vehicle, and possibly other vehicles that let you shoot out while embarked.
The Repressor, (and possibly others,) state:
"Up to 6 models embarked on this model can attack in their Shooting phase. Measure the range and draw line of sight from any point on this model. When they do so, any restrictions or modifiers that apply to this model also apply to its passengers; etc..."

(This is from the FW FAQ.)

So, is the word "Modifier" defined anywhere? Is replacing a stat completely, (For example, replacing the shots from a Flamer weapon with a 6) a modifier? If so, where is this defined?

Not looking for RAI interpretation, just a citation if one exists. If it's up to RAI, I'll ask TOs on a case-by-case basis.


Well, from the Designer's commentary in the Main Rulebook FAQ (page 3) we get an idea of what they are calling modifiers:

"Q: If a rule modifies a model’s Strength characteristic, and that
model is equipped with a melee weapon that also has a modifier
(e.g. ‘x2’), could you explain the order in which the modifiers
are applied to the characteristics and the weapon’s Strength?
A: First you must determine the model’s current
Strength characteristic. To do so apply all modifiers
to it that multiply or divide the value, then apply any that add or subtract to it. Having done this, you
then modify this value as described by the weapon’s
Strength characteristic.

For example, let’s imagine a model with a basic Strength
characteristic of 3 is under the effects of two psychic powers: a
friendly one that doubles their Strength characteristic, and an
enemy one that subtracts 1 from their Strength characteristic.
That model’s current Strength is therefore 5. If this model then
fights with a weapon like a power fist, which has a Strength
characteristic of ‘x2’, that attack will therefore be resolved at
Strength 10."

They list multiplication, division, addition and subtraction as modifiers. They do not mention substitution as a modifier.
   
Made in gb
Norn Queen






doctortom hit the nail on the head here. A modifier is explicitly an arithmetic modification of a value. Replacements are not modifiers. See also the sidebar "Modifying Characteristics" in the BRB.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/09 20:51:00


 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Cardiff

Substituting is substituting, not modifying. Modifying is modifying. It’s not anything you need a citation for - the English language tells you what it means.

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in us
Deranged Necron Destroyer





 JohnnyHell wrote:
Substituting is substituting, not modifying. Modifying is modifying. It’s not anything you need a citation for - the English language tells you what it means.



modify means to change substituting is a type of change. so saying the English language tells you what it means doesn't help that much. but i would agree that within the game substituting is not a modification in this case

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/10 05:00:19


It's easy to assume that people arguing an interpretation you disagree with are just looking for an advantage for themselves... But it's quite often not the case.  
   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




Thanks. This is what I thought, (that it's implied by the wording but never explicitly stated,) but it's good to have confirmation. I've emailed the FAQ team asking for an explicit definition and will be asking TOs in the meantime.
   
 
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