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Been playing my IH dreadnought list, and I like it, but me being me, I can never stop changing and evolving my list, so here goes another form of it. I'm trying something new(to me) with it, and that's downsizing my 'star' and replacing some dreads with Centurions to funnel wounds into and provide a counter-charge unit to deter charges.

So the game plan is to have the Leviathan become a character and have him march up the field guarded by the 6 Centurions. The other support characters follow along. The chaplain dreads can either join the mini star or be deployed around the 3 TFCs, spreading out, forming their own mini fire bases. Ironstone goes on the Leviathan(surprise), and through Duty Eternal, and Cogitated Martyrdom can effectively reduce damage and pass it off to the surrounding Assault Centurions if needed. The cents can be shielded by Transhuman Physiology, and receive a 5++ and a 5+++ while the apothecary hugs them. When they eventually do go down, they can be brought back by him as well. They(the cents), provide screen clearing as well if the TFCs need help with it.

It all plays out quite nicely in my head, and I really just want to field my favourite dreadnought. Play testing will show if this is viable or not. In the meanwhile please feel free to weigh in on this list! Thanks

Iron Hands Successor Battalion Detachment(Master Artisans, Stealthy):

HQ:

Chaplain Venerable Dreadnought / Catechism of Fire / Litany of Hate / Twin Lascannon

Chaplain Venerable Dreadnought / Recitation of Focus / Litany of Hate / Twin Lascannon

Chaplain Venerable Dreadnought / Mantra of Strength / Litany of Hate / WL / The Imperium's Sword / Twin Lascannon


Troops:

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Combat knife / Sniper rifle
--Scouts(4) / Sniper Rifle(4)

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Combat knife / Sniper rifle
--Scouts(4) / Sniper Rifle(4)

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Combat knife / Sniper rifle
--Scouts(4) / Sniper Rifle(4)


Iron Hands Battalion Detachment:

HQ:

Chapter Master / Bolt pistol / Chainsword / The Ironstone / Chapter Master

Primaris Lieutenant / Master-crafted Auto Bolt Rifle


Troops:

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Bolt pistol / Boltgun
--Scouts(4) / Boltgun(4)

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Bolt pistol / Boltgun
--Scouts(4) / Boltgun(4)

Scout Squad(5)
-Scout Sergeant / Bolt pistol / Boltgun
--Scouts(4) / Boltgun(4)


Elites:

Centurion Assault Squad(6)
-Centurion Sergeant / Hurricane Bolter / Flamer(2)
--Centurions(5) / Hurricane Bolter(5) / Flamer(10)

Primaris Apothecary / Hero of the Chapter / Father of the Future / Healer's Aegis / Chief Apothecary


Iron Hands Spearhead Detachment:

HQ:

Techmarine / Boltgun / Servo-arm / Master of the Forge


Heavy Support:

Relic Leviathan Dreadnought / Heavy Flamer(2) / Storm Cannon Array(2)

Thunderfire Cannon

Thunderfire Cannon

Thunderfire Cannon

total: 2000pts / 14-6CPs

Coming from a purely competitive view point.....the problem I see with this list is that you dont have good screening/speed bumps for such a short ranged and slow army. .

You have 6 las cannon shots that are your only way to deal with targets that are staying out of range of your charge and storm cannons.

Most players/armies will Kite this list and likely are better at taking and dealing ranged damage. Knights, tank commanders, artillery spam, repulsor Executioners, sniper spam....

You need to be able to force a player to allow you to play to your strengths. Which I dont think this list will do. Deployment will also likely screw up your strategy. Vanguard captain, alpha legion and red corsairs also.have rules to redeploy lots of units after you've completely set up. A knight could easily pick off the leviathan or centurians in a turn

Try running this as Blood Angel's. Swap 2 of the chaplains for librarian dreads.

deathtoxenos wrote:
Coming from a purely competitive view point.....the problem I see with this list is that you dont have good screening/speed bumps for such a short ranged and slow army. .

You have 6 las cannon shots that are your only way to deal with targets that are staying out of range of your charge and storm cannons.

Most players/armies will Kite this list and likely are better at taking and dealing ranged damage. Knights, tank commanders, artillery spam, repulsor Executioners, sniper spam....

You need to be able to force a player to allow you to play to your strengths. Which I dont think this list will do. Deployment will also likely screw up your strategy. Vanguard captain, alpha legion and red corsairs also.have rules to redeploy lots of units after you've completely set up. A knight could easily pick off the leviathan or centurians in a turn

Try running this as Blood Angel's. Swap 2 of the chaplains for librarian dreads.

The 'star' is more about board control. Yes it's slow, yes it has short range, but what I think you're mistaken in, is it's capability to by nigh impervious to damage. It'll simply force the opponent to either get pushed back, or commit to engaging it and facing the consequences. Meanwhile the rest of the army chips away at the enemy scorers via TFCs, while scoring myself. It's more of an attrition style of list. Enemy snipers would be priority target for my TFCs at the beginning of the game, but even if they do have shots at my supporting characters, the quasi look out sir stratagem has a good chance of keeping them safe until the snipers are taken care of. Gonna play test it soon and see what the results are.

A small note, as your a successor chapter you do not have the flesh is weak trait and as such your apothecary feel no pain on infantry is limited to a 6+. Also your overwatch is on 6's and you can't use specific Iron Hand stratagems.

I think your star might be too points heavy. While it might be nigh impervious to damage, it also is almost half your army. And the damage output it can do is 'limited' to the shots of the Leviathan.

Also as your opponent has no other real threats to consider a whole lot of hurt can be put into this star. And due to the amount of characters supporting it, it will be difficult to screen those.

How well it does will ultimately depend on the type of missions you play.

DutchSage wrote:
A small note, as your a successor chapter you do not have the flesh is weak trait and as such your apothecary feel no pain on infantry is limited to a 6+. Also your overwatch is on 6's and you can't use specific Iron Hand stratagems.

I think your star might be too points heavy. While it might be nigh impervious to damage, it also is almost half your army. And the damage output it can do is 'limited' to the shots of the Leviathan.

Also as your opponent has no other real threats to consider a whole lot of hurt can be put into this star. And due to the amount of characters supporting it, it will be difficult to screen those.

How well it does will ultimately depend on the type of missions you play.

I might be missing something here, but what IH stratagems can I not use as a IH successor? Also the characters and Centurions are OG Iron Hands?

Thought you couldn't use some stratagems, but re-reading I can't find anything (with the exception of the 'optimal repulsion doctrines' stratagem).

Also missed the mix of original Iron Hands with a successor chapter. I do think you loose the super doctrine 'Calculated Fury' if you do so. This because it mentions every unit has to be Iron Hands OR every unit has to be from the same successor chapter.

DutchSage wrote:
Thought you couldn't use some stratagems, but re-reading I can't find anything (with the exception of the 'optimal repulsion doctrines' stratagem).

Also missed the mix of original Iron Hands with a successor chapter. I do think you loose the super doctrine 'Calculated Fury' if you do so. This because it mentions every unit has to be Iron Hands OR every unit has to be from the same successor chapter.

Yeah, I remember reading that too and being a bit confused, as even the successor chapters obviously retain the Iron Hands keyword. If somebody knows and reads this, please share!

My very competitive friends assure me that the successors have access to all ironhands stratagems, with sort of one exception, they can't take the "ironhands only" relics like the axe of the medusa. Those require extra strategems to acquire for successor chapters.
They are also unable to take named ironhands characters liek the Ferrios.

This is much more important in the competitive ravengaurd scene, where the flash redeployment + 11 inch flamer combination has been quite fashionable and a terrifically painful alpha strike for any gaurd troops to bear.

Spoken as gaurd troops!