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Personally for boyz Mobs I'd go big choppa for the cheapness. I wouldn't expect more than 1 out of 2 boyz units to actually make it into combat unless they're full sized ones. And even then units like the new gladiator tank make that look unlikely.

Nobz Mobs would be the ones to get those expensive, killy options due to having higher armour.

russellmoo wrote:
When it comes to the Morkanaut, would it be worth it to run a weirdboy with the scorched git bones next to thirty orks to ensure the double shot from visions in the smoke? Thoughts

This would leave you with needing to roll a five to get what you need. The downside is that you are likely to perils so is it worth it?

Sadly I don't think the weirdboy relic works for any of the spells except the 6 base ork ones. Just because of it's wording.

I suppose you could get some milage out of it if you made them a warphead then tried to cast jump and warpath or fist and warpath or something similar. Or maybe we'll get lucky and the next codex will simply make it affect physic tests.

 Elfric wrote:
I think a Flashgitz mono list has massive potential now

Yeah, waiting to see exactly how MSU the meta is going to be. Even though the loss of dreadmob hurts the list I used you could still cause some chaos with a few of the better Kustom jobs.

There could also be the clutch edge cases where you can shuffle lines of sight as needed. Or help you push screens in the way of assault units. Not going to happen every game, but hey it'll be fun when it does pay off.

I'm surprised he didn't slap the Kustom Job Gorks Roar on there too. Just to let the watrike contribute a little more as he does his thing.

Do you not get the CP back if you have your warlord in an outrider detachment perhaps? If he also won while having 3 CP less than his opponent that means he did pretty well for himself.

Also time costs. It's a lot faster to roll the wound rolls for the KMK than the same number of SG.

If you have a painboy of the same klan as ghaz nearby you can use the Medisquig stratagem to heal d3 wounds back on the boss. Due to the wording on that strat you can use it on non-vehicles if I recall.

 Jidmah wrote:
It actually works on any character, so it can heal the wartrike or a stompa that was made a character as well.

The wartrike one makes sense I suppose. Being it's just 2 lads sitting ontop of a rocket sled they're likely to catch a bullet or two. But the stompa? The more you try to envision it the funnier it gets. Maybe if the stompa is powered by a few orks on a hamster wheel it'd work.

I mean, with 500 pts it's more a question. Do I want a balanced troop list or do I want to spam something. At that point it's just a case of supporting what you want to spam.

I guess if you want mek gun grot mobs maybe just some supporting chaff grots with your mek Gunz? Maybe a big Mek to perform the odd fixing on any guns with remaining wounds and to fill out your HQ selection? If you have them you could possibly take some grot tanks/Kanz to be your outriders?

tulun wrote:

 ArmchairArbiter wrote:
It is funny that the buggy list is now getting a ton of attention. I was advocating for this back in the middle of 8th... but I always play mission focused, 9th has just built the game around how I play I guess.

I tend to play casual lists unless I am at a tournament - so hopefully my buggy list doesn't get called out for being a try-hard list now lol. Then again, I bring a real variety - not just the min/max buggies.

Interested to see how the Ork tactics continue to evolve.

Honestly, in ITC, this list probably did poorly. This list won't necessarily kill you, but it can make your life miserable trying to hold the mid board.

Because killing is not the focus of the new missions, this style of list will do better.

General question for all -- The guy used the bikers as a backfield objective camper. That seems interesting to me. How many nob bikers do you think would effective? I feel like 10 bikers is overkill.

I mean, personally I wouldn't want to go over 5, especially for objective campers. Most weapons that have blast would also be exceptionally effective against ork bikers even if they are under a KFF. But 5 of them is still a decent chunk of wounds and toughness for the enemy to chew through.

tulun wrote:

cody.d. wrote:

I mean, personally I wouldn't want to go over 5, especially for objective campers. Most weapons that have blast would also be exceptionally effective against ork bikers even if they are under a KFF. But 5 of them is still a decent chunk of wounds and toughness for the enemy to chew through.

Actually, the goonhammer people had a good point about the bikes too.

"The Bikers I assume are a horde-clearing option – this list feels a little vulnerable to tarpitting if it runs into enemies who are still on a horde plan, so having a unit that can throw down a big volley with More Dakka and plausibly punch up against light vehicles with Wreckers is handy."

The advantage of 10 bikes is 60 shots and they get around 30 attacks each (+1 with the nob) -- you could field 5 nob bikers at 185 (give the boss a Kill saw) and get 21 Str 5 attacks, and 3 Kill saw attacks if you need these guys out in a pinch. Saves 95 points, has 5 less wounds, but these are plenty efficient. Potentially str 6 too with the strat, meaning you might wound a lot of horde stuff on 2s.

Slapping out more dakka on a big unit of freeboota bikers would be pretty fun in it's own regard. But yeah as with most units, if you plan to use stratagems on them and can protect them bigger is better. But if you want little objective campers perhaps multiple smaller ones would be a safer bet?

As for nob bikers, I'm torn. On one side Meganobs feel cheaper and more durable but bikers can get away with less support due to their speed and dakka gunz. I mean, I have a decent amount of both so perhaps when I can get more games in I can test out both a few times.

Has anyone had much luck with using trukkboyz so far? Still thinking it's worth the investment for the various uses they offer while dumping the lads onto objectives.

Thinking about what to support them with. Weirdboyz aren't as needed with those troops you could back them up with bikerbosses or wartrikes to do some lifting or simply leave them as a distraction of sorts while other aspects of the list do the work.

 Emicrania wrote:
So guys, I just ended the fun task of going thru ALL orks unit in the codex, PA and FW index with the new rules and update points.
I made an excel with various checklists as if the unit can DS for free, has an innate ability to deliver MW, price per W and so on.

Please do check it and give some feedback, during this month I will open a ork page on FB only for competitive play, with the hope to get more people to pitch in.
Any feedback is welcome.

When I have the time and the energy I will do an unit analysis on Mathammer in order to see if there are some good investment that we might not see yet.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14omPIpoERd9ywXmQ8ptxMNjL5nHezrX1UwPTIRyRn7o/edit?usp=sharing

Seems like there is a lot of shorthand, colour coding and markings. Is there a list of their meanings somewhere I missed?

Hmm, the look out sir rules changes does hurt a fair bit. Means dreads can't hide characters either huh? Though would units of deffkoptas?

 Geemoney wrote:
Are there any HQ's left that we can even use in a mechanized list?

Biker Boss is gone, wartrike will just die now...

Yeah it's a bit difficult to say. You could put a warboss or weirdboy in a transport of some kind. Try to bait the enemy into shooting the trukk filled with boyz rather than the wagon with some mega nobz in it by sticking the boss in the cheaper vehicle? Could also use Da jump to get said boss where you want them to be in time with the other units? Nothing ideal I know.

Unless that Mystery Ork turns out to be something perfect for the gap left?

 Vineheart01 wrote:
what mystery ork? you mean the very clearly a new boy sculpt they showed off or the tiny saw on a stick thing we still dunno where it came from?
If i had a guess that tiny saw on a stick is a new bigchoppa variant and nothing else. Killsaw ap/damage but only +1str perhaps.

terminators are going to 3w....

I dunno, of the models showed off at the same time none of them particularly screamed unit, more lieutenant level thing. Like the new SOB they actually named.

It's a fair point. if they are going to increase wound counts who is going to be considered for said wound count and how are they going to implement it and when? When the marines we keep seeing these leaks datasheets are released perhaps? Will there be a big errata increasing the wound statistic for each army that will then be included in the eventual codex release?

Or will each army just have to twiddle their thumbs until their codex comes out. Like last edition waiting for faction rules and stratagems.

And what will get it? Medium infantry only perhaps? It'd be horrible to imagine guard infantry with 2 wounds a pop. And grots with it is just laughable. Ork boys? Maybe. You'd certainly hope nobs would get an extra wound because that's the only thing that stood them out from marines for many, many editions. Having our buggies get one or 2 a piece would be awesome, it'd let you hide the speedboss again, unless he got bumped up over the hiding margin as well, a pain in it's own right. Would stompas go to an even more laughable wound level? 60 wounds and still not worth it weeee!

Very, very curious what the next month or so will bring. This could lower lethality, as long as GW doesn't go nuts and give all chainswords -1ap and all powerweapons +1str and heavy melee weapons extra damage. Oh.... wait. Still intrigued though.

Also, people have mentioned that the look out sir has been modified and even the community page brought in orks and speedbosses. But unless i'm misunderstanding it changes very little for buggies hiding the speedboss as they become individual units correct? So it's still a -9 wound character unable to hide behind -10 wound vehicles. Only when you take vehicles that stay in a unit such as kans or koptas does it work correct? 2 koptas in a unit being able to hide said speedboss.

NVM, I was combining the 1st and 2nd lines to derp it up.

From the tiny glimpse of the model we saw it looked like the ork model teased was going to be bare chested with very little armor on the legs with what looked to be a squig shoulder pad right? Of if he was some sort of squig herder and they gave us a squig unit that would be very fun.

I mean, if they wanted they could easily port over the iron jawz stuff into 40K like they did with the Tzeentchian stuff to ThousandSons. A sort of half way between nobs and meganobs. Less armor, more wounds and more big choppa type attacks. (or somewhere in that area.)

I still want to see some squig units. A faster, lighter infantry mulching option. Mind you we still don't lack the ability to kill infantry with most list types, but i'd like more options to support the midfield. You can jump a big unit of boyz or nobs into the opponants side. But then the question is, what's supporting them to get that critical threat saturation? Stormboyz, bikers, deffkoptas maybe? But none of those options would be considered incredible efficiency. Maybe you could zoom a bunch of vehicles up there? A trio of shokkjumps with the kustom job wouldn't be a bad option for first turn saturation.

I'm of two minds about making boyz 2 wounds and upping their cost. Ork boyz durability has always been their pts to wounds ratio. Having more bodies than your opponent has bullets before they get overwhelmed. If boyz get more wounds they're going to be more vulnerable to the D2 weapons that are already fairly common and likely to get even more common as multi wound models fill the meta.

So seems like a fair few people are getting the vibe that boyz in trukks just don't hold enough impact, and well all know in their current status grots are hilariously over priced.

Do you peeps reckon it's worth biting the CP bullet and building around one of the detachments that don't give you CP back? That's an extra couple hundred points you can use for other units in other slots. Mind you i'm not a deffskull player so can't really just plonk any old infantry with obsec onto an objective.

Maybe if they had something to better represent the crunching charge a unit of boys strapped to rockets would have. Though unless you jump a footboss up the field it's unlikely they'll ever need to advance nowdays so less likely to lose that 1/6 boyz.

Perhaps a strength of ap bonus for charging? Extra attack or even mortal wounds at the cost of a model? Something along those lines.

But yeah, compared to commandos in their current state stormboyz have little going for them. IMO their main strength was being able to charge super reliably turn 1 with a 20" move under speedfreaks.

I think Lootas have sort of fallen out of favor. They can slap out damage for sure, but require protection, CP investment and are so incredibly swingy.

I would have pointed more to the various stratagems that can cancel stratagems. Meaning grot shields aren't reliable any more. (Grots going up in points and not being as mandatory to fill out detachments certainly doesn't help.)

Personally I've really taken a shine to tankbustas. A lot of the same issues but better Str, AP and damage, with a re-roll against their preferred target. Yeah you get less shots but at least you know exactly how many you're getting so you can build a plan around them. Kind of wish their ability worked against monsters as well though. Makes sense thematically and you don't feel hamstringed when you come across the odd tau or nid player.

Finally got a game of 9th yay! Bloody virus.

Was 1K I took a trio of trukkboys with a rokkit and big choopa nob with a forktress rolla wagon filled with 4 meganobs and a biggest boss (And a KFF mek hanging about). I made them evil suns mostly because it felt like the extra movement would be handy here and there.

He took farsight tau with a bunch of breachers, drones and a pair of commanders and a pair of ghostkeels.

Trukks do feel decently tanky in small sized games, he only managed to kill one and the wagon by the end. Tried having 2 choppa boyz mobs driving forward while a shoota boyz mob camped an objective near my deployment. Throwing trukks into combat with things is damn helpful, fly isn't the auto win button it used to be so you can actually reduce the enemies firepower in a decent exchange. Biggest boss is absolutely awesome, as are meganobs. Sadly the forktress got his ass blown up by the fusionkeel.

Still not sure what secondaries are good for orks to achieve, but managed to win about 62 to 48 and in the last few turns killed pretty much everything he had with the nob sergeants left over from the boyz after the lads caught a bunch of bullets. Moral doesn't feel as brutal as it could last edition, you lose 6 boyz in a small unit and you're not guaranteed to lose the rest.

Even those don't hit as hard as they used to in 9th. Swinging killsaws at stuff with -1s to hit is a good feeling since it's just 4s now rather than hah you took an expensive specialist weapon? You're hitting on 6s now biatch.

Still keen to see how many statlines change for the orks (Whenever the mork that happens) Will Klaws and saws change to match Pfists for imperium? Will big shootas and big choppas get a change perhaps?