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Hey, I like the list, have you considered any particular hive fleet? It could go well with Leviathan, with all the multi wound models. My experience with swarmlord is that it will be targeted very early, and maybe add some tyrant guard with it.
Small warrior units got low damage output and are not really fast.
Better to pick one big warrior unit (-1 damage stratagem). Could even move it forward with swarmlord- movement bonus.
Swarmlord doesn't really add a lot to the list. Expensive bull's eye.
Spreelock wrote: Hey, I like the list, have you considered any particular hive fleet? It could go well with Leviathan, with all the multi wound models. My experience with swarmlord is that it will be targeted very early, and maybe add some tyrant guard with it.
Hello, Leviathan, for sure
Small warrior units got low damage output and are not really fast.
Better to pick one big warrior unit (-1 damage stratagem). Could even move it forward with swarmlord- movement bonus.
Swarmlord doesn't really add a lot to the list. Expensive bull's eye.
I would pick 1x 9 warriors and 2 ripper squads for the minimum troops. The 9 warriors can get -1 damage stratagem, ignore -1 and -2 ap upgrade (adeptive physiology), and catalyst (5+ feel no pain). You can even use meta... overdrive stratagem to move faster.
I would then drop the vennomthropes and swarmlord for a malanthrope and that would give you a lot more points for offensive units.
BTW: Hive guard needs to have at least one big unit, because you got a ' shoot twice' stratagem.
shogun wrote: I would pick 1x 9 warriors and 2 ripper squads for the minimum troops. The 9 warriors can get -1 damage stratagem, ignore -1 and -2 ap upgrade (adeptive physiology), and catalyst (5+ feel no pain). You can even use meta... overdrive stratagem to move faster.
I would then drop the vennomthropes and swarmlord for a malanthrope and that would give you a lot more points for offensive units.
BTW: Hive guard needs to have at least one big unit, because you got a ' shoot twice' stratagem.
3 of the warriors in a unit of 9 can have venom cannons which are dope.
What will be the purpose of raveners? I don't like them, if you need to have them keep them cheap, no deathspitters and just basic scytals.
Rupture cannon looks amazing on paper, but then you miss 50% and you only end up with 3 hits which is a terrible ration for the points. Might want to switch that to acid spray and have it dominate the midfield instead.
Not ambitious at all. You can give the warriors the ignore ap-1 and ap-2 power, stick them into a terrain piece and give them catalyst. Suddenly you have 3 wound bodies with practically unmodified 3+/6++/ 5+++ save, who have 3d3 missiles and lots of heavy bolter shots, are pretty darn good in hth and can get the stratagem to reduce damage by 1 if they need be. In close combat every warrior has 4 attacks, 2+ to hit and ap-2.
I would personally change the Hive Fleet to Kronos, because symbiostorm is really strong with units that get +1 to hit like the Exocrine and the warriors.
With PA tyranid warriors became a legitimate threat and together with an Acid spray T-fex should be pretty damn good at dominating the middle of the board.
topaxygouroun i wrote: 3 of the warriors in a unit of 9 can have venom cannons which are dope.
What will be the purpose of raveners? I don't like them, if you need to have them keep them cheap, no deathspitters and just basic scytals.
Rupture cannon looks amazing on paper, but then you miss 50% and you only end up with 3 hits which is a terrible ration for the points. Might want to switch that to acid spray and have it dominate the midfield instead.
Yep, that's what I thought about Venom cannons I want Raveners to kill backline ennemy units who sit on objectives, and help mid-field. But yeah, maybe the deathspitters are overkill.
Yeah, damn that poor CT...Not a bad idea though to play him agressively mid-field, thanks for the idea !
Well, that's really ambitious.
My idea of Nids in the 9th is flooding the board to gain board control with fire support and silencing enemy guns.
I love Tyranid models, but I don't like playing hordes, that's why I'm trying to figure if a non-horde army could be viable
I would personally change the Hive Fleet to Kronos, because symbiostorm is really strong with units that get +1 to hit like the Exocrine and the warriors.
I'm not sure about Kronos, because it will only affects Warriors and Exocrine, while Leviathan will affect the whole army.
I wonder if this could work in 9th, what do you think?
The swarmlord is a horde enhanser that flings units into melee. You need a good group to fling into melee, I think. I would suggest you look at ravagers as it goes well with the rest of your list. Raveners come in many different variants. While they can take guns I would suggest you keep them very cheap. If you take rending claws they get a bit more exspensibe. But if you take scything tallons you can get +1 attack. (I would recomend that you look at custom hivefleets, found in BOB. There is one that gives scything tallons +1 AP. If you do that they can be more fairly copared to boneswords.)
I would recomend that you group your warriors and hiveguards so that you have one group of 9 and 6. One of the best stratagems tyraids have is the shoot x2 stratagem. You need a good platform to use it one. Having at least one group of warriors in a group of 9 lets you take the adapations that ignores ap 1 and ap 2. Combine with the stratagem that reduses damage to -1. That is very strong!
You can also look into the adaption that gives +1 save in terain as well as jormunghard warriors. Then you have 3 wound 2+ warriors witch is very good.
The rest of the list looks good. Think about secondary missions. Your cheapest unit cost now 90 points. How about pyrovores (29 points) to take objectives and actions? (Gaunts and rippers usualy do this, but you do not want swarms.)
Acid sprayfex biggest virtue is that it can burn aircraft out of the sky with no sweating, something the rest of your list has a hard time doing.
Leviathan is for the whole list yes, but it's effectively a 6++ armywide. If you have ever played daemons (which are 5++ armywide), that save is nothing for a big body army and it only makes sense once you start piling up 150+ good for nothing bodies.
Kronos has some super big impact. First, the faction rr 1's to hit in shooting. As tyranids this is the only way we have to get access to a captain aura, and it already improves your accuracy by 12% just by having it. But put in Symbiostorm, and an exocrine goes from 8-9 hits to 13-14. You're basically getting 70% more exocrine. Same goes with the warriors. Suddenly the units output goes from 27 deathspitter shots -> 19-20 hits to 29-30 hits just by using the power. Factor in the venom cannons and it goes even higher. Finally Kronos gives you access to the anti-psyker stratagem which can be SUPER useful to block that Mortarion or Magnus Warptime just because they wreck all your gak and leave him stranded next turn for the taking.
Also don't forget that with this list, the shoot twice stratagem can also target the warriors, not just the Hive guard.
I still don't like the raveners, 5 of them will be 25 attacks sure, but only hitting on 4's with str 4 and no ap, so basically bollocks. They also tend to roam too far away from your synapse and with ld 5 they are begging to be shot down.
For 110 pts a unit I would personally field at least one Mawloc. Not that it's great or anything, but the strat makes it pretty damn sexy and will punish people who deploy too greedy. I see you're out of heavy slots tho, so maybe one more HQ to get access to a second detachment?
This list gives you your backbone shooting Kronos list. You also get to play with some funky new tricks to murder gak in melee. the Trygon Prime can get the new relic to be able to charge with 3d6 - lowest rerollable, which should bring your chances to 80ish %. Once the Prime is in combat, you can use the stratagem to bring in the Trygon in as well with 3d6-lowest rerollable on a 8" charge and also the flying hive tyrant if it fits in the list. The three of them should be able to murder pretty much everything you need them to. Don't forget to use the behemoth power to give your Trygon Prime +1 to wound. You can also give it the monstrous weapon adaptation, so now your Trygon Prime can hit with 7 attacks, ws 3+ rerolling 1's, str 8, ap-4, damage D6+1 after coming down from deepstrike and getting a 80% guaranteed charge.
I wonder if this could work in 9th, what do you think?
The swarmlord is a horde enhanser that flings units into melee. You need a good group to fling into melee, I think. I would suggest you look at ravagers as it goes well with the rest of your list. Raveners come in many different variants. While they can take guns I would suggest you keep them very cheap. If you take rending claws they get a bit more exspensibe. But if you take scything tallons you can get +1 attack. (I would recomend that you look at custom hivefleets, found in BOB. There is one that gives scything tallons +1 AP. If you do that they can be more fairly copared to boneswords.)
I would recomend that you group your warriors and hiveguards so that you have one group of 9 and 6. One of the best stratagems tyraids have is the shoot x2 stratagem. You need a good platform to use it one. Having at least one group of warriors in a group of 9 lets you take the adapations that ignores ap 1 and ap 2. Combine with the stratagem that reduses damage to -1. That is very strong!
You can also look into the adaption that gives +1 save in terain as well as jormunghard warriors. Then you have 3 wound 2+ warriors witch is very good.
The rest of the list looks good. Think about secondary missions. Your cheapest unit cost now 90 points. How about pyrovores (29 points) to take objectives and actions? (Gaunts and rippers usualy do this, but you do not want swarms.)
Hello, thanks for your input, but my list has changed since first post, see below
Spoiler:
topaxygouroun i wrote:Acid sprayfex biggest virtue is that it can burn aircraft out of the sky with no sweating, something the rest of your list has a hard time doing.
Leviathan is for the whole list yes, but it's effectively a 6++ armywide. If you have ever played daemons (which are 5++ armywide), that save is nothing for a big body army and it only makes sense once you start piling up 150+ good for nothing bodies.
Kronos has some super big impact. First, the faction rr 1's to hit in shooting. As tyranids this is the only way we have to get access to a captain aura, and it already improves your accuracy by 12% just by having it. But put in Symbiostorm, and an exocrine goes from 8-9 hits to 13-14. You're basically getting 70% more exocrine. Same goes with the warriors. Suddenly the units output goes from 27 deathspitter shots -> 19-20 hits to 29-30 hits just by using the power. Factor in the venom cannons and it goes even higher. Finally Kronos gives you access to the anti-psyker stratagem which can be SUPER useful to block that Mortarion or Magnus Warptime just because they wreck all your gak and leave him stranded next turn for the taking.
Also don't forget that with this list, the shoot twice stratagem can also target the warriors, not just the Hive guard.
I still don't like the raveners, 5 of them will be 25 attacks sure, but only hitting on 4's with str 4 and no ap, so basically bollocks. They also tend to roam too far away from your synapse and with ld 5 they are begging to be shot down.
For 110 pts a unit I would personally field at least one Mawloc. Not that it's great or anything, but the strat makes it pretty damn sexy and will punish people who deploy too greedy. I see you're out of heavy slots tho, so maybe one more HQ to get access to a second detachment?
This list gives you your backbone shooting Kronos list. You also get to play with some funky new tricks to murder gak in melee. the Trygon Prime can get the new relic to be able to charge with 3d6 - lowest rerollable, which should bring your chances to 80ish %. Once the Prime is in combat, you can use the stratagem to bring in the Trygon in as well with 3d6-lowest rerollable on a 8" charge and also the flying hive tyrant if it fits in the list. The three of them should be able to murder pretty much everything you need them to. Don't forget to use the behemoth power to give your Trygon Prime +1 to wound. You can also give it the monstrous weapon adaptation, so now your Trygon Prime can hit with 7 attacks, ws 3+ rerolling 1's, str 8, ap-4, damage D6+1 after coming down from deepstrike and getting a 80% guaranteed charge.
Ok, you convinced me on Kronos What about raveners with rending claws? They're still cheap, reroll hit of 1's, got -1 PA and can get -4 PA on every 6 to wound? (I don't really care about "Instinctive behaviour" on them because they don't shoot, and I will put them at 9" of the target I need to engage anyway, so) = EDIT : Ups you were talking about Ld, my bad, so I will need to be careful, but with the Winged Hive Tyrant, and the 44*60 board now, I should be good I think.
I really want an infiltrate fast unit, I think they're really strong in 9th, and I'm not a fan of Mawlocs/Trygons...Also, I really don't want to have 2 different Hive fleet on the same army, because of Pyschic powers, stratagems, and I will need to paint them differentely etc..I'd prefer to stick to 1 and only 1 Hive fleet if possible.
topaxygouroun i After some thoughts, I think your idea of a Behemoth detachment is very good...I think I may have a lack of Synapse though, especially in the backlines, for my Exocrines and Hive guards, so I added some Warriors, but I'm hesitating between these 2 lists :
So, between a Trygon and 5 Raveners, they're basically even on MeQ (3 kills vs 2.5), the Raveners are twice more effective on GeQ (4.5 kills vs 9) and the Trygon is twice more effective on Rhino like (8 wounds vs 4). The Raveners have more wounds, but more fragile overall, but also less vulnerable vs units like Eradicators. Now, what do I need the most? Anti-GeQ or anti-vehicles? The list with the Raveners give me one more OBSEC unit though.
What do you think?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/08/30 09:02:34
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