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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/29 23:02:04
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Bounding Ultramarine Assault Trooper
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I am fairly new to the game and I was just unclear about what happens after a unit successfully rolls enough to charge an enemy unit.
After the enemy unit rolls the saves(if any are required) does the enemy get to fight back as part of the attacking unit charge turn?
Or does the enemy's unit start their own turn, with their command phase, shooting (if they have pistols, etc) and then fight phase?
I believe the second option is right, otherwise, it would seem that you got to fight twice otherwise which sounds wrong and doesn't look right.
I am just confused since on some battle reports I watch I sometimes hear some "now the other unit fights back" after they get charged.
PS. I know an enemy unit can overwatch before a charge once per turn.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/09/29 23:04:29
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/29 23:04:12
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Never Forget Isstvan!
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Do you not have the rulebook or the quickplay rules set?
It tells you exactly what to do.
Yes you get to fight with any models within engagement range during the fight phase. The order stuff gets to swing is explicitly gone over in the rules.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/30 11:36:36
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
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The Fight phase is the only phase in the game where units of both players can potentially act.
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"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/30 13:40:56
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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the_scotsman wrote:The Fight phase is the only phase in the game where units of both players can potentially act.
Apart from The Charge Phase for overwatch, and any stratagems you care to play during your opponents turn.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/30 13:57:09
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Bounding Ultramarine Assault Trooper
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the_scotsman wrote:The Fight phase is the only phase in the game where units of both players can potentially act.
so after the attacking unit resolves their attacks, the unit that got charged will then attack with their remaining units correct?
And then after that, both players will take morale tests for any units they might have lost.
After the morale tests are done, then the turn of the player that got charged will begin with their command phase?
It sounds right to me but I just want to make sure. Being new, there is a lot of stuff going on with the hobby so I just want to make sure I am playing correctly.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/09/30 14:08:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/30 14:09:31
Subject: Re:What happens after a charge?
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Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest
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Sounds like you've got it now.
Something to bear in mind - usually, you'll find that charging units get to strike first, then other units alternate taking turns until everyone in Engagement Range has fought once.
However, there are exceptions. Some units have rules that allow them to always fight first, or that cause their opponent to always fight last - how to handle this is covered by "Rare Rules" towards the back of the Core book. It gets a bit tricky so for now I'll just advise to be aware that it can happen.
The other thing you might come across is that certain rules (usually stratagems) allow a unit to fight twice in one Fight phase. Exactly how to handle the timing of that unit's second attacks, should be covered by the same rule that allows it.
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"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/09/30 14:37:29
Subject: Re:What happens after a charge?
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Bounding Ultramarine Assault Trooper
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Automatically Appended Next Post:
Super Ready wrote:Sounds like you've got it now.
Something to bear in mind - usually, you'll find that charging units get to strike first, then other units alternate taking turns until everyone in Engagement Range has fought once.
However, there are exceptions. Some units have rules that allow them to always fight first, or that cause their opponent to always fight last - how to handle this is covered by "Rare Rules" towards the back of the Core book. It gets a bit tricky so for now I'll just advise to be aware that it can happen.
The other thing you might come across is that certain rules (usually stratagems) allow a unit to fight twice in one Fight phase. Exactly how to handle the timing of that unit's second attacks, should be covered by the same rule that allows it.
In the situation where two enemy units charge one of my units, strategems and special rules aside, after the first unit attacks me, then I will be able to attack either enemy charging unit right?
From reading the rules, it seems that I wouldn't have to wait until both units attack me and that I can attack after the first unit completes their rolls correct?
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This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/09/30 20:24:40
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/01 12:11:54
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Frenzied Berserker Terminator
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If you haven't already, download the Core Rules for free from here:
https://warhammer40000.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/ENG_40K9_Basic_Rules.pdf
The relevant rules can be found on pp21-22 of that PDF.
In short: both players get to pick eligible units to Fight.
If a unit successfully charged that turn then it always gets to Fight, regardless of whether there are still enemies in Engagement Range at the time that I pick it*. If a unit didn't charge, then it can Fight if there's an enemy currently within Engagement Range of it. When a unit Fights, it completes the whole sequence - Pile In, Attack, Consolidate - before you pick another unit to Fight.
Any units that charged that turn Fight first before anyone else gets to do so**. Once all units that have charged this turn have Fought, then the players take turns picking one unit at a time to Fight, starting with the opponent of the player whose turn it is.
So, say it's my turn, and three units have charged two of yours but we also have a separate ongoing combat involving one unit each. I pick one of the units that charged this turn: it Piles In, Attacks, and then Consolidates. I then repeat this for all three units that charged.
We now have three of your units that are eligible to Fight, and one of mine.
Because we've finished Fighting with all of the units that charged that turn, we start alternating picking a unit at a time; because it's my turn, you pick the first unit to Fight. It Piles in, Attacks and then Consolidates. I then pick a unit; it Fights as well, following the same sequence. Then you pick a unit to Fight, and then because I have no more eligible units to pick but you have one more, you get to pick that unit to Fight. Once all eligible units have Fought, we then move on to the Morale phase.
* I mention this because there may be situations where a unit has charged, but the enemy unit(s) it charged have died to another unit's Fight activation. If that happens, then this unit still can be chosen to Fight; it gets to Pile In and Consolidate, but remember that it only gets to Attack a unit that it declared a charge against (and successfully reached Engagement Range against when it charged).
** There are unit-specific abilities (e.g. Slaanesh Daemons) and stratagems (e.g. Counter Attack) that alter this, but for the sake of learning the core rules I advise ignoring them until you understand the core principles of the Fight phase.
I hope this makes sense. Let us know if there's anything in this sequence that needs to be clarified.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/01 13:41:41
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Bounding Ultramarine Assault Trooper
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Cheex wrote:If you haven't already, download the Core Rules for free from here:
https://warhammer40000.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/ENG_40K9_Basic_Rules.pdf
The relevant rules can be found on pp21-22 of that PDF.
In short: both players get to pick eligible units to Fight.
If a unit successfully charged that turn then it always gets to Fight, regardless of whether there are still enemies in Engagement Range at the time that I pick it*. If a unit didn't charge, then it can Fight if there's an enemy currently within Engagement Range of it. When a unit Fights, it completes the whole sequence - Pile In, Attack, Consolidate - before you pick another unit to Fight.
Any units that charged that turn Fight first before anyone else gets to do so**. Once all units that have charged this turn have Fought, then the players take turns picking one unit at a time to Fight, starting with the opponent of the player whose turn it is.
So, say it's my turn, and three units have charged two of yours but we also have a separate ongoing combat involving one unit each. I pick one of the units that charged this turn: it Piles In, Attacks, and then Consolidates. I then repeat this for all three units that charged.
We now have three of your units that are eligible to Fight, and one of mine.
Because we've finished Fighting with all of the units that charged that turn, we start alternating picking a unit at a time; because it's my turn, you pick the first unit to Fight. It Piles in, Attacks and then Consolidates. I then pick a unit; it Fights as well, following the same sequence. Then you pick a unit to Fight, and then because I have no more eligible units to pick but you have one more, you get to pick that unit to Fight. Once all eligible units have Fought, we then move on to the Morale phase.
* I mention this because there may be situations where a unit has charged, but the enemy unit(s) it charged have died to another unit's Fight activation. If that happens, then this unit still can be chosen to Fight; it gets to Pile In and Consolidate, but remember that it only gets to Attack a unit that it declared a charge against (and successfully reached Engagement Range against when it charged).
** There are unit-specific abilities (e.g. Slaanesh Daemons) and stratagems (e.g. Counter Attack) that alter this, but for the sake of learning the core rules I advise ignoring them until you understand the core principles of the Fight phase.
I hope this makes sense. Let us know if there's anything in this sequence that needs to be clarified.
I have to re read your example since that one is going a bit over my head. Maybe if you can explain the example where two enemy units charge one of my units I gave it would be helpful.
From what I gather in the rules, it looks like one enemy unit resolves their attacks and then I could fight back against either unit before the 2nd unit resolves their attacks. Like I wouldnt have to wait for both enemy units to resolve their attacks before I could fight back.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/01 14:11:21
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Norn Queen
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gundam wrote:I have to re read your example since that one is going a bit over my head. Maybe if you can explain the example where two enemy units charge one of my units I gave it would be helpful. From what I gather in the rules, it looks like one enemy unit resolves their attacks and then I could fight back against either unit before the 2nd unit resolves their attacks. Like I wouldnt have to wait for both enemy units to resolve their attacks before I could fight back.
Units that charged get to resolve their attacks before any units that did not charge. If your unit A is charged by enemy units 1 and 2, your opponent will resolve both 1 and 2's attacks (in either order) before you can resolve your unit A's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range). Now, say as an example you have unit A and B already in engagement range with an enemy unit 1. Your opponent charges unit A and B with their units 2 and 3. Units 2 and 3 will resolve their attacks first (as they charged, in either order), then you can choose to resolve either A or B (if they are still alive and within engagement range), then the opponent resolves unit 1's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range), then you resolve whoever is remaining of A or B's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range).
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/10/01 14:13:17
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/01 14:30:40
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Bounding Ultramarine Assault Trooper
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BaconCatBug wrote:gundam wrote:I have to re read your example since that one is going a bit over my head. Maybe if you can explain the example where two enemy units charge one of my units I gave it would be helpful.
From what I gather in the rules, it looks like one enemy unit resolves their attacks and then I could fight back against either unit before the 2nd unit resolves their attacks. Like I wouldnt have to wait for both enemy units to resolve their attacks before I could fight back.
Units that charged get to resolve their attacks before any units that did not charge. If your unit A is charged by enemy units 1 and 2, your opponent will resolve both 1 and 2's attacks (in either order) before you can resolve your unit A's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range).
Now, say as an example you have unit A and B already in engagement range with an enemy unit 1. Your opponent charges unit A and B with their units 2 and 3. Units 2 and 3 will resolve their attacks first (as they charged, in either order), then you can choose to resolve either A or B (if they are still alive and within engagement range), then the opponent resolves unit 1's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range), then you resolve whoever is remaining of A or B's attacks (if they are still alive and within engagement range).
k I get it now, thanks!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/01 16:06:12
Subject: What happens after a charge?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
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The way I usually think of it is, the fight phase has two stages.
Phase 1: Players alternate activating units that have "Priority" starting with the player whose turn it is.
Phase 2: Players alternate activating units that do not have "Priority" starting with the player whose turn it isn't.
Many units in the game have rules that affect whether or not they get "Priority" but in general, charging is the universal way to get "Priority."
The most common concerns when it comes to planning out your Fight phase are: first, the fact that when it comes to non-priority combats, your opponent makes the first move. And second, the core stratagem "Counter-Offensive."
Counter-Offensive can only be used AFTER a unit fights, which means on your turn, you will be able to select 1 unit to make their attacks before your opponent has the chance to use that stratagem and potentially interrupt you. Make sure that your first attacker is one that can either destroy/damage a dangerous enemy unit, or who is in danger of being destroyed/damaged by an enemy unit.
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"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!" |
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