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So I have been meaning to play Necrons for years, but when I started back in 5th they weren't really in a good place (newest codex was 3rd since the 5th Ed codex hadn't yet been released. mega oof) so they were more of a side project for fun and I never played them. That being said, I want to give them an honest go now in 9th and I think I've got a decent starting force for games between 500-1000pts, but let me know what you all think. Also, some suggestions on how to expand and/or switch out to make the list friendly game competitive. Not looking for a tourny win, just a fun side army for a different feel. I would like to bring it up to the apparent new standard of 2000pt games, but beyond that is wishful thinking with how pricy models are. Thanks for any and all help you feel like offering.
HQ
Lokhust (Destroyer) Lord w/Resurrection Orb & Warscythe
Lord w/Staff of Light
Overlord (Indomitus)
Plasmancer (Indomitus)
Royal Warden (Indomitus)
Skorpekh Lord (Indomitus)
Ok, so I've done some reading up on rules and such since I first made this thread and I put together a proper army list out of what I own. I am looking for advice on Dynasty and suggestions for expansion to a full 2000pt army. Suggestions for how to use what I have in 500pt and 1000pt games is very welcome. Suggestions for expansion beyond 2000pts are also welcome, but highly unlikely I'll go beyond that too much due to the time and money it would require, not to mention the storage space.
So I'm considering putting an Elite and Recruit edition starter kits on my "to-get" list as they're cheap way's to round out both my Primaris and Necrons. They have a lot of good units that, while copies of the ones I got in the Indomitus box set, would fill out the squads nicely with good loadouts. Also, several aren't likely to get new builds with different options soon if ever, so it's just a good price for the same models. Alternatively, I'd try to source another Indomitus box for a fair price. What do you all think?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/26 01:34:46
2021/03/29 01:10:13
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
That is a fine idea, given how limited the indomitus pack is. It's still nice to see that you can get a decent selection from the box in general.
As for your army, I'd like to know what your overall tactic is going to be. As narrowing that down would make suggesting a dynasty that much easier, and it would allow for you to have a playstyle that more properly mirrors what you're looking to do.
But as a firm suggestion for upping your army towards the 2000pt mark, heavy support/ elites. Though this still mostly depends on your dynasty.
Mephrit is a nice standard that I've seen pop up in the last few games. +3 to the firing range of weapons, and enhancing the pen of each shot by 1 when firing at a target that's within half range. Though it does have some exclusions. Unless you're going up against an army with reliable inv saves. It seems like one of the more reliable choices.
Sautekh on the other hand, gives a massive boost to rapid fire weapons in general. Though it's just to that category.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/29 03:25:58
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: That is a fine idea, given how limited the indomitus pack is. It's still nice to see that you can get a decent selection from the box in general.
As for your army, I'd like to know what your overall tactic is going to be. As narrowing that down would make suggesting a dynasty that much easier, and it would allow for you to have a playstyle that more properly mirrors what you're looking to do.
But as a firm suggestion for upping your army towards the 2000pt mark, heavy support/ elites. Though this still mostly depends on your dynasty.
Mephrit is a nice standard that I've seen pop up in the last few games. +3 to the firing range of weapons, and enhancing the pen of each shot by 1 when firing at a target that's within half range. Though it does have some exclusions. Unless you're going up against an army with reliable inv saves. It seems like one of the more reliable choices.
Sautekh on the other hand, gives a massive boost to rapid fire weapons in general. Though it's just to that category.
Thanks. I'll probably do that.
As for playstyle, I was looking at those two Dynasties and I always do like some extra range, but I don't really know what my playstyle would be honestly. I started the army thanks to good old Dark Crusade, but I never actually got the chance to play them for several reasons.
2021/03/29 06:15:07
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
As for playstyle, I was looking at those two Dynasties and I always do like some extra range, but I don't really know what my playstyle would be honestly. I started the army thanks to good old Dark Crusade, but I never actually got the chance to play them for several reasons.
Given the last few changes that the Necron's have received over these recent updates, especially with the new units. It's going to be a bit of a mismatched run until you hammer down what you like out of the batch. Much like how I wanted to have a nearly half run detachment of interceptors for my GKs. Which back in 6th & 7th edition, was manageable. It just wasn't at all practical and you could be screwed over by less than a few bad rolls.
You'd probably do better to build yourself around the old destroyer cult build styles. Since you're already partially built up to that direction anyway, but I'd find something to replace the plasmancer. I've only seen three of them played personally, and while they do work in close range with a lord and his retinue in tow. They usually end up being shot down with the rest of the army, before their affects come into play. Automatic mortal wounds are nice and all, but it's still only within 6" of the plasmancer.
Take a technomancer and keep him with your high value targets, much of the same protocol that SM players use with their apothecaries. Cloak gives him a move of 10" and he should count as having the Fly keyword, or you can give him the control node and pump friendly dynasty units with a +1 to their attack rolls.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/29 07:10:16
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
As for playstyle, I was looking at those two Dynasties and I always do like some extra range, but I don't really know what my playstyle would be honestly. I started the army thanks to good old Dark Crusade, but I never actually got the chance to play them for several reasons.
Given the last few changes that the Necron's have received over these recent updates, especially with the new units. It's going to be a bit of a mismatched run until you hammer down what you like out of the batch. Much like how I wanted to have a nearly half run detachment of interceptors for my GKs. Which back in 6th & 7th edition, was manageable. It just wasn't at all practical and you could be screwed over by less than a few bad rolls.
You'd probably do better to build yourself around the old destroyer cult build styles. Since you're already partially built up to that direction anyway, but I'd find something to replace the plasmancer. I've only seen three of them played personally, and while they do work in close range with a lord and his retinue in tow. They usually end up being shot down with the rest of the army, before their affects come into play. Automatic mortal wounds are nice and all, but it's still only within 6" of the plasmancer.
Take a technomancer and keep him with your high value targets, much of the same protocol that SM players use with their apothecaries. Cloak gives him a move of 10" and he should count as having the Fly keyword, or you can give him the control node and pump friendly dynasty units with a +1 to their attack rolls.
That makes sense. I did think the Plasmancer was a bit squishy and low range when I was looking over his datasheet. I'll put the Technomancer on my "to-get" list.
I was leaning toward the Destroyer cult playstyle since I have a lot of them, I just wish they had a Specialist Detachment for Destroyer cult. So what would be the best Dynasty or Dynastic Traits for a Destroyer cult based army?
2021/03/29 07:20:37
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: Nihilakh most likely, especially with how important objectives are in this edition.
Ok. I don't remember what that one does, but I keep it in mind.
-It basically gives everyone objective secured, and if the opponent has something that comparable. Then your models count for being 1 higher. Now, I'm not sure if that means that each model "with" this dynasty counts as being 2 a piece, so you'll need to get verification on that one. *edit: I just checked this again, and this is only for models that already have objective secured. So it basically means that those units which already did this job, were just far better at doing it now. Going by the rules, this only applies to Troops. Although I'm not sure if you could give this rule to other models in some other way just yet.
-Units that have this dynasty which are also still within your deployment zone, and are hit with a weapon that has ap -1. Have the ap of that weapon reduced to 0.
All in all it's a little niche, but it could let you pull objectives right from under your opponents control at the last second.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/03/29 08:14:35
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/29 08:40:34
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: Nihilakh most likely, especially with how important objectives are in this edition.
Ok. I don't remember what that one does, but I keep it in mind.
-It basically gives everyone objective secured, and if the opponent has something that comparable. Then your models count for being 1 higher. Now, I'm not sure if that means that each model "with" this dynasty counts as being 2 a piece, so you'll need to get verification on that one.
*edit: I just checked this again, and this is only for models that already have objective secured. So it basically means that those units which already did this job, were just far better at doing it now. Going by the rules, this only applies to Troops. Although I'm not sure if you could give this rule to other models in some other way just yet.
-Units that have this dynasty which are also still within your deployment zone, and are hit with a weapon that has ap -1. Have the ap of that weapon reduced to 0.
All in all it's a little niche, but it could let you pull objectives right from under your opponents control at the last second.
Yeah, doesn't seem very meta or to have that much synergy with Destroyers, but if you throw a 20-cron blob on an objective with that, there's very little your opponent can do to take it back without directing their entire force on that one squad.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Honestly, even IG would have difficulty dealing with a 20-man squad that counts as 40 ObSec.
Edit: I should say "competing" with, since IG actually have a good number of Blast weapons to shred through 10+ squads.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/03/29 08:43:41
2021/03/29 08:48:53
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
It really doesn't sound like much of an investment, to have two full squads of warriors for capping purposes.
Then you could build the rest of the army in any real fashion that you saw fit.
Then again, I'd personally take 10 man squads of immortals due to their higher toughness, and the ability to prop them up with reanimation protocols.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/30 02:15:11
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: It really doesn't sound like much of an investment, to have two full squads of warriors for capping purposes.
Then you could build the rest of the army in any real fashion that you saw fit.
Then again, I'd personally take 10 man squads of immortals due to their higher toughness, and the ability to prop them up with reanimation protocols.
I keep seeing a lot of arguments over Immortals vs Warriors. Mostly it seems to come down to survivability vs cost. I think most competitive lists I've seen use Warriors in min squads to hold objectives while they they dump all the points into other units.
I think a min squad of Immortals is actually cheaper than a min squad of Warriors, but they're prone to getting wiped even with the better on paper survivability. Mostly because SM can unload a ton of wounds right now, so the 5 Immortals all die at once whereas 10 Warriors tend to have a few models remaining to proc the RP.
2021/03/30 04:24:18
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: It really doesn't sound like much of an investment, to have two full squads of warriors for capping purposes. Then you could build the rest of the army in any real fashion that you saw fit.
Then again, I'd personally take 10 man squads of immortals due to their higher toughness, and the ability to prop them up with reanimation protocols.
I keep seeing a lot of arguments over Immortals vs Warriors. Mostly it seems to come down to survivability vs cost. I think most competitive lists I've seen use Warriors in min squads to hold objectives while they they dump all the points into other units.
I think a min squad of Immortals is actually cheaper than a min squad of Warriors, but they're prone to getting wiped even with the better on paper survivability. Mostly because SM can unload a ton of wounds right now, so the 5 Immortals all die at once whereas 10 Warriors tend to have a few models remaining to proc the RP.
Yeah, SMs really benefited from the bolter weapon and rapid fire re-work that came along with the changes in 9th. If your troop options were cheaper, much like cultist, or guard. I'd suggest using the excess of bodies to screen for your destroyers.
So you're most likely stuck using Mephrit to get the extra shooting potential. If more of the army benefited from Nephrekh, I'd suggest taking that and banking on a standardized 6+ inv save, much like daemons have to deal with.
A full squad runs about 260pts, so maybe you can find an agreeable middle ground. Getting the benefit of the bodies and the utility of Rp rolls.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/30 04:31:30
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/30 05:43:33
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: It really doesn't sound like much of an investment, to have two full squads of warriors for capping purposes.
Then you could build the rest of the army in any real fashion that you saw fit.
Then again, I'd personally take 10 man squads of immortals due to their higher toughness, and the ability to prop them up with reanimation protocols.
I keep seeing a lot of arguments over Immortals vs Warriors. Mostly it seems to come down to survivability vs cost. I think most competitive lists I've seen use Warriors in min squads to hold objectives while they they dump all the points into other units.
I think a min squad of Immortals is actually cheaper than a min squad of Warriors, but they're prone to getting wiped even with the better on paper survivability. Mostly because SM can unload a ton of wounds right now, so the 5 Immortals all die at once whereas 10 Warriors tend to have a few models remaining to proc the RP.
Yeah, SMs really benefited from the bolter weapon and rapid fire re-work that came along with the changes in 9th. If your troop options were cheaper, much like cultist, or guard. I'd suggest using the excess of bodies to screen for your destroyers.
So you're most likely stuck using Mephrit to get the extra shooting potential. If more of the army benefited from Nephrekh, I'd suggest taking that and banking on a standardized 6+ inv save, much like daemons have to deal with.
A full squad runs about 260pts, so maybe you can find an agreeable middle ground. Getting the benefit of the bodies and the utility of Rp rolls.
Yeah, that's more or less what it comes down to right now. I'll probably start with Mephrit, but I'll see if I can give the other options a try sometime. Maybe proxy some vehicles to see what works before I shell out for the expensive stuff. Nephrekh probably works best in a Troop centered list with heavy Vehicle backup.
2021/03/30 06:21:44
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
SergentSilver wrote: Yeah, that's more or less what it comes down to right now. I'll probably start with Mephrit, but I'll see if I can give the other options a try sometime. Maybe proxy some vehicles to see what works before I shell out for the expensive stuff. Nephrekh probably works best in a Troop centered list with heavy Vehicle backup.
You're probably going to get the best bang for your buck from the doom scythe, and run it with the twin tesla destructors.
10 str 7 shots with each 6+ roll scoring two additional hits, can net you more than just a standard heavy 3 at str 12.Unless you see far more heavy targets in the future.
You've already got some pretty nasty anti armor in your lineup as is. So you shouldn't really need the heavier weapon. The only downside is that none of the doom scythe's weapons come with Blast.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/30 20:06:14
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
SergentSilver wrote: Yeah, that's more or less what it comes down to right now. I'll probably start with Mephrit, but I'll see if I can give the other options a try sometime. Maybe proxy some vehicles to see what works before I shell out for the expensive stuff. Nephrekh probably works best in a Troop centered list with heavy Vehicle backup.
You're probably going to get the best bang for your buck from the doom scythe, and run it with the twin tesla destructors.
10 str 7 shots with each 6+ roll scoring two additional hits, can net you more than just a standard heavy 3 at str 12.Unless you see far more heavy targets in the future.
You've already got some pretty nasty anti armor in your lineup as is. So you shouldn't really need the heavier weapon. The only downside is that none of the doom scythe's weapons come with Blast.
Thanks, I'll definitely look into Doom Scythes for additions.10 Str 7 shots with 2 additional hits on a 6+ sounds pretty hard hitting, even against lesser armored targets. Btw, I was thinking about rounding out my Destroyer squad with a Heavy Destroyer. Never did get my hands on one before but the new models look pretty cool. Or would you suggest a full 3 Heavy Destroyer squad instead for the AT boost? I'm also thinking about getting another two Destroyer squads and a Heavy Destroyer squad that can be attached to them. Doing that would mean I would need to switch the Destroyer Cult units to the primary Battalion detachment and the extra stuff would get pushed to the secondary Patrol detachment if I wanted to keep all the Destroyer Cult together.
2021/03/31 04:24:17
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Thanks, I'll definitely look into Doom Scythes for additions.10 Str 7 shots with 2 additional hits on a 6+ sounds pretty hard hitting, even against lesser armored targets. Btw, I was thinking about rounding out my Destroyer squad with a Heavy Destroyer. Never did get my hands on one before but the new models look pretty cool. Or would you suggest a full 3 Heavy Destroyer squad instead for the AT boost? I'm also thinking about getting another two Destroyer squads and a Heavy Destroyer squad that can be attached to them. Doing that would mean I would need to switch the Destroyer Cult units to the primary Battalion detachment and the extra stuff would get pushed to the secondary Patrol detachment if I wanted to keep all the Destroyer Cult together.
Just take the one heavy destroyer for the time being and see how that pans out for you in some mock games. They still come armed with the gauss destructor, so they're already throwing out some heavy firepower, and you'll probably be able to boost his BS to 2+ given the correct dynasty shenanigans. Hard-wired for destruction lets them re-roll 1s anyway, so it's not like you don't have some insurance when shooting.
It's just that I don't really see much of a reason to take the enmitic exterminator. Heavy 3D3 shots, str 7, Ap -1 at D1 just seems like a waste to me even with it being blast.
This is going to be a slow burn for you most likely. The Necrons are getting more models and updates as things go on, so we don't really know what is going to be the end-game here.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/31 05:56:55
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Thanks, I'll definitely look into Doom Scythes for additions.10 Str 7 shots with 2 additional hits on a 6+ sounds pretty hard hitting, even against lesser armored targets. Btw, I was thinking about rounding out my Destroyer squad with a Heavy Destroyer. Never did get my hands on one before but the new models look pretty cool. Or would you suggest a full 3 Heavy Destroyer squad instead for the AT boost? I'm also thinking about getting another two Destroyer squads and a Heavy Destroyer squad that can be attached to them. Doing that would mean I would need to switch the Destroyer Cult units to the primary Battalion detachment and the extra stuff would get pushed to the secondary Patrol detachment if I wanted to keep all the Destroyer Cult together.
Just take the one heavy destroyer for the time being and see how that pans out for you in some mock games. They still come armed with the gauss destructor, so they're already throwing out some heavy firepower, and you'll probably be able to boost his BS to 2+ given the correct dynasty shenanigans. Hard-wired for destruction lets them re-roll 1s anyway, so it's not like you don't have some insurance when shooting.
It's just that I don't really see much of a reason to take the enmitic exterminator. Heavy 3D3 shots, str 7, Ap -1 at D1 just seems like a waste to me even with it being blast.
This is going to be a slow burn for you most likely. The Necrons are getting more models and updates as things go on, so we don't really know what is going to be the end-game here.
That's true. The Heavy Destroyers are newer models though, so they probably won't see an update for another decade. I'll probably grab the squad box of three for the savings and see how they do as a single attached to regular Destroyers and as their own squad, but in the end I'll probably just run one or two attached to the regulars.
On a side note, perusing the current Necron line on GWs webstore has made me very glad I got my Destroyer Lord and Battleforce way back. The current Destroyer Lord is just an upgrade pack where you have to buy a regular Destroyer separate to build him. I can't believe they did that. And they don't have a Start Collecting box anymore nor Combat Patrol yet, despite being one of the original two factions updated to 9th.
When I got my army, a Destroyer Lord was $15, was a full kit, and the Lord parts were metal, not finecast. The Battleforce I think was $60? Whatever it was, it was a much cheaper start to the army than is even near possible today. The three Destroyers alone would cost nearly the whole box.
2021/03/31 07:16:39
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Yeah, that's going to be one of the main issues here. I've seen talk that they're going to make a new pack to be a direct by in for the destroyer lord. But it's not telling if anything that gets leaked from GW at this time, is actually something that we can trust.
Your best bet is ebay, or any other bit trading site. Until GW stops dragging their feet.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/03/31 14:40:26
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: Yeah, that's going to be one of the main issues here. I've seen talk that they're going to make a new pack to be a direct by in for the destroyer lord. But it's not telling if anything that gets leaked from GW at this time, is actually something that we can trust.
Your best bet is ebay, or any other bit trading site. Until GW stops dragging their feet.
Yeah. If I'm being honest, I'll probably search eBay for good value older boxes than buy new from GW. If I could get another Battleforce MK2 for $60-70, I would. Excellent expansion to an existing force or a great start to a new one. These new Combat Patrols seem more focused towards not so cheap starts to an army what with their included character models that you'll rarely need more than one of. And GW character models are now almost all monopose with few to no options, so it's not like you'll even want more than one for variety.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I threw together a mock-up of a 2000pt list following the Destroyer Cult theme and this is what I came up with:
I know it's a little short on ObSec, but I think it's got a fair range of AT and AI potential. Good alpha strikers to harry the enemy backline and contest the forward objectives, good ranged support to deal with enemy vehicles and heavy infantry while holding the rear objectives, and enough midrange to engage light infantry and hopefully win the middle objectives. It's probably not super competitive as is, but should be fun in casual games. What do you think?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/04/02 17:08:58
2021/04/02 03:30:44
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Yeah. If I'm being honest, I'll probably search eBay for good value older boxes than buy new from GW. If I could get another Battleforce MK2 for $60-70, I would. Excellent expansion to an existing force or a great start to a new one. These new Combat Patrols seem more focused towards not so cheap starts to an army what with their included character models that you'll rarely need more than one of. And GW character models are now almost all monopose with few to no options, so it's not like you'll even want more than one for variety.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I threw together a mock-up of a 2000pt list following the Destroyer Cult theme and this is what I came up with:
I know it's a little short on ObSec, but I think it's got a fair range of AT and AI potential. Good alpha strikers to harry the enemy backline and contest the forward objectives, good ranged support to deal with enemy vehicles and heavy infantry while holding the rear objectives, and enough midrange to engage light infantry and hopefully win the middle objectives. It's probably not super competitive as is, but should be fun in casual games. What do you think?
Lose the hexmark destroyer, and add a few more deathmarks. That's the best that I can suggest here, especially with how many points are going to be swung on that exchange.
I've never seen the hexmark perform well, even in games where it gets into range, and I've seen that they usually end up being a deep CP sink for some. Though I only have two players that routinely run necrons here.
You'd do better with betting on the mortal wounds caused by the deathmarks, than by working to get more kills/shots with the hexmark. Besides, I just don't like the stats for the hexmarks weapons.
If they just weren't comparable to pistols, I'd be more willing to say that it could be relied on.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/04/02 04:22:07
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Yeah. If I'm being honest, I'll probably search eBay for good value older boxes than buy new from GW. If I could get another Battleforce MK2 for $60-70, I would. Excellent expansion to an existing force or a great start to a new one. These new Combat Patrols seem more focused towards not so cheap starts to an army what with their included character models that you'll rarely need more than one of. And GW character models are now almost all monopose with few to no options, so it's not like you'll even want more than one for variety.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I threw together a mock-up of a 2000pt list following the Destroyer Cult theme and this is what I came up with:
I know it's a little short on ObSec, but I think it's got a fair range of AT and AI potential. Good alpha strikers to harry the enemy backline and contest the forward objectives, good ranged support to deal with enemy vehicles and heavy infantry while holding the rear objectives, and enough midrange to engage light infantry and hopefully win the middle objectives. It's probably not super competitive as is, but should be fun in casual games. What do you think?
Lose the hexmark destroyer, and add a few more deathmarks. That's the best that I can suggest here, especially with how many points are going to be swung on that exchange.
I've never seen the hexmark perform well, even in games where it gets into range, and I've seen that they usually end up being a deep CP sink for some. Though I only have two players that routinely run necrons here.
You'd do better with betting on the mortal wounds caused by the deathmarks, than by working to get more kills/shots with the hexmark. Besides, I just don't like the stats for the hexmarks weapons.
If they just weren't comparable to pistols, I'd be more willing to say that it could be relied on.
But isn't the fact that they are pistols what makes it good? Sure, an Assault or Rapid Fire is nice at a range, but with Pistols he can move into melee to prevent himself from being shot while still getting to make full use of his turn in the shooting phase. His fighting capability isn't great, but after a full barrage of his shooting there shouldn't be too much of the enemy left if you throw him into a ranged squad with equally poor fighting. Or, if an enemy that's decent at fighting makes the mistake of charging him, he basically gets a free shooting round with Overwatch thanks to his ability Inescapable Death.
And with Multi-Threat Eliminator he can potentially make up to 12 attacks, especially if the target unit are 1 wound models. For instance, he could fairly easily wipe out an entire 10-man squad of DE Warriors in one shooting phase or Overwatch volley. He probably wouldn't be too much use against SM though, what with their T4 W2 Sv3+ and ungodly amount of survival Stratagems... So I guess he's more of a sub in when fighting 1 wound enemies, like Eldar and IG.
2021/04/02 08:29:38
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
But isn't the fact that they are pistols what makes it good? Sure, an Assault or Rapid Fire is nice at a range, but with Pistols he can move into melee to prevent himself from being shot while still getting to make full use of his turn in the shooting phase. His fighting capability isn't great, but after a full barrage of his shooting there shouldn't be too much of the enemy left if you throw him into a ranged squad with equally poor fighting. Or, if an enemy that's decent at fighting makes the mistake of charging him, he basically gets a free shooting round with Overwatch thanks to his ability Inescapable Death.
And with Multi-Threat Eliminator he can potentially make up to 12 attacks, especially if the target unit are 1 wound models. For instance, he could fairly easily wipe out an entire 10-man squad of DE Warriors in one shooting phase or Overwatch volley. He probably wouldn't be too much use against SM though, what with their T4 W2 Sv3+ and ungodly amount of survival Stratagems... So I guess he's more of a sub in when fighting 1 wound enemies, like Eldar and IG.
Yes, for the benefit of their utility, his pistols do allow him to have that survivability. It's just that most armies have the ability to make his weapon's strength somewhat trivial. Hell, the GKs can reduce overall AP for weapons by 1, and that is just for starters. As for DE, I believe they received a few powers that would allow them to either boost their save, or to boost each unit with a invul save. His only real saving grace against them, is that negative modifiers can't affect his shooting.
As for deathmarks, they block look out sir rolls, can still do their deployment shenanigans, and the mortal wounds can still spill over to other models.
I've only played chaos, IG, or Grey Knights since 5th edition. So I've had no real issue with dealing with Necrons in the past. Even running my IG, I've been able to pile wounds out on the Hexmark before he gets into range. And if any of my heavy weapon crews so much as sneeze at him, he's gone.
Soft targets that are easy for him to access, that's his bread & butter. But you're going to need to look out for armies that can instantly deny him the ability to even shoot over watch. Which means some Eldar, Chaos, and I think even the Tyranids and Tau have recently been able to do as such with certain stratagems.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/04/02 14:56:05
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
But isn't the fact that they are pistols what makes it good? Sure, an Assault or Rapid Fire is nice at a range, but with Pistols he can move into melee to prevent himself from being shot while still getting to make full use of his turn in the shooting phase. His fighting capability isn't great, but after a full barrage of his shooting there shouldn't be too much of the enemy left if you throw him into a ranged squad with equally poor fighting. Or, if an enemy that's decent at fighting makes the mistake of charging him, he basically gets a free shooting round with Overwatch thanks to his ability Inescapable Death.
And with Multi-Threat Eliminator he can potentially make up to 12 attacks, especially if the target unit are 1 wound models. For instance, he could fairly easily wipe out an entire 10-man squad of DE Warriors in one shooting phase or Overwatch volley. He probably wouldn't be too much use against SM though, what with their T4 W2 Sv3+ and ungodly amount of survival Stratagems... So I guess he's more of a sub in when fighting 1 wound enemies, like Eldar and IG.
Yes, for the benefit of their utility, his pistols do allow him to have that survivability. It's just that most armies have the ability to make his weapon's strength somewhat trivial. Hell, the GKs can reduce overall AP for weapons by 1, and that is just for starters. As for DE, I believe they received a few powers that would allow them to either boost their save, or to boost each unit with a invul save. His only real saving grace against them, is that negative modifiers can't affect his shooting.
As for deathmarks, they block look out sir rolls, can still do their deployment shenanigans, and the mortal wounds can still spill over to other models.
I've only played chaos, IG, or Grey Knights since 5th edition. So I've had no real issue with dealing with Necrons in the past. Even running my IG, I've been able to pile wounds out on the Hexmark before he gets into range. And if any of my heavy weapon crews so much as sneeze at him, he's gone.
Soft targets that are easy for him to access, that's his bread & butter. But you're going to need to look out for armies that can instantly deny him the ability to even shoot over watch. Which means some Eldar, Chaos, and I think even the Tyranids and Tau have recently been able to do as such with certain stratagems.
Oof. Alright. He just looks cool and seems good on paper, but I guess they've given everyone an easy out for dealing with units like him.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Ok, here's my new rounded list:
I changed a few things around to make it less specific and more general use, including removing the Gloom Prism from the Spyders since those are only for opponents using Psykers. If I expect to face someone with Psykers, I can add them back easily enough.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/02 17:13:14
2021/04/03 11:53:58
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
But isn't the fact that they are pistols what makes it good? Sure, an Assault or Rapid Fire is nice at a range, but with Pistols he can move into melee to prevent himself from being shot while still getting to make full use of his turn in the shooting phase. His fighting capability isn't great, but after a full barrage of his shooting there shouldn't be too much of the enemy left if you throw him into a ranged squad with equally poor fighting. Or, if an enemy that's decent at fighting makes the mistake of charging him, he basically gets a free shooting round with Overwatch thanks to his ability Inescapable Death.
And with Multi-Threat Eliminator he can potentially make up to 12 attacks, especially if the target unit are 1 wound models. For instance, he could fairly easily wipe out an entire 10-man squad of DE Warriors in one shooting phase or Overwatch volley. He probably wouldn't be too much use against SM though, what with their T4 W2 Sv3+ and ungodly amount of survival Stratagems... So I guess he's more of a sub in when fighting 1 wound enemies, like Eldar and IG.
Yes, for the benefit of their utility, his pistols do allow him to have that survivability. It's just that most armies have the ability to make his weapon's strength somewhat trivial. Hell, the GKs can reduce overall AP for weapons by 1, and that is just for starters. As for DE, I believe they received a few powers that would allow them to either boost their save, or to boost each unit with a invul save. His only real saving grace against them, is that negative modifiers can't affect his shooting.
As for deathmarks, they block look out sir rolls, can still do their deployment shenanigans, and the mortal wounds can still spill over to other models.
I've only played chaos, IG, or Grey Knights since 5th edition. So I've had no real issue with dealing with Necrons in the past. Even running my IG, I've been able to pile wounds out on the Hexmark before he gets into range. And if any of my heavy weapon crews so much as sneeze at him, he's gone.
Soft targets that are easy for him to access, that's his bread & butter. But you're going to need to look out for armies that can instantly deny him the ability to even shoot over watch. Which means some Eldar, Chaos, and I think even the Tyranids and Tau have recently been able to do as such with certain stratagems.
Oof. Alright. He just looks cool and seems good on paper, but I guess they've given everyone an easy out for dealing with units like him.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Ok, here's my new rounded list:
I changed a few things around to make it less specific and more general use, including removing the Gloom Prism from the Spyders since those are only for opponents using Psykers. If I expect to face someone with Psykers, I can add them back easily enough.
Let us know if it works.
Certainly not my army.
Skorpekhs and Ophydians (incl. the Lords) all in one army. Wraiths are the units for me - fast and durable.
Spyders and Scarabs are certainly not a must have.
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Let us know if it works.
Certainly not my army.
Skorpekhs and Ophydians (incl. the Lords) all in one army. Wraiths are the units for me - fast and durable.
Spyders and Scarabs are certainly not a must have.
Yeah, I know Spyders and Scarabs aren't really that great anymore, but I'm a bit of a sucker for the classic from good ol' Dark Crusade.
There's a lot of things I'd love to do that are not even casually competitive.
Spoiler:
I really want a massive blob of invisible T'au Stealth Suits to ping the enemy to death. "You can't kill what you can't see." - XV25
2021/04/04 00:26:12
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
It doesn't matter if they're competitive, or not. You still want to do them, which should be more than enough of a reason to do them anyway.
The spiders are going to keep your armies alive, which is probably their best aspect, save for their access to good melee. Just make sure to keep your immortals within bubble range, and you should be fine.
One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food?
2021/04/06 03:26:42
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Oborosen wrote: It doesn't matter if they're competitive, or not. You still want to do them, which should be more than enough of a reason to do them anyway.
The spiders are going to keep your armies alive, which is probably their best aspect, save for their access to good melee. Just make sure to keep your immortals within bubble range, and you should be fine.
Alright, thanks! I will try to keep that in mind.
My current half plan is a sort of instant strike force to keep the enemy tied up in their deployment by deep striking as much of the army as I can into them while the Immortals and Destroyers take my back and mid objectives and provide ranged fire support. The Deathmarks will deploy in the best cover with sight lines to the enemy rather than directly in with the rest. Skorpehk will use Veil of Darkness to take himself and one of the Immortals squads in as well to contest their back objectives with the rest.
2021/04/09 18:10:59
Subject: Re:Necrons: Advice for expansion to 2000pts
Well, I watched a "worst units for every army" video last night and the Hexmark Destroyer got honorable mention with maybe first place for Necrons, so I probably will never end up getting one.
Canoptek Reanimator got official first place for being to squishy and without firepower for its points and thus liable to die before being useful for the RP buff, but while explaining why Hexmark Destroyers got honorable mention they questioned themselves about whether it should have been the official worst since at least the buff to RP can be very useful under the right circumstances.
I know it's just an opinion based video, buuuuut being picked for potentially worst unit in an army is generally a decent indicator of not doing too well in the current rules, especially when they seem to have good reasons to back up the choice.
And honestly, I kinda agree with their assessment at this point. It can be decent at cutting through chaff units under proper circumstances, but it's just unlikely to make it's points back in a timely matter doing that. And with 2 wounds seeming to be the new meta, it's really not that useful at all.
