Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey Dakka, haven't played since like 5th ed but the gaming bug has bit me again and I need some help refining a hobby project idea into something that can hold it's own on the tabletop.

I've got a list that I think covers the basics, my aim is to create an armoured regiment but for practical reasons and objective scoring I guess infantry has to be mixed in. Because I want to model armour not infantry that means they'll be riding in chimeras.

I'm not yet sold on Steel Legion, Tallaran Raiders, or Cadian, the paint schemes I have in mind would suit any. I'm leaning towards Steel Legion but if the regiment rules of any stand out over the others I can easily swap out some transfers and roll that.

I'm not entirely sure what I'm doing with things like Relics and CP and warlord traits that weren't around when I last played but the general idea I have looks something like this:

Brigade Detachment

HQ
Company Commander - 40
Warlord, Powersword, Inspiring Leader

Tank Commander - 225
Vanquisher, Heavy bolters, Auger, Track guards

Elite
Command Squad - 39
x4 vets, medic, vox, standard

Troops
Infantry Squad - 70
Flamer, autocannon, vox

Infantry Squad - 70
Flamer, autocannon, vox

Infantry Squad - 70
Flamer, autocannon, vox

Fast Attack
Armoured Sentinel Squadron - 135
x3 sentinels, x3 autocaanons

Heavy Support
Leman Russ Squadron - 630
x2 standard, heavy bolters, track guards
x1 exterminator, multi meltas, track guards

Basilisks - 250
x2

Hydra - 110

Dedicated Transports
4x Chimeras - 340


Total - 1979

I've got a few points to play with, I'm not totally sold on anything in there really either. I wouldn't mind trying to squeeze in a 5th tank, or dialing back on the infantry if I can get away with it. The hydra and sentinels I could take or leave, and wouldn't mind a manticore.

Well it's a different list than what I would put together, and here's my thinking.
Flamers. I'd take this as Catachan for "Burn them out", but otherwise for the same price plasma if my favorite. the 2 damage and AP with rapid fire when in range just seems to get better effects, particularly if I have orders to get the re-roll 1s.

I don't tend to use augur array given the once per battle, and I only tend to use track guards (when I use them) on Hellhounds. I just usually find other places to put the points (like more plasma on infantry / vets). The math hammer I've seen tends to put vanquisher at the worst profile across the board. Battle cannon is ok across the range with Punisher, Executioner, and Demolisher as the specialists for hordes, marines/vehicles, big things respectively.

I do use autocannons a lot, though with 2damage heavy bolters, I'm considering using those more. I often save the autocannons for my vet squads that hang back and try to score better hits with their 3+ BS. I tend to run Lascannons or autocannons on my sentinels, and the reason for lascannons being if I mange to hit something with it, I want to hit it hard, and it makes it a bit more of a target than other things I don't want the enemy shooting at as much.

Basllisk is good and was a go-to for 8th, but if you have the model think about manticores, given that the 5 round game penalizes them less and with full payload tank ace they can do some nice damage early.

I haven't been using hydras but I don't have an overly flying meta locally. I will use them a lot if they ever take away the -1 to hit on ground targets rule.

I think you're rather short on infantry. Barely enough to contest some objectives and not enough tank screening.

That's all off the top of my head. Let me stare at the list and see if I have an alternate / similar list to suggest.

Are these the models you have? Can you run executioner / demolisher / punishers? If so...

Think about putting this into a batallion. If you don't mind spending 2 cp you can take a patrol and batallion that will give jurry rigging and gunnery experts to your heavies, and give wilderness survivors and discilplined shooters to your infantry.

When I laid it out I thought about 5 or 6 regular infantry with plasma and vox, then perhaps 2 vet squads with autocannon and plasma/vox. Two company commanders and platoon commander. That in the batallion with Wilderness Survivors and Discplined shooters.

In the patrol I put the Tank Commander, with demolisher if you have it, else battlecannon perhaps. I tend to add heavy stubber to TC since he has 3+BS. 1 squad of guardsmen to finish out patrol. Astropaths for astral divination and pyshic barrier or nightshroud? also can do some psych 2ndary objectives. I put in two armored sentinels, both basilikss, a leman russ punisher and executioner. If you don't have demolisher kits you could try for exterminator and battle cannon. bolter sponsons.

I also put in 3 chimera transports with flamer, bolter, stubber. Can shift it around as desired. It's subjective but it feels like tweaks along these lines would help you hit harder, have more bodies, and give a touch more resilience. It all depends on what models you have available of course though.

Hello and welcome back to hobby. At first it seems that your army is more suited for battalion sized detachment (a brigade requires more units than your list has). As for the units, everything seems solid, except that you dont have any counter for melee (maybe switch Hydra for a unit of bullgryn or crusaders). Some of the most competitive units for guard at the moment are manticore with full payload and tank commander with a demolisher cannon.

RegularGuy wrote:Are these the models you have? Can you run executioner / demolisher / punishers? Will tailor accordingly

Nothing bought so far, it's really just I love modeling armour, would like to get back into the game, and think buying a bunch of russes sounds fun but I want to hold my own on the table too.

A lot of what I have picked is down to what I think would be fun to paint, balanced against what it sounds like I need, so plasmas over flamers or heavy bolters over autocannons is easy. Leman Russes are basically top of the list, chimeras are a must for infantry, basalisks and sentinels are both in the same place of nice but I worry the kits are very old at this point. The hydra/wyvern kit looks funs, as does the manticore.

Spreelock wrote:Hello and welcome back to hobby. At first it seems that your army is more suited for battalion sized detachment (a brigade requires more units than your list has). As for the units, everything seems solid, except that you dont have any counter for melee (maybe switch Hydra for a unit of bullgryn or crusaders). Some of the most competitive units for guard at the moment are manticore with full payload and tank commander with a demolisher cannon.

Thanks
I might have got those terms mixed up, it's probably a battalion if I checked on battlescribe.
The melee thing is something I hadn't considered at all, I'd absolutely take bullgryns over crusaders just for the models/fluff. I do hope they can take transports though.

I'll just add that I think your list would have fared better in 8th, and I was running mech inf, 6 guard squads, 6 chimera, 4 tanks, 3 sentinels at that time. With the new secondary points rules lots of bodies, characters, and vehicles tend to give opponents a perfect trifecta for scoring secondary points on you with Bring it Down, Thin Their Ranks, and Assasinate. As a result I've been edging towards fewer vehicles and more bodies to outnumber/outlast opponents on objectives. I'd rather be vehicle heavy for fun.

So I guess it's a good thing I didn't go with my initial idea of like 7 russes and only 2 guardsmen squads in an armoured detachment

Russ tanks in a spearhead get objective secured, but I haven't seen anyone make it killy enough to win yet. Would love to run sea of armor though.

Out of curiosity what would you guys change if it were to go down to only 3 russes no commander?

Painting armour is still the goal of the hobby side of it so I don't want it to just turn into an infantry horde list but would swapping them out for hellhouds or something or maybe putting in a bunch of heavy weapon teams (which despite being infantry are generally pretty cool) make the list a bit beefier?

Or is the tank commander a significant force multiplier there and more important than the infantry commander?

So LRBT (4bs) are slightly less powerful than LRTC(3bs) .. but the orders ad another level of upgrade. Against a normal enemy the TC's 3 to hit only gives it a 33 percent power bump, so you would think 3 tank commanders (costing perhaps 660 points) are as good at shooting as 4 similarly amred normal LRBT (which cost a mere 25 points each less, so its going to be more like 820 points of LRBT.)
Except then you give out orders like "shoot and shroud" so that they tank commander group are all -1 to be hit, AND shooting as well as 4 LRBT that cost another 160 points more.