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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





England: Newcastle

Have they said anything about this? I know they announced the special character but will there be an option for a generic Canoness to lead the warsuit army? Would it be like the Custodian kit where you can make characters out of the box or do you think they would have mentioned that being an option by now? I mean the warsuit Sergeant Id say looked impressive enough to be a Canoness.

Would be a bit like no generic jet pack HQ preventing you doing all jump army without special characters. So I am hoping that’s going to be option since after this dex I am not expecting more sisters for a very long time.

Maybe it’s a balance thing. If you gave some of the relics and warlord traits to a model that wasn’t str3 t3 it would be horrendous.


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Longtime Dakkanaut





They haven't said so, but I don't think that will be an option.

The Abbess is special. Letting a Cannoness ride around in a similar suit would diminish that. Generic inquisitors don't get a throne of judgement, and Ultramrine capatains don't get gauntlets of ultramar.
   
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It'd be nice, but doesn't seem to be in the cards.
Or a jump pack canoness for that matter.

There may be some other thing unseen still, but if this were an option, they'd have shown it off like the generic half-dragon variant of the vampire lady kit.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/06 03:22:57


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For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?

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 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?
If the suit is 10+ wounds, there'd be a reason to take regular Cannonesses. Look Out Sir.

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Longtime Dakkanaut





PenitentJake wrote:
They haven't said so, but I don't think that will be an option.

The Abbess is special. Letting a Cannoness ride around in a similar suit would diminish that. Generic inquisitors don't get a throne of judgement, and Ultramrine capatains don't get gauntlets of ultramar.



That doesn't make much sense when you can get a squad of celestians in them. That would be like saying a captain can't have terminator armour, or a shas'o can't have a crisis suit.
   
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I wish they'd've made the kit allow for a Canoness build. I also wish that Hover Pulpit Lady also had a generic option.

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I am glad if these are named specials. The paragon suits are meh... I don’t like them at all and am happy that a simple “no named characters” restriction will keep this one off the table. 40k is turning into boss fight event 201.

   
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 JNAProductions wrote:
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?
If the suit is 10+ wounds, there'd be a reason to take regular Cannonesses. Look Out Sir.


Durning the stream they said the special one has the "right number of wounds" and can be protected by troops. So I assume she is 9W.

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Atlanta, Ga

 JNAProductions wrote:
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?
If the suit is 10+ wounds, there'd be a reason to take regular Cannonesses. Look Out Sir.

Please no, the beat stick Cannoness is stupid hard to kill enough as it is.

One has to wonder. Do the Tyranids consider drop-assault troops... fast food? 
   
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 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?


Because the warsuit is an expensive vehicle thing, while the foot canoness is a cheap infantry character with lots of options for relics and abilities all the benefits that provides, whereas a JP Captain is still a captain who's much faster for a small amount of points.

That's like asking why I might use a Terminator Grandmaster over a Dreadknight Grandmaster, or a Company Commander over a Tank Commander, etc. When the two units are completely different, the vehicle version of a leader isn't going to replace the foot version of a leader.


In general, I prefer it when named characters can be functionally built out of standard type characters, maybe with a unique ability or upgraded weapon or something minor. Makes the game in general feel more big and less heroic, and more your dudes and less about the written script. Now, if only we could eliminate heroic characters entirely, but that's asking too much.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/06 17:55:32


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 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?


Because the warsuit is an expensive vehicle thing, while the foot canoness is a cheap infantry character with lots of options for relics and abilities all the benefits that provides, whereas a JP Captain is still a captain who's much faster for a small amount of points.

That's like asking why I might use a Terminator Grandmaster over a Dreadknight Grandmaster, or a Company Commander over a Tank Commander, etc. When the two units are completely different, the vehicle version of a leader isn't going to replace the foot version of a leader.


In general, I prefer it when named characters can be functionally built out of standard type characters, maybe with a unique ability or upgraded weapon or something minor. Makes the game in general feel more big and less heroic, and more your dudes and less about the written script. Now, if only we could eliminate heroic characters entirely, but that's asking too much.


I don't mind named characters normally, but since I primarily play Crusade, half my fun is growing and named characters don't grow. A Legendary generic with a WL Trait, a relic and a permanent strat bump can often hold their own against a named character, and they also are totally one of "your dudes."

I'm curious about how living sainthood is going to work? I don't think named characters will be able to become Living Saints.
   
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They let you make a shield captain out of the same unit of Custodes, so I don't see why you couldn't make a Cannoness out of the same unit of Paragon Warsuits.

But then, that would make sense and be easy to do and would make people happy.

Nope, best to ignore all that.
   
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The specifically include special bits in the Custodies kits for the Shield Captains. If they made such bits for a Canoness in Paragon warsuit, there will be a datasheet for it. In that case it will be a pleasant surprise.
   
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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I wish they'd've made the kit allow for a Canoness build. I also wish that Hover Pulpit Lady also had a generic option.


Hover pulpit lady is pretty cool, imo.
   
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I want to kitbash that hover pulpit with a knight.

   
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That might be pretty cool, make it so.
   
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I thought it was announced her rules will be in Charadon II?
   
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No. It was mentioned that the character is active in Book of Fire. There is no mention of her rules being there.
   
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So she's still a DLC character, lol.
   
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 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?

That's mostly for mobility in the front lines. If you want simple buffing there's a reason for it.

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 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

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Made in ca
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Worst case, and in my opinion, least likely to occur, is that the Abbess profile ends up in the campaign book and not the dex. If that happens, claims of DLC are true, and the behaviour is reprehensible. Fortunately, I am confident it won't be playing out that way.

It's possible the Abbess is in both books. I think this is far more likely; it isn't as problematic as the worst case scenario, but it's still pretty wormy.

The third scenario, and in my opinion the most likely, is that the data sheet appears in the Dex, and the character is included as part of an Army of Renown in Charadon II. If this is what we get, then for sisters at least, the Charadon content remains optional.

The fourth, and final possibility is that the datasheet is in the dex, and the Abbess appears only as part of the fluff in the Book of Fire.

Be' Lakor is interesting too; we know for sure his datasheet will be in the Book of Fire, but we don't know if it will appear in the codices.

By now, I think we're five full dexes behind GW's original release schedule. I personally believe that GW's original plan was to release the dexes for all the factions in each campaign book, and follow those releases with the campaign to provide a story hook for all the players who bought in.

I think it's a good rythm; month 1 of each quarter, you get two dexes, combat patrol boxes to go with them, maybe a new kit for each. Month two, repeat with two new factions. Month 3, you get a campaign book which gives you an Army of Renown for each of the four factions, as well as a supplement for one subfaction from each of those four armies. And then you get a random model release to go with it- this might be vs. box (like Piety and Pain) or a terrain box (like the one recently announced).

I don't think that's a bad pattern, and I'm certain that's what they had planned to do. Unfortunately, the state of the world, whether it's international shipping issues, a problematic trade agreement or a global pandemic, has interfered with GW's to deliver the product as smoothly as they had planned.
   
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That is a patern if your faction actually has a chance to get new models. If it doesn't, then having rules split over two books is just paying double for a codex.

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wow, I am constantly amazed at people bringing up Covid to justify GW's release schedule, as if the two are somehow related. Codex missed it's release date, MAYBE due to shipping. GW drops new models and books the DAY AFTER the main codex drops (Drukari and others) that was by design.
   
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Tacoma, WA, USA

PenitentJake wrote:
The third scenario, and in my opinion the most likely, is that the data sheet appears in the Dex, and the character is included as part of an Army of Renown in Charadon II. If this is what we get, then for sisters at least, the Charadon content remains optional.
I think this is the most likely case. I can't imagine they will have her active in the book without providing some rules content. Her being outside of the Orders makes an Order supplement like Cult of Strife unlikely.
   
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drbored wrote:
They let you make a shield captain out of the same unit of Custodes, so I don't see why you couldn't make a Cannoness out of the same unit of Paragon Warsuits.

But then, that would make sense and be easy to do and would make people happy.

Nope, best to ignore all that.


"IDK Why they don't make a character that results less than minimum unit sizes of paragon suits, I believe it would make people happy to be forced to buy at least an entire extra box for the sake of one character model."


Automatically Appended Next Post:
FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
wow, I am constantly amazed at people bringing up Covid to justify GW's release schedule, as if the two are somehow related. Codex missed it's release date, MAYBE due to shipping. GW drops new models and books the DAY AFTER the main codex drops (Drukari and others) that was by design.


...So you honestly believe that the global pandemic currently resulting in delays and shortages in basically every product market on the planet doesn't have any impact on a large multinational corporation because...reasons.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/08 10:39:18


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I don't like the suits ...at all - the High Lord vesion is the most salvagable I think.

I don't think they will bother with a Canoness version - no sign of a jump pack one either. But the normal Canoness is still very strong.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/08 11:01:48


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

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 alextroy wrote:
PenitentJake wrote:
The third scenario, and in my opinion the most likely, is that the data sheet appears in the Dex, and the character is included as part of an Army of Renown in Charadon II. If this is what we get, then for sisters at least, the Charadon content remains optional.
I think this is the most likely case. I can't imagine they will have her active in the book without providing some rules content. Her being outside of the Orders makes an Order supplement like Cult of Strife unlikely.


But she isn't outside of the orders, she is the head of the convent sanctorum, making here a member of every order, even the ordo minoris.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
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Karol wrote:
 alextroy wrote:
PenitentJake wrote:
The third scenario, and in my opinion the most likely, is that the data sheet appears in the Dex, and the character is included as part of an Army of Renown in Charadon II. If this is what we get, then for sisters at least, the Charadon content remains optional.
I think this is the most likely case. I can't imagine they will have her active in the book without providing some rules content. Her being outside of the Orders makes an Order supplement like Cult of Strife unlikely.


But she isn't outside of the orders, she is the head of the convent sanctorum, making here a member of every order, even the ordo minoris.

Lelith is in the main Codex not the Supplement section of the campaign book.

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
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Canada

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
For what it's worth, allowing unnamed Canonesses to ride in the warsuits would probably make the foot-based version of them functionally useless, similar to what we see in Marines - why take a standard footslogger when jump packs, bikes, Terminators, Thunderwolves, etc are right there and far more effective in their role?

That's mostly for mobility in the front lines. If you want simple buffing there's a reason for it.

My point is that we've now got a Palatine which is like an even cheaper version of the Canoness if the buffs are all you're looking for. Insert a Warsuit Canoness and suddenly the regular Canoness is awkwardly sandwiched between two arguably more efficient options depending on what it is you're looking to get out of the unit.

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