Author |
Message |
|
|
|
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
|
2022/01/09 14:25:15
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon
Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook
|
The Tau are the 40k version of Skaven.
Let us consider the similarities:
1) Short individual lifespans
2) Leadership caste with mysterious powers and an extremely significant level of control over all levels of society (Grey Seers/Ethereal)
3) Leadership caste has a notably longer lifespan than average
4) Extremely rigidly separated parts of society by technical specialisation (Clans/Castes)
5) Obsession with high technology (Skyre/Earth Caste)
6) Travel by means not normally used by other races (Tunnels/No true warp drive)
7) Preference to destroy their enemies by underhand methods rather than outright conflict (Every Skaven plot ever/Water Caste)
8) Strong Japanese influence (Eshin/Battlesuits)
Obviously there are some minor differences, but overall I think they are fairly insignificant Automatically Appended Next Post: Also "Good good" = "Greater good"
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/09 17:29:14
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 19:51:06
Subject: Re:The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Storm Trooper with Maglight
|
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 19:54:55
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
|
But Tau lack key things
1) No whiskers or fur
2) No tails
3) No boils/puss/rot/chaos
4) No reliance on a mystical powerful rock that contains the raw essence of Chaos
5) Tau tech actually works as intended. It doesn't backfire (with sometimes hilarious results); its not rickety and held together with whatever the heck you found; its professional clean and reliable
6) Tau are not in-fighters in the least. Skaven are famous for having great schemes and power and then losing it all to infighting.
7) Tau have a use/respect for other races; Skaven care only for skaven (and even them they backstab).
|
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 20:04:17
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon
|
Tau technology is carefully and cautiously tested before its carefully and cautiously field tested. Skaven tech…isn’t.
Skaven scoff solidified magic to power themselves. Tau do not.
Skaven are a mess of horrific backstabbing and blame passing. Tau are not.
Afraid you’re quite wide of the mark on this one.
|
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 20:15:51
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Fireknife Shas'el
|
Graphite wrote:The Tau are the 40k version of Skaven.
Let us consider the similarities:
1) Short individual lifespans
Poorly established by lore. Average human lifespan is pretty bad in much the imperium, though for other reasons.
2) Leadership caste with mysterious powers and an extremely significant level of control over all levels of society (Grey Seers/Ethereal)
3) Leadership caste has a notably longer lifespan than average
Same could be said for humans, as the rich/powerful can afford the longevity tech. And the Navis Nobilite have mysterious powers and significant control as well!
4) Extremely rigidly separated parts of society by technical specialisation (Clans/Castes)
5) Obsession with high technology (Skyre/Earth Caste)
Sounds like the Admech to me. They have their own planets which are only nominally part of the imperium.
6) Travel by means not normally used by other races (Tunnels/No true warp drive)
Eldar/Webway. Tau have low tech interstellar travel that most races grow out of.
7) Preference to destroy their enemies by underhand methods rather than outright conflict (Every Skaven plot ever/Water Caste)
The Tau's preference isn't to destroy their enemies, but turn them into friends. The Skavens are just cowardly.
8) Strong Japanese influence (Eshin/Battlesuits)
Wot? Eshin is Japanese? Assassins are middle eastern...
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/09 20:16:28
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 21:04:33
Subject: Re:The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch
|
ive made the arguement the Admech are closest to skaven before:
Ruled by a caste of priest-scientists that is constantly bickering amongst itself
has a large number of rank and file infantry that the leadership treats as utterly disposable in the pursuit of the leaders goals
these infantry are fond of powerful, long range arquebus that need stands to aim properly
supports these disposable infantry with wonderous war machines.
has access to technology significantly in advance of the baseline for the setting, full of funky power glows, and constantly seeks new and even better tech.
found almost everywhere the main human faction is, almost omnipresent (in a different manner to skaven, granted, but still), and frequently operates in its own intrests to the detriment of those humans.
|
To be a man in such times is to be one amongst untold billions. It is to live in the cruelest and most bloody regime imaginable. These are the tales of those times. Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has been forgotten, never to be relearned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim dark future there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.
Coven of XVth 2000pts
The Blades of Ruin 2,000pts Watch Company Rho 1650pts
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 21:16:22
Subject: Re:The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Longtime Dakkanaut
|
You could just as easily say the dark eldar are space skaven.
To quote another post I've read on it
Unseen numbers in an unseen labyrinth spreading across the setting with one big node city as the focus, with groups that stand above the masses led by the most scheming and dastardly, constantly plotting to backstab each other and seize power, their industry powered by slaves taken in the night from the races above who whisper half-believed tales of them like boogeymen, augmented by flesh-crafting doctors and engineers of insane part-magical technologies.
Hard to say which one we're talking about.
But really, you can link a bunch of minor similarities between heaps of factions, and it doesn't mean a whole lot. I could just as easily draw a bunch of parallels between tyranids and lizardmen as I could with tyranids and vampire counts.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/09 21:32:30
Subject: Re:The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Mighty Vampire Count
|
Counter:
The Skaven hate and fear all others and are paranoid that all other Skaven (and everything else) is trying to kill them or spoil their plans or humiliate them and of course they are right.
Skaven will eat other Skaven or anything else by choice or neccesity - meat is meat. If they can combine it with the next point they will.
Skaven enjoy killing and humiliating others - from their own race or others.
Only Insane Skaven leaders (by their standards) would ever lead their armies into battle
Skaven spend as much or more time sabotaging other Skaven than fighting enemies.
Skaven worship a god - a horrific, vicious, vengeful, petty and twisted god but a god no-the-less.
Skaven do not respect their elders or Ethereal equivalent - they may fear and obey them but would kill them if it benifted them and they could get away wth it.
Skaven do not bond with their brothers - they eat them
Skaven females are drugged, biological breeding machines far larger than a normal skaven
|
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
|
|
|
2022/01/09 23:29:11
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Fixture of Dakka
|
What've the Skaven ever done to you, man-thing, to deserve comparing to the Tau?
|
2021-4 Plog - Here we go again... - my fifth attempt at a Dakka PLOG
My Pile of Potential - updates ongoing...
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote:This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote:You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling. - No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something... |
|
|
|
2022/01/10 00:54:27
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Terrifying Doombull
|
Dysartes wrote:What've the Skaven ever done to you, man-thing, to deserve comparing to the Tau?
Well, if they existed (which they obviously do not), they might be to blame for the mysterious tunnel leading to my food storage that is now empty of food.
|
Efficiency is the highest virtue. |
|
|
|
2022/01/10 01:47:07
Subject: Re:The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Dakka Veteran
|
Tau to Skaven: Do you fight for the greater good?
Skaven: No, I fight for the greater cheese.
Enough said.
|
"Iz got a plan. We line up. Yell Waaagh, den krump them in the face. Den when we're done, we might yell Waagh one more time." Warboss Gutstompa |
|
|
|
2022/01/10 03:55:12
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
|
Well they need to be exterminated just like Skaven so good enuff justification for me....
Burn 'em all!
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 07:30:53
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Longtime Dakkanaut
|
The Imperium is space skaven. Urbanized, degenerate nation who all backstab and harm each other, pollute indiscriminately, barely understand their own technology, and who need to be exterminated before they ruin the world/galaxy for everyone who isn't morally bankrupt like them.
They even have a council of 13, with the 13th place symbolically held by their deity.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 10:47:50
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon
Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook
|
Overread wrote:But Tau lack key things
1) No whiskers or fur
2) No tails
3) No boils/puss/rot/chaos
4) No reliance on a mystical powerful rock that contains the raw essence of Chaos
5) Tau tech actually works as intended. It doesn't backfire (with sometimes hilarious results); its not rickety and held together with whatever the heck you found; its professional clean and reliable
6) Tau are not in-fighters in the least. Skaven are famous for having great schemes and power and then losing it all to infighting.
7) Tau have a use/respect for other races; Skaven care only for skaven (and even them they backstab).
Note - this topic was not meant to be taken entirely seriously. Or even at all seriously. However:
1), 2) Wasn't talking about physical characteristics
3) Tau don't have a large warp presence. Yet. The Horned Rat isn't in 40k. Yet. Who's to say what form the eventual warp representation God of the Tau will take? Even Slaanesh is only a couple of thousand years old in 40k (while also being eternally old)
4) Skaven aren't reliant on Warpstone either. It's just the most efficient thing they have as a power source
5) The first generation rail sniper rifles with a targeting matrix which would overload and fry the pathfinder's brain was not exactly safe
6) Commander Farsight
7) Do they? Do they really? Or is it a means to an end?
Automatically Appended Next Post: John Prins wrote: Graphite wrote:The Tau are the 40k version of Skaven.
Let us consider the similarities:
1) Short individual lifespans
Poorly established by lore. Average human lifespan is pretty bad in much the imperium, though for other reasons.
2) Leadership caste with mysterious powers and an extremely significant level of control over all levels of society (Grey Seers/Ethereal)
3) Leadership caste has a notably longer lifespan than average
Same could be said for humans, as the rich/powerful can afford the longevity tech. And the Navis Nobilite have mysterious powers and significant control as well!
4) Extremely rigidly separated parts of society by technical specialisation (Clans/Castes)
5) Obsession with high technology (Skyre/Earth Caste)
Sounds like the Admech to me. They have their own planets which are only nominally part of the imperium.
6) Travel by means not normally used by other races (Tunnels/No true warp drive)
Eldar/Webway. Tau have low tech interstellar travel that most races grow out of.
7) Preference to destroy their enemies by underhand methods rather than outright conflict (Every Skaven plot ever/Water Caste)
The Tau's preference isn't to destroy their enemies, but turn them into friends. The Skavens are just cowardly.
8) Strong Japanese influence (Eshin/Battlesuits)
Wot? Eshin is Japanese? Assassins are middle eastern...
1) Yeah, but natural human lifespan excluding disease/accident is about twice the Tau's
2) Yep, true.
3) Ooh, Admech is an interesting one.
7) Friends who WILL DO WHAT THEY'RE TOLD
8) Ninjas. Automatically Appended Next Post: Dark Eldar are also an interesting option for 40k Tau.
|
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/10 10:55:32
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 10:55:33
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
|
The thing with a few of your examples is they are one-off examples. Farsight is just one commander; for skaven backstabbing is a way of life from the lowest to the highest of their social structure. The fact that they can even function as a larger social structure is amazing, but also based on the fact that they are very cowardly and thus like the safety of big numbers; whilst also being afraid of those within their group who are stronger than them (and also wanting to backstab them).
Skaven are very reliant on Warpstone, it powres most of their technology and their mages. It's the backbone of their economy and war-machine. Take warpstone away and they'd be back to sticks and stones and rusty swords.
And yes Tau might use other races, but Skaven have zero use for other races. They only wish to bring ruination and control to all reaches. Tau are almost the polar opposite, they bring prosperity and order (even if in the end its only the core tau people that will benefit)
|
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 10:58:27
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon
Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook
|
Skaven have a use for other races. Skaven have a LOT of slaves.
It just happens that the only ones they trust enough not to escape, and hence will bring to a battlefield, are Skavenslaves. There are a lot of slaves from other races who never make it out of the mills of Skavenblight.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 12:40:51
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Mighty Vampire Count
|
Graphite wrote:Skaven have a use for other races. Skaven have a LOT of slaves.
It just happens that the only ones they trust enough not to escape, and hence will bring to a battlefield, are Skavenslaves. There are a lot of slaves from other races who never make it out of the mills of Skavenblight.
Slaves also = food. The slaves that tend to survive longest are Skaven
although at least one human managed to survive and use the Skaven against themselves
https://whfb.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adora
|
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
|
|
|
2022/01/10 13:24:29
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Ship's Officer
|
Since the Tau are referred to as fish cows, I'm surprised one of their vehicle code name hasn't been a Manatee. In term of game play, the Tau are more like WHFB WE, lots of hit and run tactics.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 13:30:18
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Leader of the Sept
|
From memory, The first generation ion rifles were also pretty dangerous to the user but that was deemed to be acceptable risk. It’s funny though that Tau plasma has always been toned down compared to other races on the ground of safety and stability, but other super dangerous weapons tech? Naaah, go for it lads. Interesting to see the Tau equivalent to H&S@W Act
|
Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!
Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 |
|
|
|
2022/01/10 16:35:02
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon
Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook
|
Yeah, there was a short story along the lines of a testing ground, Earth caste showing off the new shiny to the Ethereals, Fire Warrior tester's mind gets fried by feedback.
Earth caste says something along the lines of "Oh, hell. Well, we obviously can't put that into production" and is over-ruled by the Ethereal to just get it in production now, because Space Marines.
So yeah... the Tau who really, really care about the citizens of the empire, until they don't. Good Good.
Also worth bearing in mind that, prior to being mind controlled by the Ethereals, the default state of the Tau was constant civil and inter-caste war to the point where the species nearly went extinct. Tau infighting is the natural state. Whatever the Ethereals do ISN'T.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/10 17:22:45
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Trazyn's Museum Curator
|
Eshin hail from Nippon and their design were clearly inspired by pop-culture Ninja.
They're definitely Japanese inspired. Or rather, they take one aspect of Japanese culture.
|
|
|
|
2022/01/16 21:39:31
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
|
The Imperium themselves are 40k Skaven.
Most troops lives have little to no value and number in the trillions.
Ruled by a council of thirteen members, one of which is the faction's resident god.
We're through the looking glass here, people...
|
Games Workshop Delenda Est.
Users on ignore- 53.
If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. |
|
|
|
2022/01/18 09:17:36
Subject: The Tau are Space Skaven
|
|
Dakka Veteran
|
Skavens are just shoved into the Forces of Chaos in 40k, much like the Beastmen. Chaos even has the Death Wheel is more or less a direct port of the Doom Wheel.
|
|
|
|
|