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After visiting a gaming shop today I've been thinking about something that's been on my mind for a while. The paint jobs on display in shops usually tend to look a lot flatter, somehow less vibrant, a bit more sketchy somehow than the models you see online on websites like GW and other makes of miniatures—and those you see posted on here. In my painting a try to go for a clear, crisp bright colour and I'm wondering why it is that there's this difference. Is it just that people generally don't put enough layers on? Or is it a different style that a lot of gamers are really deliberately going for? Or am I just imagining it? Curious what other people think.

Well for one images online show a model vastly bigger (typically) than in reality and, well taken, will generally have good lighting. Reality is a whole mish mash of lighting variables and the same model might look flat in flat lighting, but more contrasty if the light happens to be as such when you view it.


And yes there will be variations, the stores are only working with what the managers/locals can and do choose to produce and that's going to have some local effect happen whereby someone local might have a style or a teaching style that influences how others take up a brush and are inspire.d

Shop models are usually painted by the staff or local customers. Ive had models sat in my old local gw cabinet before. There really is no objective standard for all store displays.

The models online are painted by guys who's sole job is to do that, and whilst I can't confirm, I would imagine that the photos are touched up somewhat prior to publication.

Maybe?
1- That is because pictures are taken with very good lighting that does not exist in everyday environments. (only on displays)
2- Also, because people post process images by bumping the contrast a bit that makes image more vibrant and colorful. (if a picture of a mini is too colorful I assume the artist did some Photoshop post processing a bit)
BTW, free "photoshop" in a browser for yall who did not know https://www.photopea.com/ enjoy.
3- Also, because those images you are seeing through a monitor that is emitting pure light.
4- Also, use of none acrylic paints (acrylic darkens a bit when dries)
5- Also, use of white base-coat, that supports brightness in light colors.
6- Also, use of airbrush helps with building up full color with many layers without wasting time.

A bit of a sad reality, and a bit of a depressing end in the hobby.
I was watching an interview with the best of the best, award winning, master miniature painter on some podcast few years ago. He was asked similar question and he said this: (paraphrasing)
"No matter how awesomely you paint a miniature, a plastic toy from Mcdonalds next to your amazing model in the same light will always look more colorful and brighter!
Very few people can have their miniatures be always displayed and under good lighting where you can see all the work. After spending days on a miniature you take a picture, and put it away into a box. So the sad reality is that the pro-painted miniature lives, for the most part, only as a picture on-line."

Found it to be true for me. All my finished work is in boxes, and only exists as a picture on daka.

Like QAR said, most shops use the local guy who is decent to paint their display minis or the shop owner. If their displays were meant to show off art you'd see better lighting in them with an intentionally placed backdrop.

Display models at shops are to show off models, not art.

If you want to see art on models, go online or find painting competitions that ship models to be judged in person. I guarantee no shop owner wants to pay what a professional artist costs on minis.

 Mothsniper wrote:

" . . . After spending days on a miniature you take a picture, and put it away into a box. So the sad reality is that the pro-painted miniature lives, for the most part, only as a picture on-line."

i'm not really fond of this sentiment. but, this is also true for a lot of art. Mona Lisa lives in the Louvre, but overwhelmingly has only been seen elsewhere, i.e. art books, online, etc. in fact, most art for the entire history of humanity has been kept away from the masses. so, we live in a time where most art is more accessible (including sharing pictures of our miniatures) which is pretty cool. i guess what i'm saying is, having your art only being seen through pictures online is not lamentable.

...

however, the minis being put in boxes is still kind of sad

Pieces you see on company websites and are effectively "box art" are either done in house, or contractually/freelance, by professional artists. They do this for a living and are very good.

Conversely, paint jobs (as mentioned above) that you might see on display at your local hobby shop are done by the average joe and are often nowhere near the quality or level of painters who get paid to do box art.

Thanks for the replies. Some really good points, especially about lighting.

Most shop display cabinet content is mediocre at best, nowhere near Golden Demon tier. The lighting is often poor or nonexistent as well, heck unless you're outside in direct sunlight, ambient lighting is generally very dark compared to the lumens required for a crisp miniature photograph.

I think it depends what your definition of "crisp" is?

If you mean eye-popping colours, then if anything photos are usually worse than reality because a camera doesn't reproduce the colour range as well as your eyes. If a photo looks more vibrant than reality it probably has a filter on it, maybe has been edited, or is an effect of the lighting. Usually when I take a photo of one of my minis I end up editing the colour to try and make it look more like it does in reality.

It could also be an artistic choice. I often mix grey into my colours to dull them down rather than have them out-of-the-pot vibrant, but it depends on the model.

If you mean "crisp" in terms of sharp lines and detailed and whatnot, it's probably because models on the internet are blown up many times their actual size, so you're seeing details you probably miss in reality.

Then lastly you obviously have the skill level of the painters. Most painters simply aren't that good and / or don't spend as much time on their day to day models as they do on their "post to the internet" models.

I’ve heard that GW use CGi to enhance their online pictures, I do t know if that’s a conspiracy theory

Ok, a lot of good stuff on here about comparing store display models to professional box art/website stuff. But that doesn't completely explain what I'm getting at. A lot of the shop stuff doesn't just look flatter than the professional stuff. It looks a lot flatter than my *own* painting. I don't want that to sound like bragging - I don't think I'm particularly good....(yet!).... and some of the store stuff does look great. But even the great store stuff often doesn't have much vibrancy. And that's what's puzzling me. Do a lot of people just really like muted colours? Do they just apply base coats and shade paint and leave it at that?

mrFickle wrote:
I’ve heard that GW use CGi to enhance their online pictures, I do t know if that’s a conspiracy theory

I don't know how much they "CGI" them, but they definitely play with colours and whatnot.

They'll also do stuff like photoshopping the base on (if you flick through the store sometimes you'll find models on identical bases). Aeronautica Imperialis stuff it's also very obvious that they photoshop the bases, it probably just makes them easier to photograph.

mrFickle wrote:
I’ve heard that GW use CGi to enhance their online pictures, I do t know if that’s a conspiracy theory

I mean I guess you could define it as CGI but not really in the sense most would casually understand it.

GW won't be building models using a computer for display. They will do things like take a photo of models and then copy and paste to produce a collage of photos and if done well that could appear pretty natural. Heck they could have 1 squad of models and take a series of photos with them in different positions on the same scene and then merge them together so the 10 studio models becomes 50 in a set design.



In general what you're more thinking of is like what Warmachine have started doing where its a 3D render of a model that is then painted up. You see this a LOT in 3D printing where honestly its rarer to get a designer showing off fully printed models. Partly this is because that market has latched onto the monthly patreon model so designers often don't have time to get things printed before they have to work on the next models; but partly also because its a bit of a split system. You've designers coming from video game and art backgrounds working under contract for people and the designer doesn't even own a printer so its not part of the process.

In general this isn't ideal - in my experience a 3D render or painted render is nice, but nothing sells as well as an actual cast/printed model and a well painted one even more so.

I don't know if anyone has mentioned style yet. some people like their models much more grimy and grimdark. The GW store tends to be more colorful and heroic with their styles.

pInkLight wrote:

 Mothsniper wrote:

" . . . After spending days on a miniature you take a picture, and put it away into a box. So the sad reality is that the pro-painted miniature lives, for the most part, only as a picture on-line."

i'm not really fond of this sentiment. but, this is also true for a lot of art. Mona Lisa lives in the Louvre, but overwhelmingly has only been seen elsewhere, i.e. art books, online, etc. in fact, most art for the entire history of humanity has been kept away from the masses. so, we live in a time where most art is more accessible (including sharing pictures of our miniatures) which is pretty cool. i guess what i'm saying is, having your art only being seen through pictures online is not lamentable.

...

however, the minis being put in boxes is still kind of sad

Mona Lisa is bad example. Because it is NOT in the box and ONLY lives as a image online; It is hanging in the gallery/museum, and people do stand in lines to see it in person. Also Mona Lisa was meant to be viewed at a distance, (thus online reproductions are perfectly fine) but a miniature is meant to be held up close, rotated and looked all over in good lighting. The better the miniature is painted the more important it becomes to hold it in hand with good light.
The statement made by that pro artist talks about a mini ONLY living as picture online not that the mini is Overwhelmingly living as picture online.

But I do hear you! Of course it is not lamentable lolz. It is awesome that minis can live as images online!!! because otherwise.. where but the box?
But perhaps that Pro artist is Jaded like all artist eventually are, and perhaps he is wrong?
_______________________________________
I paint a mini, knowing that when it is finished; I will take pictures and put it into a box, and probably never see it for years, and when I die it will be pawned off or thrown out. But my purpose lies in the process of sculpting and painting, thus the finished model is a bit irrelevant and does not matter that much. And with that understanding I begin to work on next model. Now if I was a professional artist painting MonaLisas for galleries then I would very much care for the finished paintings and how and where they are displayed, how being received, and if my paintings sat in a box then that would be different level of depressing that would rob meaning and purpose. Then how with that understanding would I begin to work on next painting?
It is the nature of the hobby.

 Mr Nobody wrote:
I don't know if anyone has mentioned style yet. some people like their models much more grimy and grimdark. The GW store tends to be more colorful and heroic with their styles.

This is a big part of it. If you look on any dedicated painting subreddit, you'll notice it takes a lot for people to make their models "pop" as much as the GW ones do.

 Mothsniper wrote:
...but a miniature is meant to be held up close, rotated and looked all over in good lighting.

I'd argue that the vast majority of miniatures, even those painted for display shelves, are meant to be viewed from some distance and not looked at super close.

Painting for close examination under bright lights I think is only a small part of the hobby, undertaken by only a small number of hobbyists.

I also tend to paint my models for realistic lighting, though I don't think that's the most common way of doing it. So while painting, yeah, I'll use some bright multidirectional lamps, but I'll also pull it out from under the lamps from time to time to make sure it looks good with just my regular room lights since that's how it'll be viewed 99% of the time.

Jandgalf wrote:
Ok, a lot of good stuff on here about comparing store display models to professional box art/website stuff. But that doesn't completely explain what I'm getting at. A lot of the shop stuff doesn't just look flatter than the professional stuff. It looks a lot flatter than my *own* painting. I don't want that to sound like bragging - I don't think I'm particularly good....(yet!).... and some of the store stuff does look great. But even the great store stuff often doesn't have much vibrancy. And that's what's puzzling me. Do a lot of people just really like muted colours? Do they just apply base coats and shade paint and leave it at that?

Yes. For a lot of people, primer + basecoat + wash is about all they can muster, and that's okay if painting is not their hobby. Sometimes you've just got to get the models done so you can play the game.

And there's a certain benefit to having some "achievable" paintjobs in a shop display cabinet. "Here's the bare minimum that even YOU can do, and you can start playing this game too". But you need to balance that out with better pieces IMO to actually sell the game "here's what's possible when you paint these gorgeous models".

 Overread wrote:

mrFickle wrote:
I’ve heard that GW use CGi to enhance their online pictures, I do t know if that’s a conspiracy theory

I mean I guess you could define it as CGI but not really in the sense most would casually understand it.

GW won't be building models using a computer for display. They will do things like take a photo of models and then copy and paste to produce a collage of photos and if done well that could appear pretty natural. Heck they could have 1 squad of models and take a series of photos with them in different positions on the same scene and then merge them together so the 10 studio models becomes 50 in a set design.



In general what you're more thinking of is like what Warmachine have started doing where its a 3D render of a model that is then painted up. You see this a LOT in 3D printing where honestly its rarer to get a designer showing off fully printed models. Partly this is because that market has latched onto the monthly patreon model so designers often don't have time to get things printed before they have to work on the next models; but partly also because its a bit of a split system. You've designers coming from video game and art backgrounds working under contract for people and the designer doesn't even own a printer so its not part of the process.

In general this isn't ideal - in my experience a 3D render or painted render is nice, but nothing sells as well as an actual cast/printed model and a well painted one even more so.

All I meant was they paint the model and take a picture and then enhance the picture on a computer. But I will repeat this could all be conspiracy level nonsense, I have no idea if it’s true.

I have multiple miniatures sitting on my computer stand/raiser.
I like to look at them whilst I'm waiting for stuff to load or whatever.
These are miniatures/dioramas I've made specifically for this purpose. I keep them in little plastic display boxes to keep the dust off.

But going forwards I am going to try and paint basic grunts in a more basic fashion. I'll reserve going all-out for characters and the models I tend to display on my computer.