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This idea has been turning around in my mind for a while. Many of the units in the HH game are really just the same units found in older editions of 40k with a few bits of FW kit. Sure, the mkVII helmets don't fit in, but that's a small oversight. And I figure with 40k slowly pushing out the OP space marine kits there is going to be a lot of space marines collecting dust on our shelves.

Would you guys use old marine for HH or just go back to playing older editions of 40k?

I'm not going to hold anyone back for using the older 40k marine models in HH where possible. However, my Sons of Horus is my 3rd marine army after CSM and Primaris. And I have no plans of picking up any of the older 40k space marine stuff to add to my HH collection. Just like I have no plans (save a Rhino that might go full CSM anyway) of my SoH being used in any 40k game. Everything I add to my SoH pretty much has to be purposed for HH and in plastic with limited exceptions.

I'll simply go without Assault Marines until a HH version is added. That applies to terminators, dreadnoughts, speeders and anything else. For me, HH is more about the spectacle and experience of 30k. Not a retirement home for old 40k models. But to be sure, what other players/collectors do, is really none of my business.

IMHO it's more likely GW will blur the line between Firstborn and Primaris until it's meaningless and you will be able to use any Marine mini for anything. As they have literally just done with Indomitus terminator armour.

Doubtful considering large portions of the 40k Marine army don't exist in the Heresy and those units that do are also often very different from their Heresy counterparts.

If we are doing battle at “the farm” there had better be orks, and our gauntlets should be red.

I honestly suspect they are just going to blur the lines, and a marine will just be a marine. Not including primaris in your HH army will be just like not using modern mks of armor, or post-heresy equipment.

That's not blurring the lines between Marines that's blurring the lines between 10k years of setting and background.

 Gert wrote:
That's not blurring the lines between Marines that's blurring the lines between 10k years of setting and background.

Sorry, my primary POV is 40k, not 30k. All IMHO:

From a 40k standpoint what should the difference between a primaris and a firstborn be? What it the difference between mk. III armor, mk. VIII or phobos armor? With a d6 granularity on the scale that 40k is at, none worth noting. Sure, the primaris implants make them a little tougher/stronger /whatever, but not enough to warrant game mechanics. IMHO a firstborn marine with a bolter in heresy armor should have the same game mechanics as an intercessor.

You wouldn’t include the intercessor in a 30k list for the same reason you wouldn’t use a razorback. Not era appropriate.

In my humble opinion primaris firstborn options should be massively compressed, and people could use whatever models they like to compose squads for 40k. The odds of this happening are not good. I think it would be the best option for 40k game play and reducing bloat, but bad for sales, so GW will probably never do it.

A guy can dream though.

I think it's more of an "it depends". I have had the feeling that GW has been trying to replace the first born marines since the release of the Primaris marines.

If you're really into Heresy though, you won't use marines with the Aquila on the chest. As far as the helmets go, there were several forge worlds that used helmets that look similar to the Mark 7 - specifically the Sarum Pattern and you'll see it used it in mark 5 Heresy Armor. Just add some studs! If you must use models with the Aquila, then play Emperor's Children. Paint them purple and gold!

If you want to incorporate the old Chaos models, Word Bearers would work great as post Calth they incorporated the Chaos Star on to their armor. The Night Lords and World Eaters would work great with these models too - just don't use shoulders with the Chaos Star. Some resin heads and shoulders would put them in the Heresy setting. Even just getting some new bolter types would do it too.

If you want to do Space Wolves, just build the 40k boxes with bare heads. None of the torsos have any imperial markings. You may have 3D print some shields and axes. If you play Dark Angels you'll want to snag some of the power armored models - mix and match with the Mark4 marines for the best results. Same goes for the standard bearer. The Blood Angels have jump pack infantry that make AMAZING command squads. They also have some great models that can be mix and matched in mark4 models.

I don’t think it takes a conspiracy theorist to believe that Primaris are intended to replace firstborn. Once they appeared it was just a question of when and how.

I don’t think that starting to drop ‘Primaris’ from unit descriptions mean we’ll end up with Marine armies that use both types without distinction. I think we’ll still see most of what are currently firstborn disappear. The majority of them have replacements already; there are only a few to go now that we have up-sized Termies. And it has to happen - Primaris and firstborn models just don’t look right together. It’s not just the size difference, but the proportions and posing of the firstborn. What GW has to fix along the way is the multiplicity of over-specialised Primaris units. It’s a bit ridiculous, and too similar to the Heresy-era approach. Time to have ‘proper’ Primaris tac squads with mixed weapon types.

As for folding the firstborn into Heresy, I think the decision to up-size the Mk VI armour puts paid to that. It’s clearly going to be the standard going forward. But they could move many of the firstborn vehicles into Heresy. The issue there is that most of them are inferior in terms of detail and ease of assembly to the new Heresy vehicles.

 Snord wrote:
As for folding the firstborn into Heresy, I think the decision to up-size the Mk VI armour puts paid to that. It’s clearly going to be the standard going forward. But they could move many of the firstborn vehicles into Heresy. The issue there is that most of them are inferior in terms of detail and ease of assembly to the new Heresy vehicles.

Of the 16 non-Primaris vehicles (excluding Land Speeder duplicates and Dreads) from the generic Space Marine list, 9 didn't exist until after the Heresy ended. The Razorback, for example, wasn't discovered until M36 and the Crusader variant of the Land Raider not being introduced until M39. The only things that should be in HH are the 40k variant patterns of HH units like Predators, Rhinos, and Land Raiders because they very much existed.

This isn't targeting anyone in particular BTW rather just a general point but I really hate the idea that HH should become a refuge for Firstborn stuff just because it's not got Primaris.

 Mr Nobody wrote:
This idea has been turning around in my mind for a while. Many of the units in the HH game are really just the same units found in older editions of 40k with a few bits of FW kit. Sure, the mkVII helmets don't fit in, but that's a small oversight. And I figure with 40k slowly pushing out the OP space marine kits there is going to be a lot of space marines collecting dust on our shelves.

Would you guys use old marine for HH or just go back to playing older editions of 40k?

Sure. Use torsos without Aquilas and minimize the MKVII helmets.

 Mr Nobody wrote:
This idea has been turning around in my mind for a while. Many of the units in the HH game are really just the same units found in older editions of 40k with a few bits of FW kit. Sure, the mkVII helmets don't fit in, but that's a small oversight. And I figure with 40k slowly pushing out the OP space marine kits there is going to be a lot of space marines collecting dust on our shelves.

Would you guys use old marine for HH or just go back to playing older editions of 40k?

Nope. HH doesn't have my Space Marine army. The Tactical Squads in HH are much different than my 40k ones, for example. Nor does HH have any of my other armies.

It is a possibility, but a remote one, and no bigger resolution either way will be made by GW anytime soon. Their bestselling faction and all that

I am anticipating a re-release of mkiv and mkiii marines that are the same size as the mkvi in the not too distant future.