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I still love it to this day. So much of it was based on whatever the players wanted, and so much do it yourself modeling. I also miss the Squats. Asteroid mine battles between dwarves in spaaaaace and goblins in spaaaaace! Oh. And Zoats!

Ah, them wuz the days.

Anyway, just PMed a guy who lives not far from me. Anybody wanna get together for some old skool stuff?

I'd totally play it if anyone else around here would. I've got a whole bunch of models from that era too, plus a good amount of lichen to throw around the table

I intend to switch to playing Rogue Trader when my pensioner days begin.. The 40K miniature lineup has never been better for it, and just keeps on getting better. Still have my Ambull & Zoat from BSF unbuilt, waiting for the right time.. I just wish we'd get more RT-era looking Orks at some point, not a fan of the current plastics.. the only kit I tolerate is the Kommandos one, but its not enough to make a full Mob with, and only makes sense as Blood Axe Kommandos anyways..

I am of the unpopular opinion that overall, current GW models are where it's at.. Take the RTB01 vs 2022 MKVI Tactical Squad for example.. I dont have much nostalghia for the metal minis, many of which had static, derpy poses, and many sculpts were based on the same torsos, just heads and weapons swapped.. IMHO they haven't aged well

My memories of RT era are definitely fond - yeah, the sense of it being anything you wanted it to be, so much unexplained, so many mysteries to uncover... but the rules themselves confused the hell out of me. Battle Manual got you part of the way there but I think I'm a 2nd Ed guy all things being equal

I plan to play some Rogue Trader if and when I have my own place to get it all sorted and ready.

In the meantime, I mainly play Horus Heresy and 2nd Edition 40k, plus 5th Edition WFB. (On that note, there is 3rd Ed WFB in my future too.)

If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

 Nevelon wrote:
If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

Unfortunately, this is the correct answer. I have very fond memories of RT, and it was mindblowing for its time, but I would sooner adapt its open-ended spirit to a more solid ruleset rather than go back. I've been picking up the RT rpg books from Fantasy Flight and that offers a lot of what I'm looking for.

I played the “battle at the farm” from the old book a while back, new models but old rules. It was fun. I just remember having any bigger battles taking forever. 2nd edition would be my go to old hammer.

I have 1st edition, if I could find anyone else who had ever seen it locally I'd play it, but you need to go right back to when it was published for the sort of game to play

e.g. small games, typically used to play 5-15 model forces for the most part, if larger there were a few "Fred, Fred 2, Fred 3" type cookie cutter generic troopers and a limited number who were different.

Battle at the Farm works ok, anything larger and it will bog down

also helps to have a GM present if you want any weird terrain or wandering beasties

the equipment tables always seemed far more suited to use as a list of what was possible with the random rolling only if you wanted NPC forces

 Insectum7 wrote:
I'd totally play it if anyone else around here would. I've got a whole bunch of models from that era too, plus a good amount of lichen to throw around the table

All hail lichen!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 tauist wrote:
I intend to switch to playing Rogue Trader when my pensioner days begin.. The 40K miniature lineup has never been better for it, and just keeps on getting better. Still have my Ambull & Zoat from BSF unbuilt, waiting for the right time.. I just wish we'd get more RT-era looking Orks at some point, not a fan of the current plastics.. the only kit I tolerate is the Kommandos one, but its not enough to make a full Mob with, and only makes sense as Blood Axe Kommandos anyways..

I am of the unpopular opinion that overall, current GW models are where it's at.. Take the RTB01 vs 2022 MKVI Tactical Squad for example.. I dont have much nostalghia for the metal minis, many of which had static, derpy poses, and many sculpts were based on the same torsos, just heads and weapons swapped.. IMHO they haven't aged well

I loved the figs, but they are not really my issue. As a wargame and as a primitive rpg both, I believe the rules were well written AND THE BLASTED GAME JUST DIDN'T TAKE ITSELF TOO SERIOUSLY. The way they do it today, you'd almost think the Emperor and the Chaos gods were real things.

Lighten up GW.


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 Skinflint Games wrote:
My memories of RT era are definitely fond - yeah, the sense of it being anything you wanted it to be, so much unexplained, so many mysteries to uncover... but the rules themselves confused the hell out of me. Battle Manual got you part of the way there but I think I'm a 2nd Ed guy all things being equal

The rules certainly had their drawbacks, turn radii, etc. But, that's the way wargaming was done in the 80s. In some ways it has improved since.

However, I LOVE your first point. I can't remember how many stupid alien races I created in those days, including some non-GW powered armored guys that I cut the heads off of and replaced them with glass gems. See, they had been captured by a silicon based race, who replaced their heads, and were beaming mind control rays... you get the point.

It was wild stuff back then.


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 Fifty wrote:
I plan to play some Rogue Trader if and when I have my own place to get it all sorted and ready.

In the meantime, I mainly play Horus Heresy and 2nd Edition 40k, plus 5th Edition WFB. (On that note, there is 3rd Ed WFB in my future too.)

Purely out of curiosity, why 2nd rather than 1st?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Nevelon wrote:
If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

Very well, sir. At dawn. Your choice of weapons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Fugazi wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

Unfortunately, this is the correct answer. I have very fond memories of RT, and it was mindblowing for its time, but I would sooner adapt its open-ended spirit to a more solid ruleset rather than go back. I've been picking up the RT rpg books from Fantasy Flight and that offers a lot of what I'm looking for.

So you'll be his second.

Who will serve as mine?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Andykp wrote:
I played the “battle at the farm” from the old book a while back, new models but old rules. It was fun. I just remember having any bigger battles taking forever. 2nd edition would be my go to old hammer.

In a way, it did have its drawbacks. One was the time commitment. I think that over about thirty infantry and three dreadnaughts, robots, vehicles, whatever per side were pretty much the limit to a reasonable game.

And the fact was that you could easily create very unbalanced armies just based on the points system.

And the psyker powers! Talk about stuff that was mind blowing! Anybody remember Temporal Distort?

Amazing how many times that one was "randomly" rolled up ;-) I even "randomly" rolled it up myself a few times


Automatically Appended Next Post:

leopard wrote:
I have 1st edition, if I could find anyone else who had ever seen it locally I'd play it, but you need to go right back to when it was published for the sort of game to play

e.g. small games, typically used to play 5-15 model forces for the most part, if larger there were a few "Fred, Fred 2, Fred 3" type cookie cutter generic troopers and a limited number who were different.

Battle at the Farm works ok, anything larger and it will bog down

also helps to have a GM present if you want any weird terrain or wandering beasties

the equipment tables always seemed far more suited to use as a list of what was possible with the random rolling only if you wanted NPC forces

I guess this is really why I loved it best. It DID require a GM for all but the simplest battles. But this lended itself to marvelous roleplaying potential.

I can't stress enough how well it works for OSR roleplaying. Out own Zinderneuf did this table here, which was copied here https://chartopia.d12dev.com/chart/612/ and references the Orcs In Space rpg rules from Dragon magazine #149.

Best gonzo SF roleplaying out there, IMHO.

 NapoleonInSpace wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

Very well, sir. At dawn. Your choice of weapons.

40k duel weapons? There is only one option: Dreadsock. While I generally prefer my 2nd ed dread for his extra mass and heft, the RT dread can serve (even in death)


Back when I was younger gamer (late 80s, early 90s) I preferred more crunchy systems. Car Wars, SFB, AD&D, Hero, Rolemaster, RT-40k. Lot of details, lot of moving parts. Mastering the system was half the game. Now as a wizened living ancestor, I find myself drawn to systems where the rules take a back seat to the play. Fast and loose RPGs like Savage Worlds, and the lighter pre-bloat versions of 40k like 3rd and 8th. (and hopefully 10th, but we’ll see). I can still pour over tomes and find the broken min/max wombo-combos to bust the system, but it takes away from my time yelling at clouds. I’d rather just toss together a fluffy fun list, find a like minded opponent, and toss some dice around on a fun game.

Neither way is right or wrong, just a different place in my life.

At times I have been moved by fits of nostalgia to grab all the Rogue Trader books. The biggest obstacle is that those books are no longer in the discount bin, and getting enough to play is a considerable outlay.

My first game of 40k was with the beakies, and it left me cold - in retrospect because the scenario was somewhat weak and I was unused to miniatures games - I did board gaming and RPGs.

When I got into 2nd, the experience was better, and that's why I'm still playing it.

 Nevelon wrote:
Back when I was younger gamer (late 80s, early 90s) I preferred more crunchy systems. Car Wars, SFB, AD&D, Hero, Rolemaster, RT-40k. Lot of details, lot of moving parts. Mastering the system was half the game. Now as a wizened living ancestor, I find myself drawn to systems where the rules take a back seat to the play. Fast and loose RPGs like Savage Worlds, and the lighter pre-bloat versions of 40k like 3rd and 8th. (and hopefully 10th, but we’ll see). I can still pour over tomes and find the broken min/max wombo-combos to bust the system, but it takes away from my time yelling at clouds. I’d rather just toss together a fluffy fun list, find a like minded opponent, and toss some dice around on a fun game.

Neither way is right or wrong, just a different place in my life.

Are you me?

 Nevelon wrote:

 NapoleonInSpace wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
If I want to do 40k roleplaying, there are better systems.
If I want to do 40k wargaming, RT was kind of a hot mess.
If I want to use vintage minis, I just pull the, off the shelf and use them.

It was fun at the time, but rose tinted nostalgia only goes so far.

Very well, sir. At dawn. Your choice of weapons.

40k duel weapons? There is only one option: Dreadsock. While I generally prefer my 2nd ed dread for his extra mass and heft, the RT dread can serve (even in death)

Spoiler:

Back when I was younger gamer (late 80s, early 90s) I preferred more crunchy systems. Car Wars, SFB, AD&D, Hero, Rolemaster, RT-40k. Lot of details, lot of moving parts. Mastering the system was half the game. Now as a wizened living ancestor, I find myself drawn to systems where the rules take a back seat to the play. Fast and loose RPGs like Savage Worlds, and the lighter pre-bloat versions of 40k like 3rd and 8th. (and hopefully 10th, but we’ll see). I can still pour over tomes and find the broken min/max wombo-combos to bust the system, but it takes away from my time yelling at clouds. I’d rather just toss together a fluffy fun list, find a like minded opponent, and toss some dice around on a fun game.

Neither way is right or wrong, just a different place in my life.

Well, I was there at dawn and you didn't show up. So I declared victory and went to breakfast.

I certainly get what you are saying about crunchy systems. To this day I love OSR clones of D&D, but won't play 5th or whatever the Hell it is up to now. I gave it a try a couple of years ago. Nobody died.

Well, the orcs died, and the vampires died (again) and lots of giant creepy crawly things that I don't know the names of died, but no PCs died, and they were doing some pretty stupid things.

Why do I need a bunch of extra rules just so my character can never take any risks and lose?

My thing, anyway.

Back to 1ed 40k, I think that it makes a great wargame and rpg (again, with a few mods, such as those from Dragon mag #149) AT THE OSR LEVEL. But, as that's the only one I ever had any fun with, what else would I want?

In the end, play what you enjoy, and good gaming to all.

1st edition was, and still is, great. My copy of the rules has definitely seen better days (I don't think I've lost any pages, despite some of them dropping out occasionally), and I never chucked out my old White Dwarfs with the early army lists.

I'm returning to 40k after a loooong gap. 2nd Edition killed off 40k amongst my friends, and I drifted away from the game until recently.

As mentioned on other threads, I'm restoring/repainting my 1st Edition Imperial Guard army that I rediscovered in 2020. I admit to having played some solo games with the original rules: a couple of "training exercises" between IG platoons, as well as a few good old-fashioned "roll-up a scenario and use whatever models are to hand".

john_chandler wrote:
1st edition was, and still is, great. I admit to having played some solo games with the original rules: a couple of "training exercises" between IG platoons, as well as a few good old-fashioned "roll-up a scenario and use whatever models are to hand".

Boy uh boy do I hear ya, my friend.

I love soloing on occasion myself. I use this guy's tables which I found not too long ago https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/493584.page#11536744 and was so inspired I added another table to the list that I think kind of draw everything together.

Personally, I kind of enjoy the GMless rpg, where the players work together to construct the campaign. If I can find some people not too far off, or willing to do it online, I think I'll give it a go.