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As the prices of GW figures really started to take off in the early Aughts, I made the decision to sell off my Imperial Guard and replace them with historical figures, which cost 1/3 as much. Thus, I've got a lot of German and Soviet troops in 25mm scale.

This decision was made with the idea of using them as historical figures, but I never got around to do it.

Until now.

I think Bolt Action may be the best fit because the scale is compatible and I like Andy Chambers' previous work.

Any players out there? Disgruntled ex-players?

I won't change your mind. I think it is Rick P and Alessio and not Andy C though.

You may also want to glance at Battlegroup or Chain of Command as well. Those are two other popular WWII games that will fit your scale in addition to Bolt Action.

 Easy E wrote:
I won't change your mind. I think it is Rick P and Alessio and not Andy C though.

You may also want to glance at Battlegroup or Chain of Command as well. Those are two other popular WWII games that will fit your scale in addition to Bolt Action.

I think it's an "all of the above." I saw Chambers did the Soviet book, but it looks like lots of ex-GW folks are involved, which is fine.

Part of the attraction is the GW tie-in, which should make it easier to pull some of my GW pals into it.

Consider Konflikt 47 as well. It’s weird war but can be stripped of fantastic machines and creatures to play straight ww2.

It handles close combat differently and removes templates from the game while it also adds a more developed reaction system.

I still enjoy 40k but Bolt Action is easily my favorite game right now. I really recommend checking it out.

I'm in a similar boat to the OP here. Almost everyone I have spoken to has said it's a really great games system with some good mechanics. It is pretty ubiquitous too, played in a lot of places and so no problem finding events and tournaments etc

Only challenge for me is whether to go for Bolt Action or Battlegroup; I already have a 15mm WW2 force and table of terrain to use with that game. Decisions!

I won't change your mind.

This game is well balanced, rich without being overwehlming, you can use just any 28mm range you like, and warlord games often puts out bundles, sales, or events.

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
I won't change your mind.

This game is well balanced, rich without being overwehlming, you can use just any 28mm range you like, and warlord games often puts out bundles, sales, or events.

I've heard that it is (not surprisingly) the antithesis of GW in terms of value for money and that they have some excellent deals. A friend of mine has cautioned me to wait for Black Friday before diving in.

They are! And they don't just do bolt action but a handful of other games i'd happily try if i find someone to play with!

Pacific wrote:I'm in a similar boat to the OP here. Almost everyone I have spoken to has said it's a really great games system with some good mechanics. It is pretty ubiquitous too, played in a lot of places and so no problem finding events and tournaments etc

Only challenge for me is whether to go for Bolt Action or Battlegroup; I already have a 15mm WW2 force and table of terrain to use with that game. Decisions!

Do both.

Commissar von Toussaint wrote:As the prices of GW figures really started to take off in the early Aughts, I made the decision to sell off my Imperial Guard and replace them with historical figures, which cost 1/3 as much. Thus, I've got a lot of German and Soviet troops in 25mm scale.

This decision was made with the idea of using them as historical figures, but I never got around to do it.

Until now.

I think Bolt Action may be the best fit because the scale is compatible and I like Andy Chambers' previous work.

Any players out there? Disgruntled ex-players?

As you are coming from a GW experience, I think you're putting too much emphasis on choosing a ruleset.

Yes, Bolt Action is the most ubiquitous option for 28mm play. Yes it will be a punch in the face when you see how much you are expected to pay for the special dice. And yes, you should probably do it anyway.

However, once you've got a pair of 28mm forces painted up, there are a world of options you can explore as far as rulesets. In many areas Bolt Action may be the only game in town, but if you can find an interested opponent or a historical gaming group, you can explore a wide range of WW2 rules.

As has been mentioned, maybe dip your toe into WWW2 also. K47(based on the earlier edition of BA) is an easy addition but there are other options as well. Usually to get into WWW2, all you need is your existing WW2 army and a couple additional "Weird" units.

 Eilif wrote:
As you are coming from a GW experience, I think you're putting too much emphasis on choosing a ruleset.

Well, since I've got the armies already painted up, that's the thing I need.

There was a time when I collected alternate sci-fi and fantasy rules systems, but now I'd just like to go with something that's decent. I think Bolt Action fits the bill and seems to have lots of support, which will make finding opponents easier.

My purpose in this thread was to determine if there was some weakness or issue with it.

The main rule quirk in my experience is small 1 man units often wreaking havoc or capping stuff in late game after they didn't flee following losses. Not really a quirk but strange thing.

Maybe also a bit frustrating when tour 75 pts airstrike kills your dudes on the totally opposite side of the board because you rolled a mistake but to be fair otherwise airstrikes are just that powerful so I guess that balanced it.

Maybe flamethrower tanks, they are said to be irritating.

Other than that...

As you can see, minor or very specific issue, no structural flaws.

Commissar von Toussaint wrote:


I've heard that it is (not surprisingly) the antithesis of GW in terms of value for money and that they have some excellent deals.

This is the case with anything historical. There's competition, so the models need to be at least somewhat competitive price-wise. Mk. X Power Armor is a GW design, and exists solely as a GW design. So if a company makes a figure that's wearing it (or something very similar), then GW can go after that company. But you can't do that with a guy wearing historically accurate "1944 Panzer Grenadier kit" because it's historical, and in the public domain. Anyone who wants to can design a figure that's outfitted like that. And that keeps the prices down.

Commissar von Toussaint wrote:

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
I won't change your mind.

This game is well balanced, rich without being overwehlming, you can use just any 28mm range you like, and warlord games often puts out bundles, sales, or events.

I've heard that it is (not surprisingly) the antithesis of GW in terms of value for money and that they have some excellent deals. A friend of mine has cautioned me to wait for Black Friday before diving in.

Warlord figures are a safe choice, but know that they are not always the best or most affordable. There are allot of great makers of 28mm WW2.

There are also allot of affordable metal figs which can make putting together a force quicker.

I'm not an expert, but folks here and places like Lead Adventure (big historical contingent) can tell you more about the comparisons between different brands.

 Eilif wrote:

Pacific wrote:I'm in a similar boat to the OP here. Almost everyone I have spoken to has said it's a really great games system with some good mechanics. It is pretty ubiquitous too, played in a lot of places and so no problem finding events and tournaments etc

Only challenge for me is whether to go for Bolt Action or Battlegroup; I already have a 15mm WW2 force and table of terrain to use with that game. Decisions!

Do both.

Commissar von Toussaint wrote:As the prices of GW figures really started to take off in the early Aughts, I made the decision to sell off my Imperial Guard and replace them with historical figures, which cost 1/3 as much. Thus, I've got a lot of German and Soviet troops in 25mm scale.

This decision was made with the idea of using them as historical figures, but I never got around to do it.

Until now.

I think Bolt Action may be the best fit because the scale is compatible and I like Andy Chambers' previous work.

Any players out there? Disgruntled ex-players?

As you are coming from a GW experience, I think you're putting too much emphasis on choosing a ruleset.

Yes, Bolt Action is the most ubiquitous option for 28mm play. Yes it will be a punch in the face when you see how much you are expected to pay for the special dice. And yes, you should probably do it anyway.

However, once you've got a pair of 28mm forces painted up, there are a world of options you can explore as far as rulesets. In many areas Bolt Action may be the only game in town, but if you can find an interested opponent or a historical gaming group, you can explore a wide range of WW2 rules.

As has been mentioned, maybe dip your toe into WWW2 also. K47(based on the earlier edition of BA) is an easy addition but there are other options as well. Usually to get into WWW2, all you need is your existing WW2 army and a couple additional "Weird" units.

Yep, Bolt Action is the best value for your buck. Its my least favorite of the WW2 rulesets I play (and tbh I often would rather not play it at all, its one of those games where I have to be in a certain mood and maybe hate myself just a smidge if I'm going to play it), but once you build an army for Bolt Action theres probably another hundred rulesets that you can use your minis for without issue.

Bolt Action is a fine game. It had a few rules that didn't work well or too well in 1st ed, like flamethrowers and recon vehicles, but by and large 2nd ed addressed such issues.

The only thing that comes to mind as being potentially controversial is that 2nd ed introduced blast templates for more immersion and fewer moments of having the same guy exploded by the same shell six times. Not a problem as far as I'm concerned, but as I learned from some of the people who adore GW's efforts since 40k 8th ed, apparently blast templates have their critics.

 Eilif wrote:

Commissar von Toussaint wrote:

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
I won't change your mind.

This game is well balanced, rich without being overwehlming, you can use just any 28mm range you like, and warlord games often puts out bundles, sales, or events.

I've heard that it is (not surprisingly) the antithesis of GW in terms of value for money and that they have some excellent deals. A friend of mine has cautioned me to wait for Black Friday before diving in.

Warlord figures are a safe choice, but know that they are not always the best or most affordable. There are allot of great makers of 28mm WW2.

There are also allot of affordable metal figs which can make putting together a force quicker.

I'm not an expert, but folks here and places like Lead Adventure (big historical contingent) can tell you more about the comparisons between different brands.

In that regard you probably want to steer clear of Warlord's hybrid resin/metal vehicles if you can get a plastic version from Rubicon. That's not even about price but saving yourself the (considerable) trouble of trying to assemble models with badly fitting parts. May not apply to every single such kit, but I've had enough examples that I just don't want to take any chances if there's a superior alternative.

Also as the proud owner of a metal Italian army, I honestly don't think you save any time by sticking a head on a body over a set of arms, a head and some bags once you figure in the time that goes into cleaning mold lines off metal models.

I'm a big fan of Bolt Action, both the models and the game. I've been playing US and Germans in BA as my secondary game for a little over five years now. I would definitely recommend it. But that wasn't the prompt of this thread so here goes!

(please remember when arguing and flaming me that I wholeheartedly endorse this game)

1. The release is cycle is slow. It's refreshing coming from Warhamster but we're talking most Army Books have never had a re-release since the game has existed.

2. Pinning is a cool mechanic but nothing feels worse than FUBAR'ing a critical order, or failing a simple order with only 1 pin on a veteran or officer-assisted unit.

3. The models are really nice, but there still exists a lot of old metal in the range. Some of the models just aren't nearly as nice as GW.

4. All of the weapon types feel unique and interesting but they have their own problems. Flamethrowers were OP in 1st Ed. so now they can't hit worth a darn and can run out of fuel, even after firing once and missing. An artillery shell hitting a unit can ruin your entire game plan. Machine guns teams are bland are generally not worth it.

5. The rules hearken back to a more complex version of 40K. This is a huge plus to me personally but it means there's a lot of detail in things like remembering how fast a vehicle moved when you're trying to disable it in melee, lots of modifiers to hit and pen armor. Every turn can feel like a checklist of "oh did you remember this" or arguing over soft and hard cover.

6. Random alternating turn order is a neat mechanic but you'll have turns where you're just begging for one die to do one thing and your opponent will draw five in a row. This can happen even when you're not playing a competitive game against someone who has 2x or even 3x your order dice.

7. Big tanks are overpriced. They'll be pinned down by cheap artillery and can never make up their points (outside of Tank Wars games where they're amazingly fun).

8. Lack of variety. Aside from equipment and national special rules, everybody is playing the same army. The edition and codex churn can get exhausting in 40K but there is a huge draw in facing new and different armies.

So run away! Let other people who want to paint camo, weather tanks, ambush enemy units during their own move, coordinate combined arms in a historical setting to achieve tactical supremacy, and try to succeed amidst the chaos of war simulated by pins, morale checks, and random activation have all the fun.

You definitely don't want to get an entire starter army for $120 (at full price, less on sale). What would you do with all that plastic?

Was never upset about the deliberate maxing of you number of units to be fair. You will have an advantage statistically but that means you need to bring troops of lesser qualities or spam little units that are not necesseraly too good then.

Haven't by far played all factions, but soviets are particularly good at this mostly using AT squads, as you can take up to 3 tiny squads per slot...

 Eilif wrote:
Warlord figures are a safe choice, but know that they are not always the best or most affordable. There are allot of great makers of 28mm WW2.

There are also allot of affordable metal figs which can make putting together a force quicker.

I'm not an expert, but folks here and places like Lead Adventure (big historical contingent) can tell you more about the comparisons between different brands.

Mine are from Old Glory and I'm pleased to see they are still in business.

They're old school, and their vehicles are metal, which is...different.

In fact, I own a cast-lead Panther. Talk about a heavy tank!

Since you're in the US, I thought I'd mention if you want to expand into Warlord made armies, Amazon actually can have amazing sales on the starter sets. If you keep them on your wishlist, many will fall to the $80-90. The US Army is $78 even now.

Then if you want to buy directly from Warlord, take that ~$100 you save on an army starter and buy some metal minis and rarer vehicles you can only find on their webstore.

Interesting list there Warptide, and one thing for sure is that I'm now going to use the term Warhamster when talking about GW games. Absolutely spot on

I guess in some ways, Bolt Action is probably what 40k would be these days if the 'founding fathers' (Priestley & co.) were able to make a game without the sales teams directing everything.

 Geifer wrote:

Also as the proud owner of a metal Italian army, I honestly don't think you save any time by sticking a head on a body over a set of arms, a head and some bags once you figure in the time that goes into cleaning mold lines off metal models.

There's wide variation in plastic and metal kits, but In general I find the cleanup on metal figures far easier than the assembling plastic Warlord British infantry. I'd be fine never having to arm match and glue in individual true scale 28mm guns ever again.

I also enjoy anatomical realism afforded by a full body sculpt.

 Eilif wrote:
There's wide variation in plastic and metal kits, but In general I find the cleanup on metal figures far easier than the assembling plastic Warlord British infantry. I'd be fine never having to arm match and glue in individual true scale 28mm guns ever again.

I also enjoy anatomical realism afforded by a full body sculpt.

The Old Glory figures I have are good sculpts, all metal, very affordable. Very happy with what I have and I'm chiefly interested in rules and the vehicles.

Just to chime in I love BA. There are many choices for minis, including a lot of great 3D printed items. As stated before, Amazon has some amazing deals that even online game sellers can’t beat. Once you have a historical WW2 army there are a ton of other games you can play. (I even try to mix 40K and BA, nothing like Necrons rising from the Pyramids vs the British 8th army…). Also the rulebooks can be had cheap electronically on several platforms with Google Play Books being pretty discounted. Over all, highly recommended.

Just let the last member of our small quartet of players try out bolt action last evening, he loved it and he's now considering getting a french army as they just came out at a good price in plastic in the warlord range.

Yes he is even more chauvinistic than I am

French are probably my favorite BA army tbh. Also kinda OP

chaos0xomega wrote:
French are probably my favorite BA army tbh. Also kinda OP

One of the lures of that scale is that a platoon-level engagement, the playing field between the armies is more interesting.

I got the rule book and I think it is absolutely brilliant, the perfect fusion of the best editions of 40k. Can't wait to get a game going!

Thanks for the encouragement.

Glad to hear you like it.

You won't be disappointed pal! I'm for one still thinking at getting a little romanian army... But I need to refrain my wargaming urges