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New FAQ's have dropped for all heresy books barring Cthonia.

General thoughts and impressions? How have peoples chosen factions been affected?

Mostly good things in it, thought it seems a little odd that they're going with "legion bolter ammo upgrades lock out bayonets".

Very pleased about the gap between telemechris and Rylanor being closed. Rylanor can actually beat up normal contemptors now while not being the cost of 1.5 of them.

Fulmentarus got toned way back, which is probably a good thing. Also lower points on the various super heavies was good to see.

Honestly, ultramarines kinda deserved the kicking. Their legion units were bloody insane.

Moritat meta.

I always saw them as lone killers.

Yeah. Moritats being able to join any squad means they’re likely to suddenly be tagging around with most non-terminator deathstars. Not my favorite idea.

On the flip side though, it does give a lot of lower strength melee units a big boost. Being able to effectively recreate Red Hand Destroyers is pretty nifty.

I think the idea of it is funny.

Nobody wants to be around Destroyers but a Moritat is an officer and at times has to fill the role of commander and doesn't get the luxury of being a loner all the time.

An underperforming squad doesn't get a Chaplain but the most miserable and dangerous bugger in the detachment as punishment.

Okay that's a hilarious point. I take back what i said.

Makes me wish they could go with Inductii for the lulz factor.

You know, that's a damn good point Gert. "As punishment, here is your new leader... moritat prime whatever, he likes rad grenades, double pistols and murdering things. Good luck"

Moritats being able to join any squad now is a touch on the nutty side. Maul vets suddenly become a very enticing option. Throw in a bunch of shotguns for Concussive and go hunting elite units.
Also means that the Mori can now have some insurance from gets hot rolls if you take an apothecary with whatever squad he's joined.


I was really hoping they'd fix psychic powers in reactions, but alas no. Hallucinations remains the most busted thing going.
Glad Ultramarines copped the nerf. Fulmentarus were ridiculous.
Shame they didn't take the opportunity to address contemptors. But at this point it doesn't look like they will. They probably don't want too as they likely sell really well.

Part of me is thinking moritats may become common in 3rd legion hereticus lists. 15pts for precision shots and hits5 seems fun for plasma shotting a sergant, medic and so on.

 Snrub wrote:

Shame they didn't take the opportunity to address contemptors. But at this point it doesn't look like they will. They probably don't want too as they likely sell really well.

People seem to have adapted to Contemptors, so maybe it's less of an issue now.

cody.d. wrote:
Part of me is thinking moritats may become common in 3rd legion hereticus lists. 15pts for precision shots and hits5 seems fun for plasma shotting a sergant, medic and so on.

Part of me thinks they'll be common, everywhere..

Now you can have all that crazy dakka added to a unit, without the complete hazard of running around lone gunner. Extra protection for him, extra dakka worth about a special weapon squad added to pretty much any squad. It's pretty strong so competitive/meta players of course already adapted and Moritats are everywhere in the 30k social media channels.

I'm also surprised they didn't Errata the Contemptor. The community have adapted mostly by limiting them in friendly contects, like max 1 per 1k points and similar. Not so much by finding points efficient counters. They're still crazy good for their points, with no drawbacks, and easy to use. Sales should be good.

Though I'm a rule of cool player who always liked Dreads, so I'm happy we get to see them more. Like a lot more. I just think balanced is better than both too weak and OP. Now it's so strong I have to feel slightly bad about bringing something I think is cool.

Oh for sure, they can add a whole support squads worth of firepower. 24 voltkite shots at bs5 is hilarious. But it gets more fun when you throw in legion stuff. Like an iron hands one with grav pistols can one shot a contempor. Or melta pistols to try and wipe out a termie squad or blast even a titan to scrap.

But the ability to clear out every model with upgrades and then charge in to proc rad grenades really makes bully faction feel like they can properly bully mid and low tier units.

Though all they do is add shooting, they compete with chaplains, librarians, heralds and so many other great centurions.

On the topic of house rules, the gaming group I'm part of we have regular events and have a great time. Dreads of all types got a rule where you get 1 with 2+ armour and others get a 3+. Does make missles feel more valuable too.

cody.d. wrote:
Oh for sure, they can add a whole support squads worth of firepower. 24 voltkite shots at bs5 is hilarious. But it gets more fun when you throw in legion stuff. Like an iron hands one with grav pistols can one shot a contempor. Or melta pistols to try and wipe out a termie squad or blast even a titan to scrap.

But the ability to clear out every model with upgrades and then charge in to proc rad grenades really makes bully faction feel like they can properly bully mid and low tier units.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but moritats (and their attached unit) can’t charge after chain fire can they? I don’t have my book on hand right now but IIRC chainfire explicitly forbids charging after using it, in such a way that even relentless / terminator armor won’t allow you to sidestep it.

 morganfreeman wrote:

cody.d. wrote:
Oh for sure, they can add a whole support squads worth of firepower. 24 voltkite shots at bs5 is hilarious. But it gets more fun when you throw in legion stuff. Like an iron hands one with grav pistols can one shot a contempor. Or melta pistols to try and wipe out a termie squad or blast even a titan to scrap.

But the ability to clear out every model with upgrades and then charge in to proc rad grenades really makes bully faction feel like they can properly bully mid and low tier units.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but moritats (and their attached unit) can’t charge after chain fire can they? I don’t have my book on hand right now but IIRC chainfire explicitly forbids charging after using it, in such a way that even relentless / terminator armor won’t allow you to sidestep it.

Ah yes you are quite correct. Hmm, kinda a bummer for any assault faction. They can still go with dispoilers and the like of course, just changes the way they behave I guess.

As far as Moritats go, I think you have to pick a play style with them and stick to it. Either you want him as a damage dealer, or a character hunter and you need him equipped accordingly.

-If you want a damage dealer, then I'd say give him volkites, throw him in destroyer squad (w/volkites (toxiferran optional)) and go bully units off objectives. You aren't worried about getting into assault so you can make the best use of chainfire, with no risk of Gets Hot.
Probably best to give him a jump pack and then he can zip around the board running away from things that want to hack him up.

-If you're after a character hunter, then use plasma/disintegrators and give him a [melee weapon of your choice] and have him escorted by either a despoiler/assault squad w/apothecary. Plasma/disintegrators will chew through squads better thus leaving characters more vulnerable while the apothecary mitigates the threat of Gets Hot. As a general rule, if it's a squad you want to assault, I'd not use chainfire, thus allowing the charge. If it's squad that could potentially assault you, I would use chainfire and (hopefully) lessen the incoming threat.

In either case, the escort squad are really just there to provide ablative wounds while the mori gets gak done. If going character hunting, then I think a Power Maul or Charnabal Tabar would be the weapons of choice for the 2+ strength. That gives you Instant Death against all T4 opponents thanks to Rad Grenades. The merits of Duelists Edge vs a flat AP3 are up to the individual to decide. Some might say the Power Axe is the better choice thanks to AP2, but I'd argue against it as it drops you down to I1 and that's not helpful. With 5 attacks on the charge, even at AP3, you only need 1 wound to go through.
Dark Angels actually have an interesting play with the Moritat thanks to the Terranic Greatsword. 2+ Strength, so all attacks go through as ID, but then all has Rending 5+, so gives a reasonable chance of burning through the 2+ save most characters are rocking killing them outright or forcing them onto their Invulns. The Murderous Strike 5+ also helps should your opponent throw a dreadnought your way. Add on to that that the Mori can tool around with Interemptors, who are notorious for their general "gonna feth you up"ness. 10 (or even 5 really) in a rhino with plasma incinerators, dump em in front of a squad you want removed and watch them not be there any more. Anything stupid enough to actually charge that unit will have to survive ID'ing wall of death flamers and then contend with the interemptors. Who with 4 attacks each are quietly no slouches in combat, and that's despite their lack of anything better then Basic Close Combat Weapons. And that's even before you take the Mori into account, who again will be throwing out 4 attacks with the TGS.