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BFG ships are gigantic- even a Hunter Class ship would be as long as my 3-storey walk-up apartment building if built in 40k scale...

But how big are the BSF ships? They don't look anywhere near as large.

Particularly interested in the Clarion (Taddeus the Purifier), Traveler (Espern Locarno), Kravv'Cha'To (Dayak Grek) and the Eye of Vect (Veth Raiden, who never got a model)?

Here's the pics for reference:

https://www.belloflostsouls.net/2018/11/the-ships-of-blackstone-fortress.html

Well the Cobra class destroyers are 800m long for reference.

It might be mentioned in the book, if you can find a copy. What I have in my head is that these are relatively small personal vessels due the stated difficulty in getting to the space station base through the debris cloud.

If memory serves, BFG fighters and bombers were described as being the same rough size as a jumbo jet.

The BSF ships seem to be larger than that, but not as large as a Cobra Destroyer

The Imperial ships cannot be much smaller than a Cobra and still have warp drives.

Is there a minimum established size for Warp Drive?

I’m aware miniaturised ones exist for Warp Missiles, but given those are purposefully one and done jobs, and so quite easily made to far less tolerant parameters than a ship board one expected to see centuries of use.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Is there a minimum established size for Warp Drive?

One of the Grey Knights novels has a 2-person ship - Navigator & Inquisitor.

The Scriptor, Privateer, and Zealot's Hand from the Warhammer Adventures series are seemingly closer to gunship-sized and yet are warp-capable.

The descriptions of most of the Fortress explorers' ships (other than the Vanguard) seem to imply that they didn't come from larger ships beyond the wreckage nebula, so presumably must have FTL capabilities.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Is there a minimum established size for Warp Drive?

I’m aware miniaturised ones exist for Warp Missiles, but given those are purposefully one and done jobs, and so quite easily made to far less tolerant parameters than a ship board one expected to see centuries of use.

There are some very small Warp-capable vessels, but they seem to be exceedingly rare. I highly doubt a freighter would have one unless it was a truly ancient relic from the DAOT. I also doubt even the Ministorum or a Rogue Trader down on their luck would have such rare vessels in this context (the Ministorum probably does have some micro-ships as couriers and other high-value roles).

Well, there’s Warp Capable Craft, and Intrasystem Craft.

So a bulk hauler which plods the trade lanes of a given system, perhaps Ore out, Food in probably doesn’t have a warp drive, because it doesn’t need a warp drive.

But inter-system freighters would necessitate a warp drive. Whilst yes I’d imagine most would be huge for sake of efficiency? That doesn’t rule out much smaller, specialist craft for smuggling or other high value, low bulk goodies.

So I’m not entirely persuaded small-smallish warp capable ships are necessarily rare.

Tarnhelm, somewhat bigger than a thunderhawk, but super specialist.

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Tarnhelm


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Scapula class deep space fighter

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Scapula-class_Deep_Space_Fighter#:~:text=The%20Scapula%2Dclass%20Deep%20Space,away%20from%20any%20support%20craft.

A few of the ships have visible windows, which would make it possible to ballpark their dimensions.

Only if you know how big the windows are, and how many floors they span. Cathedral windows tend to be rather oversized.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
If memory serves, BFG fighters and bombers were described as being the same rough size as a jumbo jet.

Which is frankly tiny all things considered. Basic variant of B747 is 56.3 m long and 59.6 m wide. Russian Tu-160 bomber, currently in service, is 54.1 m long and 55.7 m wide, virtually the same size. So, yeah, this "colossal" spacefaring craft is about as big as stuff we use in the same role now

In fact, looking it up now, "heavy" Marauder bomber is 19.2m long and 24.6m wide, about the same size as modern Russian Su-34 fighter. Which really should instantly disqualify it from bomber role, never mind 'heavy' one, as it won't have internal space for any sensible amount of ordnance no matter how good its engines are (which, at 5.450 kg, is pitiful compared to 45 tons of load Tu-160 can lift, or even 14 tons of Su-34). Or for fuel, which funnily enough shows up in its range (only 10% longer than Tu-160 above). Such advanced, much wow

 Flinty wrote:
Scapula class deep space fighter

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Scapula-class_Deep_Space_Fighter#:~:text=The%20Scapula%2Dclass%20Deep%20Space,away%20from%20any%20support%20craft.

And this is why I wish 40K lore had someone competent (read - not Phil Kelly) overseeing it and squashing dumb outliers like these. On the one hand, navigators are so rare SM chapters and Inquisitors have to beg for one and owe the Houses massive favors if they are granted a few members - on the other, here we see disposable squadron of 20 fighters carrying one each (more than some battlefleets in other parts of lore) like they were peanuts. GW, some consistency, please?

There are advantages to smaller vehicles if the payload is still useful. Imperial ordnance is supposed to be much more powerful and efficient than modern equivalents (which is why some weapons systems don't translate well in 40k scale game mechanics where they have to be toned down).

Shark assault boats are typically ~55m, Starhawk bombers are a bit smaller.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I don't think the Scapula has Warp drives- that seems to be poorly-supported speculation by the Wikia contributor based on the use of the term "navigator" which can mean Warp navigators but can also mean normal navigators responsible for realspace routefinding. A patrol craft expected to operate in the fridges of a solar system for relatively extended periods would still benefit from someone plotting the routes for the craft.

 Haighus wrote:
There are advantages to smaller vehicles if the payload is still useful. Imperial ordnance is supposed to be much more powerful and efficient than modern equivalents (which is why some weapons systems don't translate well in 40k scale game mechanics where they have to be toned down).

Shark assault boats are typically ~55m, Starhawk bombers are a bit smaller.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I don't think the Scapula has Warp drives- that seems to be speculation by the Wikia contributor based on the use of the term "navigator" which can mean Warp navigators but can also mean normal navigators responsible for realspace routefinding. A patrol craft expected to operate in the fridges of a solar system for relatively extended periods would still benefit from someone plotting the routes for the craft.

There’s also calculated jumps to take into account. Smaller warp capable craft will be using calculated jumps across short stable routes rather than going longer distances with a Navigator.

I think that’s what Eisenhorn’s friend he frequently hitched a lift with did.

Lord Zarkov wrote:

 Haighus wrote:
There are advantages to smaller vehicles if the payload is still useful. Imperial ordnance is supposed to be much more powerful and efficient than modern equivalents (which is why some weapons systems don't translate well in 40k scale game mechanics where they have to be toned down).

Shark assault boats are typically ~55m, Starhawk bombers are a bit smaller.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I don't think the Scapula has Warp drives- that seems to be speculation by the Wikia contributor based on the use of the term "navigator" which can mean Warp navigators but can also mean normal navigators responsible for realspace routefinding. A patrol craft expected to operate in the fridges of a solar system for relatively extended periods would still benefit from someone plotting the routes for the craft.

There’s also calculated jumps to take into account. Smaller warp capable craft will be using calculated jumps across short stable routes rather than going longer distances with a Navigator.

I think that’s what Eisenhorn’s friend he frequently hitched a lift with did.

Whilst true, I don't think that is what the fighters are doing. I think this is just the same name being used for a different role. I have also seen Fury interceptors described as having a navigator, and again I think this is simply the crew member in charge of route planning and maps, not the Warp navigators with the third eye.