Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

With as much professionalism as Adams been showing on this project, I am willing to give him the time he needs to make this happen the way he visions it. His communication is excellent, his quality of product beyond compare, and his vision is solid with planning, execution, and follow-through.

Compared to other well known "Companies" its hard to remember that this is a few people running this train as efficiently as possible in this climate of "WANT MOWER SHINNIES NOWZ!!!" of KS land.

And as an added punch, he reopened the pledge manager, continues to communicate with backers on a regular basis, and has the bases covered with communication both up and down the line, 110% better then a few fortune 500 CEO's I know of and a certain company who has represented itself quite beligerently with the letters C and D.


I am as stoked now, almost a year or two later as I was the first time I saw this game. I will take the game when it comes, and if the delays bring a quality product, then the time is well spent.

...and don't forget that on top of all that, he's going to be adding in another 'freebie' of some sort by way 'apology' and thankfulness for everyone's patience.

Plus, due to the delays, we've been getting a lot more goodies added into the sprues. I don't think Slenderman was originally going to come with those "Gloomy" weapons or the cello. Same with that helmet piece that's in with the Flower Knight.

I agree that his communication is top notch, and his reason for the delay are comprehensible and valid. Still, i'm a bit pissed off about having to wait. Mayber because one of the few other ks I backed is relic knight, and this one is also hopelessly late.

Though, I have to say that i'm still super excited and interested by this project, cause as some said, it look like we'll get a real good quality product, while I couldn't less about relic knight now. In fact, if anyone want to have my relic knights pledge, I would be happy to sell it

I think a lot of this could be improved if people just made revised shipping dates when the scope of their project swells

 tormund wrote:
I think a lot of this could be improved if people just made revised shipping dates when the scope of their project swells

They can't change it once it's posted on the KS page is my understanding, but I agree.

With this delay it's not like it's because things are being mismanaged. It's because gak didn't look as good as it should have. I don't know how you can be mad about that.

I've sunk a large amount of $$$ into this KS. Whilst I love the KD models and I'm happy to wait, there are some alarm bells ringing........

If Adam has recieved the model or sprue, is unhappy with the detail / quality, then that mould need to be re worked or even a new one made. This costs $$$$. So recently we've had some exclusive resins released (I myself picked up a Satan) which was described by many as a cash grab. Pre-Orders (and therefore more $$$$) are being taken for a second run of these exclusives. And now, the KS pledge manager has been reopened, which again, will bring in more $$$$.

Call me sceptical, I'm now wondering if $$$$ is becoming an issue for Mr Poots? Yes you can read all the updates, and read that Mr Poots is a top guy who's doing everything for the backers, but I can't help thinking with recent events if there is more to this..............

Discuss.

I forgot when we first backed this, was it back in 2012?

Damn. I was planning to add a bunch of the armour kits when I heard the pledge manager was reopening. May have to rethink that with a 50% price hike. Wonder what the MSRP will be if $75 is the discounted KS price..

The $50/$75 20 miniature kits were for the KS only they won't be sold retail only the 4 miniature packs will.

2012

I hope he sorts out the EU shipping option, as the custom tax otherwise would hit a lot of backers. For some countries, the tax is an another 20-25% and then an additional fee. Hell, I'd add another 20% of my pledge to the pledge manager if KD would make sure that my backage is shipped from within the EU.

For some countries, like mine its an extra 28% (and if he uses some courier companies such as UPS or FEDEX and extra 80-120 EU fee, just because) so, yes, I really hope he sorts the EU shipping.

 TheSecretSquig wrote:
I've sunk a large amount of $$$ into this KS. Whilst I love the KD models and I'm happy to wait, there are some alarm bells ringing........

If Adam has recieved the model or sprue, is unhappy with the detail / quality, then that mould need to be re worked or even a new one made. This costs $$$$. So recently we've had some exclusive resins released (I myself picked up a Satan) which was described by many as a cash grab. Pre-Orders (and therefore more $$$$) are being taken for a second run of these exclusives. And now, the KS pledge manager has been reopened, which again, will bring in more $$$$.

Call me sceptical, I'm now wondering if $$$$ is becoming an issue for Mr Poots? Yes you can read all the updates, and read that Mr Poots is a top guy who's doing everything for the backers, but I can't help thinking with recent events if there is more to this..............

Discuss.

As far as I can tell, he's been smart with his money. I'm not sure what the relationship is with the factory, but I doubt they are charging him too much more if the detail isn't there.

In terms of limited resins, that's how all his releases run. Why did he do a preorder? To appease his fans who wanted the models but didn't get in on the first release.

I think reading into the delays as money issues is a fool's game. Perfection is the illness Poots suffers from. And that's a vice I can forgive in this instance.

Unlike some KS projects out there, Poots is honest imho. If something isn't up to his set standards, he outright says so in an update, instead of just tossing it out there like some afterthought. Added bonus, we're not treated like idiots in a condescending way. My brother (co-backer in this expensive venture) is pissed off that there is yet another delay, but I've got faith and I know the final result will be totes worth it.

To echo the other European backers, I do hope for a reasonable shipping option for us.

It also helps that he has a history of putting out high quality products with great customer support for a while before this kickstarter.

 TheSecretSquig wrote:
I've sunk a large amount of $$$ into this KS. Whilst I love the KD models and I'm happy to wait, there are some alarm bells ringing........

If Adam has recieved the model or sprue, is unhappy with the detail / quality, then that mould need to be re worked or even a new one made. This costs $$$$. So recently we've had some exclusive resins released (I myself picked up a Satan) which was described by many as a cash grab. Pre-Orders (and therefore more $$$$) are being taken for a second run of these exclusives. And now, the KS pledge manager has been reopened, which again, will bring in more $$$$.

Call me sceptical, I'm now wondering if $$$$ is becoming an issue for Mr Poots? Yes you can read all the updates, and read that Mr Poots is a top guy who's doing everything for the backers, but I can't help thinking with recent events if there is more to this..............

Discuss.

It would indeed be very expensive to rework a mold, which is exactly why the factory doesn't cut the mold until AFTER the client has signed off on the designs and layouts. Now, it's saddening that they haven't gotten to THAT point, which means milling and production are still ahead of us but in terms of money things are likely where they ought to be. This is part of the expected negotiation between art and engineering that was paid for, not an additional cost. However, time is a factor because of warehousing costs rising on all the other components that arrive sooner than the plastic.

In regards to the other points; the resin Satan was promised during the KS, to be sold outside of the KS, and is right in line with what you'd pay for other KD products. The Pin-Up set that was sold would be far more readily likened to a "cash grab" since it came out of left field and were things you could already have bought. However, it was undoubtedly WGF's "proof we can do it to the level you want" project, and once the molds (i.e. - the expensive part) were cut it's silly to not sell them.

You need to start worrying about the money situation when he DOESN'T delay because he's unhappy. When "good enough" trumps his perfectionism, that's the sign that the money is nearly gone.

Aye, this isn't like Raging Heroes, where they made an off-hand remark about their own funds in their ongoing quest for perfection and being the best at being the best.

Of course, I'm slightly bummed about the delay, but I know it's for the best. I remain cautiously optimistic that it will ship out/US backers will have it in August/September.

That said, the gloom and flower weapons are freaking awesome and unexpected.

Whelp, I went ahead and added the Slender man and Lonely tree.

Back in September, the last time the pledge manager reopen was allowed, I had to decide between lonely tree and slender man or spidicules and decided on the former. Glad I had 1 more opportunity to add spidicules to my pledge.

What's funny is every other project I've been part of that has had major delays, I've found myself wishing I could take some add-ons back, but only KD makes me want to give Poots more money with each update.

I don't think Poots is having financial problems. I'm sure he has burnt through a ton of capital making this, however all he has to do is release a new resin mini that will be sold out in a week and he has raised several thousand dollars for his company/self (I am assuming this is helping pay his living expenses while monster is being completed).

I also have stuck a ton of cash into this (around 1500 in January 2013), including almost 1 of every expansion and resin/plastic pinups, promos, etc. Prices are going up with the pledge manager as I'm sure the cost of business, tooling, and plastic has been going up since January of 2013. I for one am not worried and have the upmost confidence in Mr. Poots. He is a stellar guy and has been great to deal with everytime I have had contact with him (that and he is a fellow game lover so you know this will be good!)

I can't wait to get this game in my hands! It will be an awesome game, especially with how detail oriented Poots is. I know the delays suck, but it's not like we are having massive delays only to get average board game quality minis or gameplay... these are KD minis!

 Sasori wrote:
Whelp, I went ahead and added the Slender man and Lonely tree.

I added those, the Flower Knight, and the Lantern Festival.

I didn't have a ton of scratch lying around when this first came out. Not that I have a ton now, but those plastics....

 gunslingerpro wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
Whelp, I went ahead and added the Slender man and Lonely tree.

I added those, the Flower Knight, and the Lantern Festival.

I didn't have a ton of scratch lying around when this first came out. Not that I have a ton now, but those plastics....

I was really busy on the last day, so I didn't get to adjust my pledges then. At the time, I really didn't like the Slenderman and Lonely tree. I do now though, so I went ahead and added those. The Gloom weapons are really nice.

Here is the truth:

1. The deal I made with the factory is a fixed price. When we fail to meet quality standards and have to cut a new tool, it is at there loss. My job is to ensure that our investment meets what we expect. That is my commitment to the project and the backers.

2. Satan was not a cash grab. It was a promise made during the kickstarter and fulfilled. I was challenged to create my own personal vision, and so I have. If I were Satan, that is the form I would choose!

3. The kickstarter is in no fiscal jeopardy. I am EXTREMELY conservative when it comes to budgets. The money to print, finish production and ship has been locked away since the kickstarter ended. It will not be touched for anything else. Sadly, this does mean that our monthly operations have little cushion. Thankfully, the sales from the resin releases keep us going. If the game is well received and If the sales post kickstarter are good, the future for KD is very bright indeed. But I cannot count on that, until it happens.

If I ever run a kickstarter again, I would never run it in such a way where a literal mountain of products are held hostage until they are all finished. I would need to think about an alternative solution, perhaps not take shipping money up front and allow people access to a system wherein they could ship themselves rewards as they become available.

But this, lol. Yeah it has certainly been a growing experience!

Not being able to change existing items was a bit of a kick in the pants, but it's my own fault for dithering so long. Added a copy of the game, and a couple of big expansions.

It sounds like I'm in the same boat as you Elemental there are some peices I would have liked to change. The only thing to do now is pick what I want and try to ebay the misspicked stuff.

To Adam, as a european it would be fine with me if a delay in shipping could reduce the taxes/postage a bit. I bought the game to play during wintertime anyway

Thanks for the clarification Adam. Looking forward to see how everything turns out.

 kingdomdeath wrote:

If I ever run a kickstarter again, I would never run it in such a way where a literal mountain of products are held hostage until they are all finished. I would need to think about an alternative solution, perhaps not take shipping money up front and allow people access to a system wherein they could ship themselves rewards as they become available.

HLJ offers a service like this when you order from them, "Private Warehouse".
Its really nice to be able to preorder a bunch of stuff and then not have to worry about paying $8~16 per item in shipping from Japan as they are released.

 kingdomdeath wrote:


If I ever run a kickstarter again, I would never run it in such a way where a literal mountain of products are held hostage until they are all finished. I would need to think about an alternative solution, perhaps not take shipping money up front and allow people access to a system wherein they could ship themselves rewards as they become available.

But this, lol. Yeah it has certainly been a growing experience!

Definitely the way to do it....btu the BEST way is also to not offer the option for anything other than split shipping. It does become problematic.

 kingdomdeath wrote:
Here is the truth:

1. The deal I made with the factory is a fixed price. When we fail to meet quality standards and have to cut a new tool, it is at there loss. My job is to ensure that our investment meets what we expect. That is my commitment to the project and the backers.

2. Satan was not a cash grab. It was a promise made during the kickstarter and fulfilled. I was challenged to create my own personal vision, and so I have. If I were Satan, that is the form I would choose!

3. The kickstarter is in no fiscal jeopardy. I am EXTREMELY conservative when it comes to budgets. The money to print, finish production and ship has been locked away since the kickstarter ended. It will not be touched for anything else. Sadly, this does mean that our monthly operations have little cushion. Thankfully, the sales from the resin releases keep us going. If the game is well received and If the sales post kickstarter are good, the future for KD is very bright indeed. But I cannot count on that, until it happens.

If I ever run a kickstarter again, I would never run it in such a way where a literal mountain of products are held hostage until they are all finished. I would need to think about an alternative solution, perhaps not take shipping money up front and allow people access to a system wherein they could ship themselves rewards as they become available.

But this, lol. Yeah it has certainly been a growing experience!

How long is the pledge manager going to stay open for? I could really do with waiting it out until my next pay-check.


also if you can find a way to ship from within Europe so we don't all get smashed by import duty (as previously stated a lot of companies charge a handling fee on top of the duty, some as high as £70 ($105 ish).

keep up the good work