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Anakin,however,refused to sacrifice anything,which led to his fall.

I disagree strongly. Anakin sacrificed the Republic to save his wife. If I were in his shoes I would have done the same, without all the emo should I shouldn't I crap. To save wifey the galaxy can burn. Gee that sounds like a cool title for a book....

(this of course makes the later fight stupid-again he wouldn't have choked her out, and further she should have shanked Obi and they could have lived like kings)


Darth Frazzled's becoming

Frazzled the valorous: "Wow I have these visions and they come true. I had this vision of my mom and it came true. My wife is the last thing I care about and just had this dream about her dying."

Darth Bob: " I can save her, but we've got to take power and wipe out the jedi."

Darth Frazzled, starting up the Rockyesque training montage 8mm camera. "Its gonna suck to be them. Lets do this thing."








Automatically Appended Next Post:
To the prequels:
Scripts were bad
DIRECTING was bad.
Underlying plot development was crap.
Christopher Lee was awesome.


Lucas forgot how to direct people and story. He's only good for special effects now, understandeable as thats his business. The "special effects" were more animated than the people.

sebster wrote:

Munch Munch! wrote:I would also love to see a tabletop wargame of star wars. There is alot of factions to play as, many species to model, and so much history in it, dozens of vhicles and weapons, and alot of favourite scenarios could be played out. Even with clone troopers, there's alot of variation in armour customization.

It would be a challenge to get the feel right, as Star Wars is a swashbuckling adventure covered with a military veneer. You’d have to do it just right to pay proper service to the crazy achievements of the heroes, while still keeping the basic military structure underneath.

It’d be a tough thing, though Lord of the Rings style hero points would probably be the best place to start.

I like your suggestions here. Do you see the game as to being able to be inclusive of both larger scale fleet actions and ground wars or based more around small bands of heros.

Would also like to point out your use of the term swashbuckling. Very apt and cuts to the gist of what I was saying about what was missing from the prequels. They were Epic but not really swashbuckling for some reason.

Didn't they already have a SW game?

focusedfire wrote:

Manchu wrote:
Also, ff, Episode I plays better than II and III? What are you smoking?

Many people will blame the scripts, but I blame Hayden Christiansen for episodes II&III. The movies felt like there were better scenes laying on the cutting room floor due to Haydens inability to act. The kid Jake Lloyd did a much better job of acting than Hayden did and the setting of the movie was better because it wasn't so OTT CG. Yes, we had to deal with the introduction of miticlorians and the most annoying character ever creayed outside of a Jim Carrey or Sasha Cohen movie in Episode I, but the acting was able to carry the movie. I didn't suspend disbelief every three minutes like the movies with Hayden playing Mannikin.

If there had been a young Han type character in episode I, slapping the annoying one around or kicking it in the shin every other time it said something stupid, the added comedic relief would have provided what was missing. It would also have set a tone for the other movies of not being so...sterile.

As far as which are the better scripts? I can't really judge because of the acting in II & III.

Munch Munch! wrote:God, the prequals sucked. The only part worth watching was the battle scenes.

Yes they did and I attribute it to Lucas miscasting key parts and the failure to add the type of character that he writes for and directs the best. A Harrison Ford scoundrel type of character. These movies could have been very good but Lucas seemed bound and determined to make them bad. The real problem could be that Lucas can't direct this younger generation. Shia Leboeff(sp?) is a very accomplished actor but in the Indiana Jones movie Lucas failed to show the kids talent.

BTW, instead of the "they sucked" comments, why don't you tell me how you would have shot the movies or at least fix them. This is a thread where you can discuss, create, gripe about or make jokes about Star Wars. The universe of the Galactic Empire could really be developed a lot more. Honestly I'd like to see a D10 based table top game that plays similar to 40K and uses a similar scale of models. I think that it could be fun if done right.

Personally Ep.1 and 2 were good summer blockbuster-type movies. They were by no means upper-tier cinema,but they were entertaining and certainly have plenty of reviewing value. The problem is,the expectations for the prequels were ridiculously high,since they were following what most believe is the greatest trilogy of all time(Ep.4-6),and Ep.3 was really the only one that stacked up against the originals. They weren't bad movies,although they definately had their share of problems. They just looked bad when compared to the originals.

Hayden sucked as Anakin,no doubt,although I do think that perhaps part of the reason he was so wooden is because Vader is so wooden in the originals. Problem is,when you've got a massive suit of armor and you're being voiced by James Earl Jones,wooden is cool. When you're just a pretty boy acting wooden,well,that's not cool. Still,Keanu Reeves could have played a better Anakin. The rest of the cast was at least serviceable,IMO,though.

A young Han character wouldn't have worked at all. For one,the prequels are tellling the backstory of the major players in Ep.4-6. Ep.1-3 were never written out in full script form until Lucas decided to do them. Ep.1-3 were basically just notes on the events leading up to the original trilogy. That's why there's so much "filler" in Ep.1. There literally wasn't enough there to make a 2 hour movie around. For another,a new Han would be inevitably compared to the old Han,and probably not favorably. It would look like Lucas was just basically trying to rehash the originals. Finally,how in the world to bring that character into consistant contact with Anakin and Obi-Wan? All the soldiers are clones,and they're fighting a war. What justification is there for this non-Jedi character to be running around with them?

Shia LaBeof has very little talent,IMO. I have always found him underwhelming. He's not horrible enough to boycott a movie because he's in it,but he's no reason to go see one,either. He's serviceable,at best. He was underwhelming in the Transformer's movies,Indy 4,Eagle Eye,Constantine,and Disturbia,IMO. One blah performance,and you can blame the director. Several blah performances,and it's most likely the actor.

Personally,if I had done the prequels,I would have pretty much scrapped most of Ep.1. The important components to the storyline could have simply been worked in via dream sequence flashbacks. Ep.2 would pretty much become Ep.1,and Anakin's involvement in the Clone Wars would be the focus of Ep.2. There is simply too much important character development that goes on in that time period with Anakin and Obi-Wan to just jump from where we currently left off in Ep.2 to Ep.3. Dooku never really comes off as the villain he should because he basically goes from spanking Obi and Ani at the end of Ep.2 to getting completely pwned in the first 15 minutes of Ep.3. Grievous also needed more development. The other huge issue with the prequels is too much concentration on easter eggs(R2,C3PO,Chewie,the Falcon,Boba Fett),CGI action sequences(pod race,Obi-Wan running around on a giant lizard),and pretty much meaningless side characters. Mace Windu got too much screen time for as irrelevant as he was to the plot. Yes,I realize that Samuel L. had a massive hard on to be in the prequels,but that doesn't mean you have to write in a part for him.








Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frazzled wrote:

Anakin,however,refused to sacrifice anything,which led to his fall.

I disagree strongly. Anakin sacrificed the Republic to save his wife. If I were in his shoes I would have done the same, without all the emo should I shouldn't I crap. To save wifey the galaxy can burn. Gee that sounds like a cool title for a book....

(this of course makes the later fight stupid-again he wouldn't have choked her out, and further she should have shanked Obi and they could have lived like kings)


Darth Frazzled's becoming

Frazzled the valorous: "Wow I have these visions and they come true. I had this vision of my mom and it came true. My wife is the last thing I care about and just had this dream about her dying."

Darth Bob: " I can save her, but we've got to take power and wipe out the jedi."

Darth Frazzled, starting up the Rockyesque training montage 8mm camera. "Its gonna suck to be them. Lets do this thing."

How did Anakin sacrifice the Republic? Remember,he told Padme' that he didn't feel that the Republic worked as it should,and went on about an idealistic view of a dictatorship. It's not really much of a sacrifice when you don't believe in it in the first place.

Please,I could have saved Padme' with a flight of stairs. You can't tell me that they couldn't perform an abortion. Once again,Anakin was asked to sacrifice either his wife or his kids,and he instead chose to try and have it all. Besides which,they were married in secret. A child out of wedlock would presumably destroy her political career,along with his. You really expect Obi-Wan not to catch on that "Hey,Padme's kid has Anakin's eyes?" C'mon. Once again,Anakin refused to sacrifice. Padme' probably told him to double-bag it,but he was all like,"Naw,baby,I'm goin' in raw or I'm not goin' in at all."

@Manchu-You got anymore story worked up.

@All posters- How does a table top minature game that is set in space and has boarding actions and infantry battles sound yo you guys?

To use GW products as a reference it wold be sort of a mix between Rogue Trader, Battlefleet Gothica and Space Hulk.

It would have various competing factions with some relying heavily upon privateers.

Any one got some input on where to start.

focusedfire wrote:@Manchu-You got anymore story worked up.

@All posters- How does a table top minature game that is set in space and has boarding actions and infantry battles sound yo you guys?

To use GW products as a reference it wold be sort of a mix between Rogue Trader, Battlefleet Gothica and Space Hulk.

It would have various competing factions with some relying heavily upon privateers.

Any one got some input on where to start.

I actually made a star wars table top game.

It's based on the Rogue Trader and 2nd Edition 40k rulesets. It's pretty fun. Perhaps not too well balanced but you can have Wookiees riding Speeder Bikes fighting Trandoshans with mini shield generators and laser cannons. Stuff like that.

:edit: The rules aren't the best in the world, as originally it started out as me thinking of cool stuff, and then writing down it as sort of a stream of consciousness. It doesn't have rules for boarding starships and for starship battles but they would be fun to write I think!

ShumaGorath wrote:The universe has been explored, quite literally to the point where it's been ruined. Let it drift off to the good death of old age, there are plenty of other science fiction settings it's choking under the weight of it's marry sue wizard characters, awful characterization, confused and contradictory storylines, and conflicted art direction.

This. I called it quits when they released Sacrfice and I finally got fed up with the BS. If you're going to Expand a universe, you have to actually expand it. Not beat it to death under the guise of expansion.

The only things Star Wars that in any way interest me are The Old Republic Era, which is really only good so long as Bioware remains key to its development (Bioware being one of the few groups of people who know how to write engaging story lines anymore) and the Legacy Era, which is somewhat ruined by being limited to a comic book but is at least interesting enough in that the universe is finally past Luke Skywalker.

I disagree. They universe would be a fun one to explore. Don't blame the universe because Lucas's film-making ability has followed a similar path to Mel Gibsons sanity. He's lost it.

I don't think Lucas ever had any film-making ability. He had imagination. The first three films were so good because there had never been anything like them. Lucas got by on the novelty. Not any ability on his part to make movies. EDIT: That came out wrong. Lucas is average, as a movie maker. Had his work not been so unique, he would have gone the way of M Night Shamliuanahajhgafistanbulris-blah. One good movie and then everyone wishes he'd just stop. Lucas made it to three.

I relly only likeded ep3 cause of Grievous , but the rest of the film was ok the space battle at the start was good , but it got prety boring till the mustafar massacre scene .

My favourite part of Ep. 3 was the battle of Utapau, and the scenes concerning Order 66.