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Okay. So far then we have the Bolo-verse on the ground, cause that's alot of firepower, (Orks would call it, "Not enough Dakka, but nearly there")

Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

I can't think of one off the top of my head.

 Engine of War wrote:
Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

Keep in mind the bolos are the tanks of the Concordiat, their version of baneblades. They have capital ships with appropriately scaled firepower.

 frothy loins wrote:
This is a great thread, swimming in the rage that is nerd fandom is a glorious thing. I'm bringing a kill team composed of Thanos, Darkseid, the Spectre (magics), Emma Frost (psycics), and the Hulk. Bring the noise.

The Orks would make the Hulk their new warmaster. WAUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!

 Engine of War wrote:
Okay. So far then we have the Bolo-verse on the ground, cause that's alot of firepower, (Orks would call it, "Not enough Dakka, but nearly there")

Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

I can't think of one off the top of my head.

SW is a good rival if we go by the ICS and some other EU material. Also Starcraft depending on the sources, but they lack numbers. Aside of those you get either opponents far weaker ("Current" Halo, Mass Effect, etc.) or far stronger ("Ancient" Halo, the Culture, Strike Legion, Xeelee, Doctor Who, etc).


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 Kojiro wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:
Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

Keep in mind the bolos are the tanks of the Concordiat, their version of baneblades. They have capital ships with appropriately scaled firepower.

IIRC the difference in firepower between a capital ship and a Bolo in the Boloverse isn't very big, meanwhile the difference between a Emperor Titan and a Battleship is immense.

 Tyran wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:
Okay. So far then we have the Bolo-verse on the ground, cause that's alot of firepower, (Orks would call it, "Not enough Dakka, but nearly there"

Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

I can't think of one off the top of my head.

SW is a good rival if we go by the ICS and some other EU material. Also Starcraft depending on the sources, but they lack numbers. Aside of those you get either opponents far weaker ("Current" Halo, Mass Effect, etc.) or far stronger ("Ancient" Halo, the Culture, Strike Legion, Xeelee, Doctor Who, etc).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kojiro wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:
Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k. While Bolo's can kick ass in space, relative to a 40k battleship even a Bolo looks small and as im aware, the Macro cannons fire shells the size of small buildings (then theres the Lances, and torpedos and then some).

Keep in mind the bolos are the tanks of the Concordiat, their version of baneblades. They have capital ships with appropriately scaled firepower.

IIRC the difference in firepower between a capital ship and a Bolo in the Boloverse isn't very big, meanwhile the difference between a Emperor Titan and a Battleship is immense.

The ICS is nothing compared to normal calcs for W40K. That simply allows them to actually dent their shields. The power of Star Wars comes from their maneuverability and being able to zip around unhindered when hyperspace routes are charted. But several hundred gigatons-Terratons >>> 200 Gigatons.

Borg? A dark mechanicus would corrupt them easily to chaos.

the Dark markers from dead space would enjoy Nurgle.

Klingons? really meet the flesh tearers.

40k is so over the top there aren't many sf franchises that could top it.

Wait maybe the vorlons and shadows have the amount of power like the ancient eldar.

 Tyran wrote:
While the Protoss control a considerable part of the Galaxy (1/8 IIRC) their population is very small for that immense territory and is divided in hundreds of worlds, that is pitiful compared with the millions that the IoM controls.

That's a non-issue though. The IOM needs to be large in seize in order for it to have enough manpower to feed to the meat grinder. That’s how the imperium survives in 40K, by churning out troops and war material on a massive scale.

The Protoss way of making war is entirely different to that of the IOM. Seize is irrelevant.

 Wyzilla wrote:

The ICS is nothing compared to normal calcs for W40K. That simply allows them to actually dent their shields. The power of Star Wars comes from their maneuverability and being able to zip around unhindered when hyperspace routes are charted. But several hundred gigatons-Terratons >>> 200 Gigatons.

It is 200 gigatons for a turbo laser IIRC, and the Star Wars have many of those IIRC. But meh I don't really know much about SW so I really have no idea. What I do recall is that the biggest advantages of the GE over the IoM is, as you said, speed, size and industrial output.


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 Redcruisair wrote:
That's a non-issue though. The IOM needs to be large in seize in order for it to have enough manpower to feed to the meat grinder. That’s how the imperium survives in 40K, by churning out troops and war material on a massive scale.

The Protoss way of making war is entirely different to that of the IOM. Seize is irrelevant.

Size is relevant because it helps determine the industrial output of the whole empire (Unless you have a Forerunner or better industry ofc)
Also the fact that when you visit Protoss planets in the game they seem to give a vibe of being more outposts than anything else.

How about the Bydo?

 Tyran wrote:
(Unless you have a Forerunner or better industry ofc)

This is the case. So again, for the Protoss, seize does not matter.

 Tyran wrote:
Also the fact that when you visit Protoss planets in the game they seem to give a vibe of being more outposts than anything else.

That’s because most Protoss planets seen in the games are in fact outpost or colonies.

For Space based opponents, there are the Shivans (Descent Freespace).

A single Shivan vessel can destroy a planet, and a group of them can destroy a star. Additionally, it requires specialized weaponry to pierce their shields. It's quite conceivable that not all War40k fleet based weapons could work on them (as weapons known to be able to pierce even the toughest of known shields fail to make any headway against them, requiring all new weapons to be invented to tackle them, and still basically have the human/vasudan's hats handed to them). They also have vastly superior FTL drives to most of 40k's races. It is known that they killed off at least one milky way conquering faction 8,000 years ago, and it is suspected that they have wiped out many more throughout history.

Not unlike the Necrons in their 'unknowable/unkillable' creatures from beyond. The Shivans simply leave or are not truly beaten in either game (the first game involves stopping one cruiser that has discovered the location of Earth, and the second on finding some way to 'trap' the 'known' fleet, by collapsing known jump nodes, hopefully slowing them down only to earn a completely pyrrhic victory).

 Engine of War wrote:

Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k.

I can't think of one off the top of my head.

We've already mentioned the Culture .

Loopstah wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:

Lets find a Space borne rival to 40k.

I can't think of one off the top of my head.

We've already mentioned the Culture .

The Culture stomps the 40k ships without even trying, hardly a fair rival.


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 Redcruisair wrote:
This is the case. So again, for the Protoss, seize does not matter.

Protoss never showed that level of industrial output. And before you say it, nothing suggest that RTS building times are cannon.

 Tyran wrote:

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 Redcruisair wrote:
This is the case. So again, for the Protoss, seize does not matter.

Protoss never showed that level of industrial output. And before you say it, nothing suggest that RTS building times are cannon.

Sure nothing beats the IOM in industrial output, it’s after all a big empire besieged from all sides by countless enemies, and is therefore in dire need of, well, anything really.

Where the problems arise for IOM, is in its logistical faultiness. A shipment of lasguns is produced in the factories, loaded on a suitable spacecraft and sent on a dangerous journey through the warp, then finally arriving late to its destination only to then find out that some daff clerk got the coordinates wrong and sent the ship on a fruitless venture. By the time this has happened, the Protoss have already warped in that brand new carrier fleet and then proceeded to scourge worlds clean of xenophobic humans.

Protoss Warp technology makes more than enough up for any lack of industrial output. Protoss can focus its forces where it’s needed with accurate precision and no delay. Also, what is the point of even discussing this? Plenty of factions with little to no industrial output have managed to beat the imperials. Hell some faction’s weapon arsenal consists solely of stolen imperial goods. I will repeat myself again, industrial capacity has no bearing on whether or not Protoss can thrive in 40k. It’s a mood point.

Would Protoss ships be able to handle the planet defense systems (just curious)? Also hey! Us Chaos do have our own forgeworlds as well! (and orks loot all!)

 Redcruisair wrote:

 Tyran wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Redcruisair wrote:
This is the case. So again, for the Protoss, seize does not matter.

Protoss never showed that level of industrial output. And before you say it, nothing suggest that RTS building times are cannon.

Sure nothing beats the IOM in industrial output, it’s after all a big empire besieged from all sides by countless enemies, and is therefore in dire need of, well, anything really.

There are plenty of factions in sci-fi that beat the Imperium in industrial output, starting with the Galactic Empire from SW.

Protoss Warp technology makes more than enough up for any lack of industrial output. Protoss can focus its forces where it’s needed with accurate precision and no delay.

True.

Also, what is the point of even discussing this? Plenty of factions with little to no industrial output have managed to beat the imperials. Hell some faction’s weapon arsenal consists solely of stolen imperial goods. I will repeat myself again, industrial capacity has no bearing on whether or not Protoss can thrive in 40k. It’s a mood point.

And the Protoss are going to start stealing Imperial goods? lol

What I have been trying to say is that the Protoss lack enough numbers to survive if they attract enough attention. A Carrier is a good match for most Imperial ships, but how many Carriers does the Protoss have?
Although I guess that the Protoss could try to survive like the Tau.

Honestly the flood can be a huge threat. By the time the Imperium arrives to exterminate them they would have spread themselves extremely fast. As we know the Imperium can take a long ass time to react and send stuff. They can take over ships to. Doesn't matter how big usually to get them to new inhabited planet. Rinse and repeat. Unlike Tyranids they don't need biomass to stay alive or awake for long periods of time.

The Precursors (made the flood as revenge against the Forerunner or as a failsafe) or the Forerunner (when unscathed by Flood) would do damn well to.

 StarTrotter wrote:
Would Protoss ships be able to handle the planet defense systems (just curious)?

That’s a difficult question to answer. We don’t really know how effective imperial weaponry is at penetrating Protoss plasma shields. The planet is most likely doomed without a fleet for protection, though.

 Tyran wrote:
What I have been trying to say is that the Protoss lack enough numbers to survive if they attract enough attention.

How much attention do you think the collective factions of 40k can afford spending on the Protoss, though? The IOM already has it hands full. Chaos is not really concerned with anything other than warring against the IOM. Eldar and Protoss probably makes for better allies than enemies.

Only the occasional Ork Whaaag and Tyranid invasion trespassing on Protoss space could be troublesome for the Protoss. Both of those scenarios the Tau have experienced and conquered. And remember, Tau is the race the 40k community have the lowest opinion of.

There is also the problem of locating the Protoss first. Which is nearly impossible considering the nomadic nature of the Protoss race. Also, most conflicts involving the Protoss would most likely be the ones they themselves have initiated (in true Eldar fashion.)

 Tyran wrote:
A Carrier is a good match for most Imperial ships, but how many Carriers does the Protoss have?

We don’t know. The total number of carriers in existence, and how fast such ships can be produced for that matter, has never been explained. All I know is that carriers form the backbone of the Protoss fleet. Anything else is guestimates.

 Tyran wrote:
Although I guess that the Protoss could try to survive like the Tau.

I don’t think that is needed.

Actually thinking about it, both the Systems Commonwealth and the Magog from Gene Roddenberry's Andromeda would at the very least make a huge dent in 40k universe.

I want to see a Gundam Fight a titan.Deathscythe would fit right in for being overthetopgrimdark.

Perhaps an early(Pre Time-Travel) Dalek Empire would provide a suitable rival in space.

Though the old Daleks would stand no chance on the ground.