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Unless your in a tank that gets scout matchmaking your only ever going to see tanks that are two teirs higher then you. 90% of Premium Tanks get special matchmaking so they will only ever see tanks that are one teir higher then them.

Just because your the bottom teir in a game doesn't mean you can't be effective and a valuable member of your team you just need to plat differently.

If you don't like being bottom tier don't research the Chaffee, it's tier 5 but 25% of the time it will see tier 10's.

 Catyrpelius wrote:
Unless your in a tank that gets scout matchmaking your only ever going to see tanks that are two teirs higher then you. 90% of Premium Tanks get special matchmaking so they will only ever see tanks that are one teir higher then them.

Just because your the bottom teir in a game doesn't mean you can't be effective and a valuable member of your team you just need to plat differently.

If you don't like being bottom tier don't research the Chaffee, it's tier 5 but 25% of the time it will see tier 10's.

I've been working towards the Chaffee for quite some time (takes over 55,000 exp god damnit) but starting to think i should just sell my Stuart.

Don't sell the stuart but I doubt you will like the matchmaking on the chaffee. It really really really sucks and the tank is very expensive to repair so you're in over your head the vast majority of time AND paying through the nose for the privelege. When you're facing stuff 5 tiers above you, you don't even have a view range advantage on average so you get spotted by guys you don't see and one shotted to boot. It sucks as the "top tier" scout. It still happens with the Luchs and m5 Stuart but not as often and you at least some games of the time are facing a majority of stuff within 1 tier of your own. The best I've ever gotten in my Chaffee was a tier 5-7 match but the average is 7-9.

Light tanks after tier 3 aren't worth the effort (except, perhaps, for French ones). The match making system for WoT is hideous, hopefully when Warthunder's ground combat is released Wargaming will be forced to up their game and finally implement a fair system.

 warboss wrote:
Don't sell the stuart but I doubt you will like the matchmaking on the chaffee. It really really really sucks and the tank is very expensive to repair so you're in over your head the vast majority of time AND paying through the nose for the privelege. When you're facing stuff 5 tiers above you, you don't even have a view range advantage on average so you get spotted by guys you don't see and one shotted to boot. It sucks as the "top tier" scout. It still happens with the Luchs and m5 Stuart but not as often and you at least some games of the time are facing a majority of stuff within 1 tier of your own. The best I've ever gotten in my Chaffee was a tier 5-7 match but the average is 7-9.

Well that sounds horrible. Don't see why I'm holding onto my Stuart then. It's pretty good but I'm just working towards misery.

Anyway, we're getting new stuff! Crew skills, new British tanks and a new map. Should keep me interested for a while. Turns out the base model Pz IV isn't that good. Need to level it up.


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 Palindrome wrote:
Light tanks after tier 3 aren't worth the effort (except, perhaps, for French ones). The match making system for WoT is hideous, hopefully when Warthunder's ground combat is released Wargaming will be forced to up their game and finally implement a fair system.

Highest tier for light tank is V right? They should have gotten out of the WWII era and done some modern stuff. Even just to keep the lights relevant.

Nope, French lights go to 8. Chinese do too I think, or maybe even 9. And a bunch of their tanks aren't really WWII era, the high tier British mediums being offenders here.

France and China both go up to 8, although the French tier IX and X mediums are essentially light tanks as well.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:

 Catyrpelius wrote:
Unless your in a tank that gets scout matchmaking your only ever going to see tanks that are two teirs higher then you. 90% of Premium Tanks get special matchmaking so they will only ever see tanks that are one teir higher then them.

Just because your the bottom teir in a game doesn't mean you can't be effective and a valuable member of your team you just need to plat differently.

If you don't like being bottom tier don't research the Chaffee, it's tier 5 but 25% of the time it will see tier 10's.

I've been working towards the Chaffee for quite some time (takes over 55,000 exp god damnit) but starting to think i should just sell my Stuart.

The Chaffee is a fun little tank to drive. It's tiny, manuverable and stealthy. It's not a french tank so it's best at passive scouting.... Even against tier 9's and 10's it's gun is suprisingly effective when used correctly.

If you enjoy passive scouting for the first half of the game and then in the later half zipping around shooting larger tanks in the ass you'll enjoy the Chaffee.

World of Tanks on Xbox now has the crew features that already existed on the PC version of the game. Here's a tutorial on how to make use of this new feature.

I shall miss my Hetzer's Hetzing but the Stug III is pretty good at Stuging.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
I shall miss my Hetzer's Hetzing but the Stug III is pretty good at Stuging.

More like the Stug is good at shtupping (enemy tanks).

What the Stug and other tank destroyers are not good at is brawling at close range with tanks. Tank destroyers simply do not have the armor generally speaking for doing so, yet I frequently have the odd Stug player and similar tank destroyers try to mix it up with my T14 or Sherman Jumbo at close range, much to my amusement because it's pretty much ALWAYS a cheap easy kill for me.

 BrassScorpion wrote:

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
I shall miss my Hetzer's Hetzing but the Stug III is pretty good at Stuging.

More like the Stug is good at shtupping (enemy tanks).

What the Stug and other tank destroyers are not good at is brawling at close range with tanks. Tank destroyers simply do not have the armor generally speaking for doing so, yet I frequently have the odd Stug player and similar tank destroyers try to mix it up with my T14 or Sherman Jumbo at close range, much to my amusement because it's pretty much ALWAYS a cheap easy kill for me.

I take it the british TD line isn't in the Xbox version of the game yet?

The T95 would like to challenge your argument.

Well, if the T95 is close, you can hit it's bumps. If it is far away, that is much harder. But yeah, one of those things rolling up the 8 line on himmelsdorf sucks when you are in an AT15.

And I'm assuming the two comments you made were unrelated, because the T95 is US. And the Brits (after the AT 2, so AT 6- AT 15) do better generally at sniping, because then you can't get at their cupolas/other weak spots.

 Catyrpelius wrote:

The T95 would like to challenge your argument.

As would the SU152 but for a different (152mm HE) reason. Some TDs are snipers while some are at their best at close range (as long as they aren't in danger of being flanked)

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
Just got my Pz IV - excited!

it's a grind with the short 75mm but soon looks up - once you're on the longer 75mm it's good, then on the second gun on the VK36 you'll be laughing.

IN the meantime I've gone the Panzer III/IV route - it's a great little tank thanks to the sloped armour.

Also grinding the Brits, so we can get to the Cromwell and Comet - thank God I've finally reached the six pounder on the Crusader, it takes a lot of shots to kill anything with the measly two pounder, and the Covenanter always seems to end up in high tier matches. After all the ones I've popped with my Hetzers and Panzer IV, it's like I'm reaping karma.

Lots of glitching since the update, though, specially on Himmelsdorf.

 Hivefleet Oblivion wrote:

Lots of glitching since the update, though, specially on Himmelsdorf.

I've gotten a glitch where the game freezes for me (but not anyone else) for 5-6 seconds on that map... twice. And a third time it happened to a friend. It's like you just pressed the pause button while watching a movie.

 motyak wrote:
Well, if the T95 is close, you can hit it's bumps. If it is far away, that is much harder. But yeah, one of those things rolling up the 8 line on himmelsdorf sucks when you are in an AT15.

And I'm assuming the two comments you made were unrelated, because the T95 is US. And the Brits (after the AT 2, so AT 6- AT 15) do better generally at sniping, because then you can't get at their cupolas/other weak spots.

The T95 is the most heavily armored (frontally) vehicle in the game, we just don't talk about the side and rear... It's got some week spots but they can still be pretty tough and are fairly well armored even at close and medium ranges. It's biggest draw backs are it's speed and lack of side and rear armor, but lack of side and rear armor is a common occurance in American tanks. Generally in tanks tier 6 and higher I carry roughly 20% of my ammo loadout in premium ammo to use against things like the T95, sometimes you just have to penetrate the front armor of something.

It was two seperate comments, but they were loosely related... I was refering to someones comment about TD's not being good at close range brawling. The Brits, starting with the AT2 get roughly 200mm at the front and 100mm at the side, at tier 5 thats substantial. Sure the thing is loaded with weak spots but it's a tier 5 tank most people at that tier don't know about them... To some extent the T18 is similar to the AT2, both are highly overpowered for their tier and are both tank destroyers.

It's actually one of (if not the most) armored on the sides as well with IIRC 150mm of side armor that is spaced for additional protection. It pretty much on the sides is immune to lower tier non-heavy/TD fire with a bit of angling.

One of my favorite Y95 videos.

I take it the british TD line isn't in the Xbox version of the game yet?

The T95 would like to challenge your argument.

They are in there and absolutely there are exceptions to what I said because there are some tank destroyers that can brawl a bit as they are nearly indestructible, but a good "tracking" will still leave them quite vulnerable. Mostly it's the British tank destroyers (AT2, AT8, AT7) or really high tier ones for all three countries available on Xbox that are super tough. However, when I see Stugs, Hetzers, Alecto's (fast because they have paper thin armor), Jacksons and Wolverines behaving like they are tanks and not tank destroyers I just sit back and enjoy getting, watching or contributing to the easy kills. That is, unless those guys are on my team, then I know my team is in trouble.

 BrassScorpion wrote:

I take it the british TD line isn't in the Xbox version of the game yet?

The T95 would like to challenge your argument.

They are in there and absolutely there are exceptions to what I said because there are some tank destroyers that can brawl a bit as they are nearly indestructible, but a good "tracking" will still leave them quite vulnerable. Mostly it's the British tank destroyers (AT2, AT8, AT7) or really high tier ones for all three countries available on Xbox that are super tough. However, when I see Stugs, Hetzers, Alecto's (fast because they have paper thin armor), Jacksons and Wolverines behaving like they are tanks and not tank destroyers I just sit back and enjoy getting, watching or contributing to the easy kills. That is, unless those guys are on my team, then I know my team is in trouble.

Actually the German Fixed Gun TD line is pretty well armored all the way through. Hetzers and Stugs are actually suprisingly well armored especially at their teir. The British line isn't really a good example... They get their 200mm of frontal armor at tier 5 and it never really increases or angles while gun penetration is constinatly going up.

A Jackson is best played like a medium while it does have alot of armor, that armor is only on the rounded nose of the body of the tank and doesn't protect anything thats commonly shot at. I seem to remember WG saying something about it being on the list for rebalancing as there's no reason to play it over the Hellcat

There is something said for being agressive, sometimes it works really well especially when you play the lower tier vehicles. Alot of the TD's Tier 5 and lower are tiny and sit low to the ground, driving right up in the face of a tank and using their gun depression against them is a viable tactic. Couple that with the generally superior guns and rates of fire of a TD and sometimes I'm more then willing to go head to head with a more heavily armored target.

It's not really the tank that determines how effective and engamenet is going to be, more often then not it all comes down to how well suported your vehicle is. If you watch the video I posted you'll see that even though the T95 spent most of the game tracked he had enough support from his teammates that the enemy was unable capitialize on his sides and rear armor

Yeah, people playing their tanks like something else is an epidemic of stupidity. I see folks with glass cannons like wolverines or t40's running forward occasionally but more frequently I see Brit TD's with incredible armor but mediocre at best guns hanging back. They need to be attracting the attention in the midfield instead of hanging back while the rest of the team flanks. Instead, they take the whole "sniper" TD thing which frankly doesn't apply well to them too seriously and lose the game. I see it all the time on Malinowka assault where a at5 hangs way back in the start area doing absolutely nothing with its pathetic gun instead of leading the charge with its best for multiple tiers armor. Then you get the low tier to mid tier (for the particular game) mediums that ignore their own mobility and snipe along with the occasional scout tank who wants to do the same. Admittedly, some of these poor players are conditioned by other poor players who don't support them when they do play their role. I've had the same thing happen to me when I go out and scout for the team and the 4 or 5 people behind me don't bother firing a single shot on the tank that is approaching ME to spot me in turn but instead focus on some other target that is no threat at the moment to anyone on the team.

 warboss wrote:
Yeah, people playing their tanks like something else is an epidemic of stupidity. I see folks with glass cannons like wolverines or t40's running forward occasionally but more frequently I see Brit TD's with incredible armor but mediocre at best guns hanging back. They need to be attracting the attention in the midfield instead of hanging back while the rest of the team flanks. Instead, they take the whole "sniper" TD thing which frankly doesn't apply well to them too seriously and lose the game. I see it all the time on Malinowka assault where a at5 hangs way back in the start area doing absolutely nothing with its pathetic gun instead of leading the charge with its best for multiple tiers armor. Then you get the low tier to mid tier (for the particular game) mediums that ignore their own mobility and snipe along with the occasional scout tank who wants to do the same. Admittedly, some of these poor players are conditioned by other poor players who don't support them when they do play their role. I've had the same thing happen to me when I go out and scout for the team and the 4 or 5 people behind me don't bother firing a single shot on the tank that is approaching ME to spot me in turn but instead focus on some other target that is no threat at the moment to anyone on the team.

I'm generally pretty forgiving of people in AT 2's. If you moving up that particular line you move from an alecto, with its awsome modility and gun right into the AT 2 which even fully upgraded is lacks firepower and mobility. It's a hell of a shock that more often then not leaves new players scratching their head. Hell, that change is almost as bad as going from their the Sherman Jumbo or the M6 to the T29.

I've gotten into some pretty crazy brawls and even hollywood car chases with my Hetzer and come out on top. It's quite hard to pen from the front.

My favorite are the artilleries that charge straight forward into the enemy. Obviously the best place for Artillery is at the tip of the spear.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
It's quite hard to pen from the front.
My favorite are the artilleries that charge straight forward into the enemy. Obviously the best place for Artillery is at the tip of the spear.

The Hetzer has a pretty weak lower glacis plate and of course its side armour is non existent. As always people who know where and how to aim can be quite troublesome.

Artillery is basically worthless now, well it is on the PC version. It was horribly nerfed several patches ago and now TD mode is just about the only thing that works for some SPGs. It takes about a minute to load, 10-15 seconds to aim (which keeps getting constantly reset due to the absolutely tiny gun traverse most SPGs have) and to make matters worse the shell is not only extremely inaccurate it is also extremely slow. Getting kills with arty is all down to the RNG rather than skill these days so hardly anyone plays SPGs anymore. Wargaming obviously don't care though as its been this way for about a year now.



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 warboss wrote:
Then you get the low tier to mid tier (for the particular game) mediums that ignore their own mobility and snipe along with the occasional scout tank who wants to do the same. Admittedly, some of these poor players are conditioned by other poor players who don't support them when they do play their role.

Be careful of thinking that the class of tank is what defines their role, there are a lot of factors that come into play not least their armament. Some heavies and mediums make great snipers so should be hanging back with the TDs (Tigers, Centurions, KV-1s with a 57mm etc) while some scouts simply prefer to protect the back line at the start of the match and then transition to scout in the mid game or go arty hunting, kamikaze runs don't do much good.

People quite commonly think that they know better than me when I position myself "like a noob", yet I almost invariably come higher than them in the match rankings.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
I've gotten into some pretty crazy brawls and even hollywood car chases with my Hetzer and come out on top. It's quite hard to pen from the front.

My favorite are the artilleries that charge straight forward into the enemy. Obviously the best place for Artillery is at the tip of the spear.

It's funny when it works though.

 Mr Nobody wrote:

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
I've gotten into some pretty crazy brawls and even hollywood car chases with my Hetzer and come out on top. It's quite hard to pen from the front.

My favorite are the artilleries that charge straight forward into the enemy. Obviously the best place for Artillery is at the tip of the spear.

It's funny when it works though.

It never works! It's just dumb. Don't know how people can make it to Tier IV and co playlet not know how to play the game.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:

It never works!

It does, as long as you accept that you will probably only get 1 shot and its very map dependent. Then again SPGs in general are very map dependent, they are all but worthless on urban maps like Himmelsdorf.

Arty tends to have very high alpha damage so they have a really good chance of killing whatever they hit, but they will only get a hit at very close range.

That was funny, 3 mastery games in a row. Matilda and 2 Matilda BP games. It's a good morning so far.

Then arty wacked me randomly for all my health in my first Cromwell game. Oh well, streak broken ha

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:

 Mr Nobody wrote:

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
I've gotten into some pretty crazy brawls and even hollywood car chases with my Hetzer and come out on top. It's quite hard to pen from the front.

My favorite are the artilleries that charge straight forward into the enemy. Obviously the best place for Artillery is at the tip of the spear.

It's funny when it works though.

It never works! It's just dumb. Don't know how people can make it to Tier IV and co playlet not know how to play the game.

Beginning of the game, of course not. But it does make for a very entertaining and explosive last stand.