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Made in nz
Stealthy Space Wolves Scout



Auckland, New Zealand

I was having fun trying to streamline Warzone into a simple "attacker rolls dice and adds stat, defender rolls dice and adds stat" system, but had a thought about doing it to 40k too.

If you run the numbers a Space Marine with a bolter shooting another Space Marine with a bolter has a 1/9 chance of getting a kill. That's 4 /36 or approximately what you'd get if the Marine had an attack stat of 4+d6 and a defence stat of 6+D6, yet by the stat+D6 method you've reduced the hit/wound/save rolls down to a simple roll off.

Of course you gain greater granularity with a larger dice, like a D12 (Warzone was based on D20) which gives 144 possible outcomes instead of 36, but a D6 system is adequate.


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I find passive aggressive messages in people's signatures quite amusing. 
   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

In terms of troops in new40k, I think a good window into the current vision for transports by the design team is found in the Arkanaut Frigate for AoS:

PDF link:
https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/arkanaut-frigate_ENG.pdf

Spoiler:
Embark: If all models in a Skyfarer unit can move to within 3" of a friendly Arkanaut Frigate in the movement phase, they can embark within it. Remove the unit from the battlefield and place it to one side – it is now embarked inside the vessel.

Embarked units cannot normally do anything or be affected in any way whilst they are embarked. Unless specifically stated, abilities that affect other units within a certain range have no effect on a unit that is embarked or whilst the unit that has the
ability is embarked, and you cannot measure from or to an embarked unit.

If the Arkanaut Frigate is destroyed, the passengers immediately bail out: roll a dice for each model embarked within it. For each roll of 1, a model from that model’s unit (your choice) is slain. The embarked units must then disembark before the vessel is removed.

Disembark: Any unit that begins its hero phase embarked within an Arkanaut Frigate can disembark during the hero phase. When a unit disembarks, set it up so that all its models are within 3" of the vessel and none are within 3" of any enemy models – any disembarking model that cannot be set up in this way is slain. Units that disembark can then act normally, including using abilities that can be used in the
hero phase, for the remainder of their turn. Note that a unit cannot both disembark and embark in the same turn.


The "hero phase" happens before movement. So if that's any indication, I don't think we will see rhinos moving forward and marines assaulting the same turn. It'll be rhinos rush forward, opponent's turn, marines get out, move, shoot and charge.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for the "if marines are more points no one will take them!" thinking, that assumes the game largely doesn't change. That the current relative strengths are going to be maintained. That the basic stats of the game won't change.

If marines go up to 30 points but are as awesome as 32 point Stormcast Judicators in AoS, people are going to love them.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/21 15:26:14


A points system is a tool to create balance. Let's use it to intentionally seek out imbalance in order to win and then blame the game designer for it not working!  
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




It also is a question of quest restrictions are put on the rest of the army. For example:

If we make a general assumption that the CAD still will exist in it's basic form. Then 1 HQ plus 2 Troop are required. You cannot get away with skipping buying your troops.

   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

Well, given that they said they are going with the 3 ways to play from the AoS general's handbook, I'm going to guess that army construction will have faction specific battleline units you have to take minimums of. So codex marines might have tactical squads, scout squads and so on. While a dark angels deathwing might count terminators as battleline. Or possibly have a formation you pay some points for and it includes counting a normally elite unit as battleline among other bonuses you get.

I don't think we'll see mandatory HQ choices at all.

At 2000 points, I think we'll see 3 battleline units minimum, a maximum of 6 heroes, 4 artillery pieces and 4 "behemoths" which will be things like truly large tanks and knights and the like. I think the AoS army construction system for matched play will work really well for 40k and given what GW has said about the success of General's Handbook sales, they're probably leaning in that direction for new40k.

The open and narrative modes will still allow for new players who grab a box of whatever they think is cool to immediately play with those units without worrying about the larger army structure right away. Sort of like unbound but without the attempt to force it into the same game mode as matched play.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/04/21 16:13:40


A points system is a tool to create balance. Let's use it to intentionally seek out imbalance in order to win and then blame the game designer for it not working!  
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws





Mississippi

I suspect we will see troops taking on an expanded role, thanks in part to a hopeful boost in effectiveness and of course more of them being needed as part of a 'normal' list.

I like this concept myself, as I've always preferred fielding more troops than anything else, to include full 10 man tactical squads.

We shall see. There's some kind of announcement coming tomorrow. Maybe it'll be info on 8th? Or more likely the Mortarion reveal. We shall see.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

You don't know me son, so I'll explain this to you once: If I ever kill you, you'll be awake, you'll be facing me, and you'll be armed.  
   
Made in au
Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard





 Red__Thirst wrote:
I suspect we will see troops taking on an expanded role, thanks in part to a hopeful boost in effectiveness and of course more of them being needed as part of a 'normal' list.

I like this concept myself, as I've always preferred fielding more troops than anything else, to include full 10 man tactical squads.

We shall see. There's some kind of announcement coming tomorrow. Maybe it'll be info on 8th? Or more likely the Mortarion reveal. We shall see.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-


I like the idea of more emphasis on troops but nice as that sounds there is the question of Troops with extra movement - bikes/jetbikes.
Are all armies to have access to them or is every army going to have their own specialty troop?
Or is there going to be a massive gap between haves and have-nots?

I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I wouldn't be surprised if they ditched the concept of troops - or, perhaps more accurately - expanded it to the point where it covers the majority of infantry squads (and possibly things like bikers).

There would then be a separate category for your vehicles and monstrous creatures.
   
 
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