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notredameguy10 wrote:

 DarkBlack wrote:

notredameguy10 wrote:
Very disappointed. My Tau got nerfed into the ground. And besides the nerfing, they just made them plain boring. They removed essentially everything that made them unique (markelights being effective, signature battle systems, most vehicle gear, suits except commander now stink)

So were daemons. What did you think was going to happen? Obviously the top tier armies would have to be nerfed to get all armies to a similar level.

And yet SM, Necrons, and even Elder are still in a very good place compared to Tau


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hollow wrote:

notredameguy10 wrote:
Very disappointed. My Tau got nerfed into the ground. And besides the nerfing, they just made them plain boring. They removed essentially everything that made them unique (markelights being effective, signature battle systems, most vehicle gear, suits except commander now stink)

T'au are more exciting than they have been for years, ML's are very effective if used correctly, Battle systems are still very much there and all suits now have a role to play rather than just Riptides.

Except the playstyle of Tau is no longer what Tau actually is. Tau is supposed to be smaller units of battle suits, not a horde army of fire warriors, hounds, and drones.

Since WHEN? Tau has always been about Firewarrior teams supported by tanks, with alien auxiliares, a ton of drones and supported by Suits.

The Suits spam armies are just a thing of 6th and 7th edition. Don't make a bigger flush of the change in the Tau meta for 8th that it really is. Recurring to a just false "fluff" and "Playstile of the army"
Tau have more than one playstile. Just like Dark Angels can be Deathwing, Ravenwing or Greenwing and still be all Death Angels.

notredameguy10 wrote:



Support systems are different than signature systems (which commanders could take). And they got rid of most vehicle upgrades as well.

Everyone lost relics (effectively signature systems) AND everyone also lost a lot of their vehicle upgrades (dozer blades do nothing no search lights)

edit: DAMNIT i screwd up that quote.


rerolls of 1s is a captain level ability with the only next best thing being reroll ALL to hit rolls being a Chapter master level thing which is incredably hard to get and limited

they also ONLY effect units within a short distance of them making them very stationary

Marker lights while being shootable can also be spread way out across the table one multiple units while also being 36" which is a good chunk of the board.

ever two marker lights is a captain on a single unit.

notredameguy10 wrote:

Support systems are different than signature systems (which commanders could take). And they got rid of most vehicle upgrades as well.

Character bonus is much better than ML. A character with that ability can stay behind troops and basically survive all game. Pathfinders/marker drones are going to be killed turn 1.

Ah, yes, those things. Every army lost those things. I, unfortunately can't have the Mantle of Ophelia anymore, so we're all in that boat.

Also, not all characters give re-roll 1's. Some give +1 BS, or other bonuses, and for the Imperial Guard, they just give orders.

Also, in case you missed it, Master of War: Kauyon gives re-rolls if you remained stationary, once per game. Storm of Fire re-rolls 1's if you remain static, and Longstrike gives all nearby Hammerheads +1 BS.

I had high hopes for chaos space marines in 8th, but found their list lacking in a lot of areas....everything SM get is cheaper in power level then the chaos equivalent. Their wargear list is more stripped down then before (no daemon weapons but SM still get relic blades?) Marks of chaos don't do anything. The death Guard army list has very limited options on what you can take- no forgefiends, etc..., chaos lords with a chosen mark don't unlock cult troops like they used to. Their whole list is very underwhelming.

 Altruizine wrote:

 Selym wrote:

Shinzra wrote:
But for some reason I just dont get the same tactical feel from the 8th compared to 7th.

Are you sure you played 7th? Whole thing was a gakshow.

The effects of the USR's is unchanged, they are incorporated into each unit, thus saving having to constantly flick through 2+ books.
If granulation is what you're after, codexes are in the future.
8th is not rushed, not by a long way. 6e was an utter hackjob, and every book released between then and just before 8e has been increasingly hacky, money-grabbing and rushed. That we don't have an obvious auto-lose army is self-evidently proof that GW put more thought into this ruleset than any release since 6e.

The ruleset is a nearly note-for-note port of AoS. That means it probably took less thought than any edition, because most of the work was done, and all that was required was tugging, tweaking, and carving out places for things that didn't exist in AoS (like transports).

Seems like you somehow managed to know even less about AoS than you apparently do about 40k.

AoS does have transports.

Except the playstyle of Tau is no longer what Tau actually is. Tau is supposed to be smaller units of battle suits, not a horde army of fire warriors, hounds, and drones.

I.. Look at this and wonder if people actually ever read Tau fluff or just played the FOTM army and stuck with it.

^ Definitely the latter.

A bit. My games so far have been a bit dull.

I think my issue is that my main opponents are Guard and Tau so every game for me (Tyranids) is "run forward and engage as fast as possible and hope to not be shot off the table" so I'm willing to give 8th the benefit of the doubt.

If nothing else my opponents enjoy rolling loads of dice and killing my stuff with little effort until the 5 genestealers and a couple of monsters reach their lines at which point they become the bored ones and I get to roll loads of dice and kill their stuff with little effort. I'll need to get one of my other armies on the board and see how it goes.

I seeing a lot of "8th sucks because my army isn't awesome". Do you really not realise how short sighted and selfish that is?

Beyond choosing and army that matches you play style, which army you choose should not give you an advantage. The ideal is that all armies are equally powerful. That means you need skill to win more than half your games and your army should hold it's own and give close games vs similarly skilled opponents. If you expect your army to wreck face and roll over the enemy every game then you are asking for the game to be unbalanced.

 DarkBlack wrote:
Beyond choosing and army that matches you play style, which army you choose should not give you an advantage. The ideal is that all armies are equally powerful.

Unfortunately, they aren't all equal, and which army you chose does give you an advantage.

 Melissia wrote:

 DarkBlack wrote:
Beyond choosing and army that matches you play style, which army you choose should not give you an advantage. The ideal is that all armies are equally powerful.

Unfortunately, they aren't all equal, and which army you chose does give you an advantage.

Knowing GW, you're probably right. The quality of the edition still shouldn't be measured by the effectiveness of your army though.

What I will say I'm (still) disappointed with is that GW's rules (though better this time) are still poorly written.

Flamers and fliers
Being able to fail plasma gets hot on a 6 assuming modifiers are there
Reanimation protocols
Vaugness about certain rules such as fly and assault
And similarities to age of sigmar because if I wanted sigmar I would play sigmar
Character limit not being shot at because they are out of the 12" bubble but there is a closer unit that is out of Los
And 8 pages of rules shouldn't be a selling point