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 Niiai wrote:
Vanguard detachments - is flying hive tyrants back?

Yeah, it really seems like it is.

Saw an overview of the new codex, Crusher Stampede looks "bad", the rest look good, 3 of which look Great.Our main flaw is lack of Anti-tank though...

Nothing that throwing a lot of Zoanthropes and Haruspexes cannot fix.

Don't see a real reason to field Norn Asses when you compare them to Hierodules honestly. Sad.
But Hierophant under Crusher Stampede seems fun.

 Astmeister wrote:
Don't see a real reason to field Norn Asses when you compare them to Hierodules honestly. Sad.
But Hierophant under Crusher Stampede seems fun.

My table would not leave the hierophat anywhere to walk.

But you take the norn ass for OC15 and 4+++. Probably other reasons as well.

Assimilator Emissary actually seems ok. I might end up getting one.

But why has the Lictor lost its damned Invul save when every Lictor variant (Leapers, Deathleaper, Neurolictor) still has one?

I think the Lictor losing Inv is a typo. Anyway the Assimilator neither has an Inv nor FnP and has to get to 12 inches. Which he will probably never do.

Reserves. 7" charge. Ideally to objective for the fnp

tneva82 wrote:
Reserves. 7" charge. Ideally to objective for the fnp

Rerves coming in from the side lets you only charge stuff too close to the sideline. And as objective sitter the Emissary is way better with the 4++ and 4+ Fnp against mortals.

I remain skeptical. If you could put one in a Tyrannocyte than maybe...

Does the Neurolictor need LOS for its abilities? That might give it some more protection as it seems a buff / debuff piece rather than something that wants to be eyeballing the enemy.

I am new to 10th Tyrranids. from 8th was the last time I played.

Been thinking about secondaries for the new detachments. What fixed secondaries would you all suggest?

These are the two I will play.
Vanguard Being very aggressive.
While the Assimilator seems is mixed.

What would you be advise for these detachments?

Are you even sure you want fixed? With biovores nerfed no super easy ones. Rather than det's you need to look more of units.

Generally tactical's have proven to be superior. Nids had advantage with fixed due to 3x1 biovore spam but that went away.

We can still 'rig the game' when it comes to secondary. One unit of 3 biovores (or several smaller back up units) will sort that out. Have the swarmlord and/or hive tyrant for CP gain/discount.

I just don't know if it is worth it.

It is also worth noting both gargoyles and lictors are well suited to steal objectives for a turn. But you will not have much kill power.

That only gives you tiny one for behind.

You are basically agreeing to limit you under max.

And why unit of 3 when 1 does same job...1 mine easier to fit so 1 does job better than 3.

How do we feel about our Leader units? Worth imbedding into squads?

Leaders:
Hive Tyrant - Tyrant guard - No specific bonuses
Winged Prime - gargs/warriors(both) - Sustained hits 1 to unit
Nerotyrant - nurogaunts/Tyrant guard - +1 TH, +1 TW vs. battleshocked units for unit
Broodlord - stealers - DevWounds to unit
Swarmlord - Tyrant guard - No Bonus
OOE - ‘fexes - RR TH for unit

Squads they can join:
Gargs - move after shooting
Shooty warriors - Fallback and shoot/charge
Choppy warriors - RR1sTH or RR1s to save
genestealers - RR1sTH, RR1sTW on objectives
Nerogaunts - nothing relevant to having the leader in the unit (just needs to be close)
Carnifex -Surge move when shot
Tyrant guard - 5+++ to attached characters

One thing to keep in mind is how toughness and shooting works. Is it worth sticking the Neurotyrant into a squad of nerogaunts for the ablitive wounds when they reduce the unit to T3 instead of just floating around at T8?

Or movement. Tyrant guard have a 6” move. Worth slowing down the 8” tyrant/swarmy? Or grounding the winged prime in a foot warrior squad?

The basic tyrant and swarmlord get slower with their guard, and go from T10 to T8. Which is not horrible, as it’s still keeping small arms wounding on 6’s. You get a nice chunk of extra wounds that needs to be blown off, and some extra moderate chop to keep you from being bogged down in CC. The FNP will help keep snipers/precision damage off the big guy, not sure how much of an issue that is.

They neurotryant is slower to start, so attaching to the guard doesn’t slow it down more. Plus only naturally T8, so no loss there. Also less naturally choppy than most big bugs, so the guard’s melee abilities are welcome. Unlike the regular tyrants, the neuro actually gives a bonus to its squad, so has synergy besides just ablative wounds keeping it safe. I think this combo has a lot of promise.

Unlike sticking it in some neurogaunts, which I just see as a liability. Sure, they could use the buffs, but they start so lame it’s not going to make a difference. Joining a T3 unit seems like you are just asking to be boltered off the table.

Broodlord + Stealers seems a no brainer. Lot os synergy, both ways. Load them up and blender things.

OOE in a brood of fexes seems nasty, but a lot of eggs in one basket. But working together they get to cross the table faster and hit harder when they get there.

The winged tyrant seems a little odd. It’s a CC model, but 2/3rds of the squads it attaches are shooty. The sustaned hits buff works for everyone. Gargoyles let it utilize its movement, but at the cost of hanging out in a T3 squad. And the unit you are boosting is not exactly rocking the world with their basic weapons. Gargs don’t naturally have synapse, so having a unit on the wing to spread that around is good. Stuck in a warrior squad you are not getting a lot out of your wings, but the defensive profile is the same as the unit. And the squad you are boosting actually has some punch. Warriors already have synapse, so nothing added here. Whatever you pick you are only using half your abilities. But at 65 points do we care that we are leaving stuff unused?

Thoughts?

I don’t actually own any tyrant guard, and am seriously thinking about getting a squad to protect my new floating brain. Or even provide some backup for my old tryants.

tneva82 wrote:
That only gives you tiny one for behind.

You are basically agreeing to limit you under max.

And why unit of 3 when 1 does same job...1 mine easier to fit so 1 does job better than 3.

Redundancy. If all your secondaries are depending on that one spore mind you are fethed when he gets flanked/indirected/charged.

For redundancy 3x1 is way superior to unit of 3. If enemy gets to that unit 3 is not much more survivable. 2more in 2 more spots is.

But another reason to stick for tacticals like everybody else. Nids are well suited for those anyway.

 Nevelon wrote:

Spoiler:

How do we feel about our Leader units? Worth imbedding into squads?

Leaders:
Hive Tyrant - Tyrant guard - No specific bonuses
Winged Prime - gargs/warriors(both) - Sustained hits 1 to unit
Nerotyrant - nurogaunts/Tyrant guard - +1 TH, +1 TW vs. battleshocked units for unit
Broodlord - stealers - DevWounds to unit
Swarmlord - Tyrant guard - No Bonus
OOE - ‘fexes - RR TH for unit

Squads they can join:
Gargs - move after shooting
Shooty warriors - Fallback and shoot/charge
Choppy warriors - RR1sTH or RR1s to save
genestealers - RR1sTH, RR1sTW on objectives
Nerogaunts - nothing relevant to having the leader in the unit (just needs to be close)
Carnifex -Surge move when shot
Tyrant guard - 5+++ to attached characters

One thing to keep in mind is how toughness and shooting works. Is it worth sticking the Neurotyrant into a squad of nerogaunts for the ablitive wounds when they reduce the unit to T3 instead of just floating around at T8?

Or movement. Tyrant guard have a 6” move. Worth slowing down the 8” tyrant/swarmy? Or grounding the winged prime in a foot warrior squad?

The basic tyrant and swarmlord get slower with their guard, and go from T10 to T8. Which is not horrible, as it’s still keeping small arms wounding on 6’s. You get a nice chunk of extra wounds that needs to be blown off, and some extra moderate chop to keep you from being bogged down in CC. The FNP will help keep snipers/precision damage off the big guy, not sure how much of an issue that is.

They neurotryant is slower to start, so attaching to the guard doesn’t slow it down more. Plus only naturally T8, so no loss there. Also less naturally choppy than most big bugs, so the guard’s melee abilities are welcome. Unlike the regular tyrants, the neuro actually gives a bonus to its squad, so has synergy besides just ablative wounds keeping it safe. I think this combo has a lot of promise.

Unlike sticking it in some neurogaunts, which I just see as a liability. Sure, they could use the buffs, but they start so lame it’s not going to make a difference. Joining a T3 unit seems like you are just asking to be boltered off the table.

Broodlord + Stealers seems a no brainer. Lot os synergy, both ways. Load them up and blender things.

OOE in a brood of fexes seems nasty, but a lot of eggs in one basket. But working together they get to cross the table faster and hit harder when they get there.

The winged tyrant seems a little odd. It’s a CC model, but 2/3rds of the squads it attaches are shooty. The sustaned hits buff works for everyone. Gargoyles let it utilize its movement, but at the cost of hanging out in a T3 squad. And the unit you are boosting is not exactly rocking the world with their basic weapons. Gargs don’t naturally have synapse, so having a unit on the wing to spread that around is good. Stuck in a warrior squad you are not getting a lot out of your wings, but the defensive profile is the same as the unit. And the squad you are boosting actually has some punch. Warriors already have synapse, so nothing added here. Whatever you pick you are only using half your abilities. But at 65 points do we care that we are leaving stuff unused?

Thoughts?

I don’t actually own any tyrant guard, and am seriously thinking about getting a squad to protect my new floating brain. Or even provide some backup for my old tryants.

Let me just predice this that I am a cassual.player and have not played Nids yet in 10th. Was gonne play my first game this weekend. But my LGS did not get the codex and my app got trapped behind a paywall.

Gargoyles I only see for a handfull of purposes. Blocking, deep strike shoot and steal objective. Adding a prime there does little.

A prime in warriors can be cool. I want to try this. A unit of shooting warriors is around 200 points with a prime. They are a bit all rounders but not a specialist. If you are playing this you probably want some chaff to absorb charges and the counter charge with warriors. Wight be bare warriors (or warrior groups of 3) is better. Depends also a lot on your detachment rules. Probably not good in invader fleet as you can get global sustain 1.

Tyrant guards are good for the brain. But makes the brain coat much more.

Tyrant/Swarmlord probably do not want bodyguards with low T. The brain certainly do not want to join neurogants! One blast weapon and he is dead. (Desolators marines come to mind!)

I do not know the detachments enough to specify. I know the brain can get a super flamer in one of them. Keeping him alive is more important then.

I think it's worth pointing out that in the Vanguard detachment (whatever it's called) the Winged Prime has the appropriate keyword, and thus can pass it to a unit of Warriors he attaches to. I personally want to run a unit of 6 with him in it in that detachment. Regarding the Broodlord, he's good if Genestealers turn out to be good, and in that same detachment I think Genestealers are worth a look, at least one unit with a BL.

How are people finding barbed gaunts? They seem like a steal as an 24" harasment unit. Blast is so good.

I think the most promising options for characters in Units.

Neurotyrant + Tyrant Guard: Was pointed out already that you do not loose much and they get more scary.

Winged Prime + Warriors: Very good in vanguard detachment.

The barbgaunts are great imho but their blast is the least interesting thing, since tyranids do not need cheap infantry clearance. There is plenty of it already. But the -2 to move is great against very big elite units.
And their price point is not too steep.

Neurogants: I would only really play them in Gaunt Swarm, where their Synapse spreading can be great.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw Crusher Stampede and Vanguard det make Harpyies and Crones better, which is kind of cool but weird.
You can even give them Lone operative (untargetable further than 12 inch away) with a Strat.

On the barbgaunts: Blasts in multi model units are great. If five barbgaunts shoot at a 10 man unit you get 10 more shots. That is siiiiick.

That's probably true, however multi model units like swarm infantry are seldom a problem for tyranids.

Oh boy. Perhaps not a strategy question. But a convertion problem.

I own so many termgaunts. Now 3 in every 10 can grab a special weapon.

6 per unit. 5 units max. Do I now need to convert up 30 different weapons? I can use the new plastic gaunt body. But I am not buying a bunch of gaunts for the new weapons.

Are there any of the weapons that are subpart to the standar weapon? I think all look good.

 Niiai wrote:
Oh boy. Perhaps not a strategy question. But a convertion problem.

I own so many termgaunts. Now 3 in every 10 can grab a special weapon.

6 per unit. 5 units max. Do I now need to convert up 30 different weapons? I can use the new plastic gaunt body. But I am not buying a bunch of gaunts for the new weapons.

Are there any of the weapons that are subpart to the standar weapon? I think all look good.

My thoughts reposted from the rumors thread:

Shardlauncher is blast/heavy 18” d3 shots 4+ S5 no AP 1 dam
Spike heavy 24” 1/4+/4/-1/1
Strangleweb assault/dev wounds/torrent 18” d6/-/2/0/1

I was a bit relieved to see their stats. I was worried that the sharlauncher was going to be like the barbs, and offer up some battlefield control. Which would be a must have. These are just different flavors of damage. And even if they are situationally nice, are they worth the mechanical price of separately rolling them and bogging down the game?
—
Yah, the spike rifle is a bit of a “why?” Maybe if you could do a whole squad of them. It might be worth tossing one into a squad of devgaunts. But probably not worth the effort of singling out a separate guy to roll. But if you are using them to camp an objective, they do have AP, slightly better range and the +1 to hit from heavy if they don’t move. But only a single shot. Pass. Might not even bother to strip and repaint the 2 old metal one I have to match my modern scheme.

Strangleweb is tempting. It’s the only assault option, so meshes better with fleshborer/spinefist squads. Yes, it’s S2. Which sucks. But DevWounds with d6 autohits? Might get some 6’s to wound. And then you get to skip the whole armor thing. Plus works on overwatch.

Shardlauncher is the new option. Not assault, but that’s pretty much the only drawback compared to the basic guns it would be replacing. Pretty much a straight upgrade over a devourer. The only time you could argue against that is if shooting at a unit less than 5 models after you moved, where the 2 guaranteed shots vs the d3 might be preferable. The loss of assault might not even be a big deal in you are replacing a fleshborer. Sure, if you advance you can’t use it, but when you don’t it’s some pretty nice shooting. Point less S here.

My hot take is that in Dev squads, you will want the sharlauncher, maybe a spikerifle, but that’s more of a lateral, not an upgrade.

For fleshborer and spinefist squads, you probably want a strangleweb as it adds some felxability to the squad, but not required.

If you just want to field your old legacy horde, you can do so and not feel too left behind. Although will want to source some shardlaunchers for your Devigaunts.

I'm thinking in using deathspitters to represent the strangleweb. No idea how to convert the shardlauncher.

Spike rifle I can convert. Cut the barrel off and fasten two together. Or just extend with green stuff. Perhaps fasten a quill in the barrel.

The strangelweb can be done with green stuff. It is very organic. Just add it to the end of a barrel.

But that last one is difficult. I will need to find some bits to use.

I think all three options from a rules perspective is good. The strangelweb gives a mortal wound. The blast weapon is great! And the last weapon has some AP.

I think it'd be easier to get them 3D printed.

Question for everyone regarding Neurotyrants.

With or without escort?

Are Neurogaunts worth bringing, and if so, do you just bring 11 or the full 22?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Question for everyone regarding Neurotyrants.

With or without escort?

Are Neurogaunts worth bringing, and if so, do you just bring 11 or the full 22?

Don't Neurogaunts make the Tyrant T3 while attached?
I'd think Tyrant Guard would be your better choice.

I think that would matter more if they were only a few of them. But there are (potentially) 22 or them, so I think that's less of an issue.

Plus 90 points vs 190 points.