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They are swapping one type of customisation for another. You get to customise your hardpoints and thus have greater control over the weapons loadout you bring into battle.

Which is essentially meaningless. Assume a Madcat is like an Orion. It'll probably have about 30-40 tons soaked into its engine, armor, and heat sinks. That means only 35-45 tons to play with and no ability to get more or less by tweaking sinks, armor, and the engine. Not to mention PGI might screw the mech by giving it a very unoptimal engine. Then throw in that the player can't move crit slots for ferro. How many builds will realistically come out as viable for the mech? Under all the restrictions, probably just 1 or 2. Being able to swap an arm for another is just a silly feature that doesn't actually balance those restrictions at all. it's only even in the game because PGI is apparently refusing to fix the problem with the pilot trees otherwise the slots would just be omni.

Except of course on those 'Mechs who only have 1-2 missile hardpoints in their pods

You'd be better off not using the hard point and putting weight elsewhere. Firing 2 missiles at a time, the SSRM6 will have 2-3 missiles shot down by AMS... It's DPS is negligable and will lose a huge chunk of it to defensive fire, and even then half the maps have enough cover that you're unlikely to hit a mech will all 6 anyway firing that slow (EDIT: Not even mentioning how easy itll be to Torso twist that). The weapon has been gimped. They could have just balanced it with heat and cooldown, but apparently that's too difficult. Instead we a need a completely arbitrary fire rate that makes the weapon pointless.

btw, just voted for this http://www.gog.com/wishlist/games/mechwarrior_2_3_or_4

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
btw, just voted for this http://www.gog.com/wishlist/games/mechwarrior_2_3_or_4

Oh hell yes. That brights my mood in a pinch

The Dark Apostle wrote:personally, even though this was not addressed to me was having them OP and a star VS a company

I would have liked this because it's "fluffy", and it seems like a clever way to address the power balance between the individual weapons.

However, I'm not sure if the additional customisation - swapping hardpoints - would not break the system, considering the room for optimisation. Consider the possibilities: Clan Assault 'Mech with the slowest engine and no back armour, just to load up on 8 Gauss Rifles for that 120 Damage Alpha or similarly ridiculous ideas. "Forcing" players to carry a real engine is the only way to prevent the worst abominations, I fear.

LordofHats wrote:Just treat clan weapons as a higher teir of weapons for players to grind for. No one would ever use IS weapons sure, but it's not like the game isn't already filled with variant mechs and weapons no one ever uses anyway so who really cares?

So your solution is that Clan players just start with better weapons than IS pilots, who have to spend additional time grinding up to them? Or would you have Clan players start with IS gear?

And I can't think of any 'Mech or weapon that "no one ever uses", tbh.

The Dark Apostle wrote:btw, just voted for this http://www.gog.com/wishlist/games/mechwarrior_2_3_or_4

You have my vote!

 Lynata wrote:
"Forcing" players to carry a real engine is the only way to prevent the worst abominations, I fear.

No mech in the game can carry that many weapons, and who says every slot needs to be omni? There are ways to balance the mechs outside of gutting customization.

So your solution is that Clan players just start with better weapons than IS pilots, who have to spend additional time grinding up to them? Or would you have Clan players start with IS gear?

I'd just have all mechs come stock in IS gear (conversely we could have just screwed the whole Clan tech concept as ultimately pointless and completely left it out of the game). As much as people whine about grinding, they like grinding. it gives them something to do, a goal to achieve. here have a cookie is one of the best rewards a dev can give to keep people playing. So long as the grind is balanced with proper reward people don't mind despite whatever whining might appear.

And reall, there are no Clan players or IS players. Just players. The arbitrary factionalism is coming from the lore and holds no relevance in this game. PGI has made it clear there will be no 'only CLan mech' accounts/players or 'only IS mech' accounts/players. That anyone ever wanted that baffles me, who wants to operate 2 accounts for one game (be quiet EVE players those guys are ripping you off anyway ) Even in community warfare we're not going to see a restriction like "IS alighned players may only use X mechs." Not to mention we still ahve no due date for community warfare.

And I can't think of any 'Mech or weapon that "no one ever uses", tbh.

I'll list them for you; No one in their right mind uses Orions. No one uses a Raven that isn't a 3L unless grinding the trees. You hardly ever see Commandos, Trebs, or Cicadas that arn't the X5 or the ECM cada. You rarely see Highlanders that aren't the HM, 733c or 732 and the only stalkers that get used are the Misery and one other. Anyone using an Atlas that isn't the D-DC is either grinding trees or wasting CBIlls. We hardly see any Locusts at all because its that bad, and the Shadowhawk puts all the other mediums ave the Centurion to shame.

Most of the variants in game see no use because inevitably one or two stand out as just plain better. Hardly anyone uses LRM20's because few mechs have the tubes for them, and the only use for LRM5's is on one Catapult variant that boats them as a pseudo-dual LRM15. No one uses small lasers, and the AC10 is rarely used either. Flamers are lol weapons and the NARC gets shunned because the tag is better anyway.

Lots of things in MWO don't get used much. This only increases as more mechs come out in particular (the Highlander is completely eclipsed by the Victor as a brawler and by the Stalker as a fire support mech). Such a thing is probably inevitable in a free to play game.

http://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/145494-free-7-day-premium-time/

LordofHats wrote:No mech in the game can carry that many weapons, and who says every slot needs to be omni? There are ways to balance the mechs outside of gutting customization.

Make it 4 Gauss, then. Still more than enough. Or 6 PPCs. Or 8 LRM20. Or 8 SRM6. The list goes on. Hardpoint swapping is a Pandora's box, so I consider some drawbacks just being a necessity. Yes, it sucks for someone who loves tinkering with their 'Mech a lot, but personally I'd rather have that than seeing some ridiculous monster in a live match.

"Ghost Heat" and JJ shake are both proof that even with normal 'Mechs there will be some players creating seriously broken builds that need adressing to keep the game fun for everyone else, and I'd only expect it to get worse once you allow them to swap hardpoints around.

LordofHats wrote:I'd just have all mechs come stock in IS gear (conversely we could have just screwed the whole Clan tech concept as ultimately pointless and completely left it out of the game). As much as people whine about grinding, they like grinding. it gives them something to do, a goal to achieve. here have a cookie is one of the best rewards a dev can give to keep people playing. So long as the grind is balanced with proper reward people don't mind despite whatever whining might appear.

Okay, this would be something I could live with, even though it would sadden me to see the stylistic differences sacrificed.
Also note that Clan fans would whine anyways because they'd expect to get better stuff just because they're playing Clans, and because of the background. Unfortunately, this is one of those cases where it's just impossible to please everyone, which is why I kind of feel for PGI. Regardless of what option they'd have chosen, they would get flamed. So I consider the current limitations to be the best possible solution, just because anything else (from the ideas I've seen so far) wouldn't work out as well.

LordofHats wrote:And reall, there are no Clan players or IS players. Just players. The arbitrary factionalism is coming from the lore and holds no relevance in this game.

Not sure I can agree here... Yes, the factionalism is a matter of the background, but a large part of the playerbase, especially the tabletop veterans, has subscribed to it simply because a bit of immersion and identification makes the game more fun. You can witness this on the forums in a fairly regular fashion, or sometimes even in a match. Entire units of players are built around this part of the meta, and it's one of the main reasons for why people are so hyped for Community Warfare.
In a basic way, this phenomenon is present even on dakka if you look at the 40k Background Forums, though it is much more established in Battletech due to how the franchise supported such close association and deliberately stimulated a sort of "friendly rivalry" between the players of the different Houses.

--Intermission: Heed the Call of Bushido : Join the Draconis Combine Mustered Soldiery Today--

LordofHats wrote:PGI has made it clear there will be no 'only CLan mech' accounts/players or 'only IS mech' accounts/players.

Did they state this somewhere recently? Do you have a link?
I actually feared as much, but I haven't seen anything official yet.

LordofHats wrote:Not to mention we still ahve no due date for community warfare.

Well, we do have an estimate now at least.

LordofHats wrote:I'll list them for you; No one in their right mind uses Orions. No one uses a Raven that isn't a 3L unless grinding the trees. You hardly ever see Commandos, Trebs, or Cicadas that arn't the X5 or the ECM cada. You rarely see Highlanders that aren't the HM, 733c or 732 and the only stalkers that get used are the Misery and one other. Anyone using an Atlas that isn't the D-DC is either grinding trees or wasting CBIlls. Most of the variants in game see no use because inevitably one or two stand out as just plain better. Hardly anyone uses LRM20's because few mechs have the tubes for them, and the only use for LRM5's is on one Catapult variant that boats them as a pseudo-dual LRM15. No one uses small lasers, and the AC10 is rarely used either. Flamers are lol weapons and the NARC gets shunned because the tag is better anyway.

Not true - at least not reflecting my own experiences and the knowledge of what my buddies are piloting. Whilst there is a clear trend towards some very specific models (as you have in any game), I think it would be biased to just assume that any other 'Mechs are just used to grind proficiencies rather than simply because they enjoy a particular loadout (AC20 Raven anyone?), or because they do not subscribe to a "must win" mentality and thus do not gravitate towards efficiency alone.

Guess what, I myself am using a Jenner-K to great success, my Centurion has 2 LRM5s, my Catapult has Small Pulse Lasers, and my Dragon-5N has a Flamer (which once even allowed me to outbrawl an Atlas in CC by causing him to shut down). The Dragon even had an AC10 for a rather long time until I switched to the LBX, and on average I even made more damage with the AC10 on the CN9-A than on my PPC-carrying CN9-AL, though I prefer the latter for its style.

Yeah, yeah. Maybe I'm just not the most efficient player - yet I cannot be the only one who plays MWO this way, and both my Win/Loss as well as Kill/Death ratios are still positive so apparently I don't suffer too much from my choices. All I can say is I'm having fun the way I play this game. Maybe if others wouldn't be so focused on optimisation they would too.

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
http://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/145494-free-7-day-premium-time/

Wow, really? Trying to buy your own players out of being angry?

 Lynata wrote:

Frankenberry wrote:The clan prices are insane, the original MW Mercs had a 'mech library three times the size of MWO for fifty bucks. AND it came with competitive online play that didn't force you to spend money in order to advance.

Sorry, but I just can't get such comments. There isn't a single 'Mech you cannot get for in-game currency - all you can purchase for money are customisation options, stuff you can buy for c-bills anyways (with early access for 'Mechs), and "Hero" variants with a c-bill reward bonus. What exactly are you "forced" to spend a single buck on to advance? Anything you can buy is either decoration or just a way to shave off some time from the grind (if you really think it's a grind rather than fun).

Frankenberry wrote:Of course if PGI does what I think they'll do, they'll leave just ignore that and NOT stick to the story because of the collective butthurt that'd deploy because of the sudden loss of Rasalhague and DC territory.

Just like the collective butthurt from Clan players if PGI were to restrict their numbers to the canon pilot ratio?
Please, let's not forget that this game is supposed to be fun for everyone, not just for the guys jumping on the Clan bandwagon.

I've criticised the devs myself in the past for some controversial ideas (such as the way they implemented ECM, which I still think sucks), but I have zero understanding for rants like the above, as popular as they may seem. -_-

[deadpan]No one is forcing anyone to do anything.[/deadpan] I havent spent a dime on this game and I own two 'mechs, of the same chassis. Unless you're running a consistent four-twelve man drop or somehow lucked out and spent credits on a decent heavy, you can't make cash at the rate you need it to be in order to get the mech you want in anything short of a month. You 'need' to get a hero mech and premium time to grind through matches just to even see about piloting something else, and you also 'need' MC in order to own more than 4 mechs.

They're going on an on about community warfare, why not force people who want to go the overpowered route to suffer the consequences? Pretty sure Inner Sphere mechs beat Clanners on a regular basis in the fluff, it's hard, but they do it. I also didn't rant, I pointed out the truth. PGI has categorically refused to take the route of intelligent responses for uncomplicated issues. Hit box issues? Constant bugs? They didn't even release a complete game! Free to play or no, they received an ENORMOUS amount of support via kickstarter and the untold thousands of people who preorder and buy MC. The way they treat releases and various other updates is just...I can't get it.

 Soladrin wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
http://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/145494-free-7-day-premium-time/

Wow, really? Trying to buy your own players out of being angry?

my thoughts exactly

also, wants everyone's plans after all this gak has died down, we have clans and we've got (metaphorically know, cant get too far ahead of ourselves ) CW, almost like where you see yourself in 1 year in MWO, I hope to be rolling a Uller F(I wish I had the money for a gold one love the idea of it being a khan mech! hell I got the money but seriously 500? hell no) and Clan jade falcon as my faction

Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

 Soladrin wrote:
Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

ehhhh, the adder?

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:
Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

ehhhh, the adder?

Never liked it.

 Soladrin wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:
Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

ehhhh, the adder?

Never liked it.

hehe

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:
Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

ehhhh, the adder?

Never liked it.

hehe

And don't forget, since clan mechs will use a fixed engine, you probably expect them to carry the ones listed on in the official rules, looking at Sarna, adder comes with a 210XL. This means your in a 35ton light with only 97km/h. That's simply a walking target.

 Soladrin wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:
Kitfox is the only clan mech so far I even have an inkling of interest in. I'm a star adder man. I probably won't be happy till I get a blood asp.

ehhhh, the adder?

Never liked it.

hehe

And don't forget, since clan mechs will use a fixed engine, you probably expect them to carry the ones listed on in the official rules, looking at Sarna, adder comes with a 210XL. This means your in a 35ton light with only 97km/h. That's simply a walking target.

but according to pgi and saran itll carry a heavy mech load of weapons!

Frankenberry wrote:Unless you're running a consistent four-twelve man drop or somehow lucked out and spent credits on a decent heavy, you can't make cash at the rate you need it to be in order to get the mech you want in anything short of a month.

And that is a problem .. why?
If you want it faster, play more than two matches per day.

Or simpy do as I do and ... just play and have fun. Don't go at it with a "I NEED DIS" mentality - unless you're willing to pay for it and actually support the game which you apparently enjoy well enough to have you "need" something.

Frankenberry wrote:You 'need' to get a hero mech and premium time to grind through matches just to even see about piloting something else

That you put the "need" into paranthesis at least signifies that you yourself don't buy that argument.

Frankenberry wrote:and you also 'need' MC in order to own more than 4 mechs.

Because you "need" to own more than 4 'Mechs? And because you "need" to keep any 'Mech you already have, even though you are apparently in dire need of c-bills, which you could get from selling them?

Frankenberry wrote:They're going on an on about community warfare, why not force people who want to go the overpowered route to suffer the consequences? Pretty sure Inner Sphere mechs beat Clanners on a regular basis in the fluff, it's hard, but they do it.

Multiplayer games tend to not feature plot armour the likes of which is at times granted to the protagonists of a novel. The Inner Sphere eventually won out over the Clans due to sheer attrition, because the Clans had zero experience with the total war they kicked off, and because the Clans were sabotaged from within - both due to internecine rivalries as well as their honour-bound duel rules (which to a lesser degree also hampered the DCMS).

Also, I don't quite get what exactly you are proposing here. You say Clan players should "suffer the consequences for going the overpowered route", immediately followed by placing the entire burden on individual IS pilots to just play better than the opponent because "it's hard, but they can do it"?

Wouldn't mind a Thor honestly, or a Mad Cat...but i'm not dropping the insane amounts of cash for just one mech.

I'm still trying to get the c-bills together to Elite out my centurions.

double post

 Lynata wrote:

Frankenberry wrote:Unless you're running a consistent four-twelve man drop or somehow lucked out and spent credits on a decent heavy, you can't make cash at the rate you need it to be in order to get the mech you want in anything short of a month.

And that is a problem .. why?
If you want it faster, play more than two matches per day.

Or simpy do as I do and ... just play and have fun. Don't go at it with a "I NEED DIS" mentality - unless you're willing to pay for it and actually support the game which you apparently enjoy well enough to have you "need" something.

Frankenberry wrote:You 'need' to get a hero mech and premium time to grind through matches just to even see about piloting something else

That you put the "need" into paranthesis at least signifies that you yourself don't buy that argument.

Frankenberry wrote:and you also 'need' MC in order to own more than 4 mechs.

Because you "need" to own more than 4 'Mechs? And because you "need" to keep any 'Mech you already have, even though you are apparently in dire need of c-bills, which you could get from selling them?

Frankenberry wrote:They're going on an on about community warfare, why not force people who want to go the overpowered route to suffer the consequences? Pretty sure Inner Sphere mechs beat Clanners on a regular basis in the fluff, it's hard, but they do it.

Multiplayer games tend to not feature plot armour the likes of which is at times granted to the protagonists of a novel. The Inner Sphere eventually won out over the Clans due to sheer attrition, because the Clans had zero experience with the total war they kicked off, and because the Clans were sabotaged from within - both due to internecine rivalries as well as their honour-bound duel rules (which to a lesser degree also hampered the DCMS).

Also, I don't quite get what exactly you are proposing here. You say Clan players should "suffer the consequences for going the overpowered route", immediately followed by placing the entire burden on individual IS pilots to just play better than the opponent because "it's hard, but they can do it"?

Awesome! An English lesson.

1. No one is saying you have to buy a hero mech, I merely pointed out that unless you want to wait, that's the only route left to you. You have to grind the c-bills to get the mech and if you want to do anything with it you have to grind almost the same amount as the mech to upgrade it. In comparison to EVERY OTHER MECHWARRIOR GAME IN THE HISTORY OF THE FRANCHISE this is a new thing.

2. I don't buy that argument. I don't want to spend thousands of dollars, I just want to be able to compete with the rest of the players I drop against. Grinding while using trial mechs is not an effective way of helping my team, or my regiment.

3. Again, no one is saying that you need to own four mechs. I pointed out that in order to own more than four, you need to spend real-world cash, which no matter which way you look at it, is lame.

4. This isn't some random FPS that doesn't have a backstory or history to consider, true that doesn't mean they can adhere to everything. But when you involve something as big as the Clans are, I think extra effort is required to truly bring out a complete experience. The consequences of being overpowered is in reference to the different unit sizes when compared to IS unit breakdowns; better equipment, smaller units. The Inner Sphere units would have the numbers, and I don't care who you are, three heavy/assault lances against one to two stars is an even fight.

The point I think you're missing is that while PGI has laid the groundwork for a potentially awesome game, they haven't bothered to actually completely fix anything. Issues that plagued beta are still in effect, and people's responses of "It's free to play, give the dev's a break!" is just crap. Again, they've received how much money from Kickstarter? How much money from MC purchases and mech pre-orders? A free to play game that makes an asston of money while still in Beta only to release it's final product with game-breaking issues is just sad.

 Lynata wrote:
]Did they state this somewhere recently? Do you have a link?
I actually feared as much, but I haven't seen anything official yet.

It's made obvious by the fact that the mechs from the Invasion pack are stated to be added to your account. no make a new account to be a clanner or anything.

And again, why would anyone want 2 accounts for one game?

EDIT: Also, there's a reason why you'll see between 4-6 Jeagermechs in almost every match you play and hardly ever see a Quickdraw.

Something about the clan splash page makes me feel ill. Every time I start the game I see that pic of the madcat and know that they wont be here till june makes me sic. I don't think i can look at that screen anymore. I think i'm going to take a break from mech for a few months. Don't want to really but I feel like i have played the same match over and over for two years now. I know they added skirmish but it feels just like assault to me. Back to the Elite beta i go.

Frankenberry wrote:Awesome! An English lesson.

Yes, I'm beginning to think we are having a miscommunication here, too. Because it sounds as if you just want everything without paying a cent, yet surely everyone agrees that this is not the way F2P works, and indeed cannot work.

Everything you have listed is convenience. Faster c-bill gain, faster 'Mech purchase, more than 4 garage slots, ... it's all convenience. Every dollar you put into the game gets you nothing but convenience. You don't "need" convenience.
And because this goes for every single player out there, you remain competitive even when not spending a buck. No, the matchmaker does not put players with "cheaper" 'Mechs all in one team and players with high-end 'Mechs into the other to enforce an unfair game. The matchmaker looks at your statistics, regardless of how much money you spent, and then puts together a team that ideally has a fifty-fifty chance at winning, though communication and tactics will quickly change these odds in one way or the other.
Actually, the matchmaker even puts new players into a separate queue for a while so that they can grind their Cadet Bonus for their first own 'Mech with other new players rather than being thrown into a match where both sides may also have a number of veterans with completely tweaked-out 'Mechs.

But here's another idea: If you dislike the concept of F2P, you could alternatively try to think of it like any game you pay for once, and just purchase MC for a value equal to that of a contemporary game to get exactly the 'Mech you want to pilot. For 40-50 bucks, I'm sure you could get any Hero 'Mech. With camo, paints and cockpit items, even.

Frankenberry wrote:This isn't some random FPS that doesn't have a backstory or history to consider, true that doesn't mean they can adhere to everything. But when you involve something as big as the Clans are, I think extra effort is required to truly bring out a complete experience.

Exactly, which is why I'm not really fond of LordofHats' idea to just give everyone the same stuff.

On the flipside, however, I would also consider a 5:12 with even chances of victory a ridiculously unfun game, because communication would give the smaller unit further advantage, and IS 'Mechs dying faster would lower their fighting strength quicker than it would be possible in the reverse.
10:12 on the other hand, here you'd have my vote, and as I said before I think this would have sufficed to balance the equipment disparity - together with minor tweaks such as PGI's idea of giving Clan lasers more heat or a higher cooldown in exchange for the damage and range buff.
It'd be a hell of a job to balance this, but I think it would have been worth the effort, and I'm sad this is apparently not what we'll eventually end up with.

Frankenberry wrote:The point I think you're missing is that while PGI has laid the groundwork for a potentially awesome game, they haven't bothered to actually completely fix anything.

I'm not "missing" it, I just don't feel the same way. As I said, I start the game with a different mentality - maybe that's why I seem to have so much more fun, in spite of occasionally nagging about some very few things I'll likely never change to detest.

LordofHats wrote:It's made obvious by the fact that the mechs from the Invasion pack are stated to be added to your account. no make a new account to be a clanner or anything.
And again, why would anyone want 2 accounts for one game?

Sure, no new account, but I would have hoped that Clan/IS faction choice - once it becomes available - basically locks you into the appropriate selection of 'Mechs for as long as you're a member of that faction. I don't like the idea of seeing both types of 'Mechs on both sides - not in the 3050s at least - and would much prefer the lesser evil of seeing Clanners joining an IS faction, or IS pilots joining a Clan, for at least this you can justify with a bit of background (Wolves Dragoons being a premiere example, or the Clan practice of taking enemy pilots as Bondsmen, or offering themselves as Bondsmen if captured).

This would also completely circumvent the need for 2 accounts. Unless you really want to play for 2 factions simultaneously.

But I guess we'll have to live with the idea that IS/Clan 'Mechs on the other side are battle salvage. Still possible, though way too early in the timeline, and hence not my preferred choice. Not to mention that this lowers the distinguishing appearance of each faction.

(I also don't see Jagers that often - there's one or two in every match, but I can safely say I've not seen the numbers you seem to have encountered)

Deathshead420 wrote:Back to the Elite beta i go.

You've already got access?! Ffffff-

/jelly

Back to the Elite beta i go.
You've already got access?! Ffffff-

Its in alpha right now.

After I dodged the x rebirth game after reading about how bad it was, I had the 60$ extra handy.

@Lynata: If you're content with less, that's fine. I don't see how my complaints are invalidated just because you disagree.

On topic however, has anyone been running a Thunderbolt? I've been looking them over for awhile now and I'm wondering if they're a worthwhile heavy. I tend to be in favor of the laser boats, and I've heard that the SS variant is something to consider.

To shift gears, I adore the way the Thunderbolt handles and fights! The S seems to be possess, nay, flaunt, that most precious of qualities in a mech- scrappiness. I feel able to attack constantly in some fashion and suck up obscene amounts of damage. I can't wait until I get it mastered.

Well, I got all the mastered and I have to say, slapping a gauss rifle and 3 ER large on it works wonders.

6ML and a LPL also work.

(I also don't see Jagers that often - there's one or two in every match, but I can safely say I've not seen the numbers you seem to have encountered)

One of them may or may not be mine

I definitely see them more often than any other 65 Ton heavy (usually the DD and FB variants too). Only Heavy I see as often is the Cataphract and occasional Dragons and Catapults.

On topic however, has anyone been running a Thunderbolt? I've been looking them over for awhile now and I'm wondering if they're a worthwhile heavy. I tend to be in favor of the laser boats, and I've heard that the SS variant is something to consider.

TBolt it a solid mech. Good hit boxes, good hard point lay out, room for several builds.

I haven't used mine in awhile but I run 2 AC5 (or it might be an LBXAC), 2 SRM4, and 3 MLasers. Great torso twister with solid speed.

http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=115&l=3efe668098dd9f5b0debbecd0d4f054c3e2f4966

Just came up with this for a TBolt SS, thoughts?

is this a good splatcat build? http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=13&l=089828527f1239c7426388687e10f2b8e8f10a8c