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Just recently jigged up this list as me and my mates are getting into 40k rather largely since 6th came out, I started working on an IA Tyrant's Legion list as I enjoy true scaling marines, but wanted to use guard with them (to sort of show off the marines stature and for fluffy fun), but when I saw allies where coming out in 6th, I continued modelling the same, but started changing options to using Codex: IG, and Codex:SW (mainly for the resolute line holding of the Hunters, and the ability to take 2 HQs per slot and dump them in guard squads to sort of act like Legion Centurions), which worked well with the image of the Tyrant's Legion..


A massive thanks in advance.

Primary Detachment of Guard:
HQ (90pts)
Company Command Squad (90pts)
Astropath , Autocannon

Troops (485pts)
Platoon Command Squad (30pts)

Infantry Platoon (225pts)
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher


Veteran Squad (95pts)
Autocannon , 3x Grenade Launcher , 4x Lasgun

Veteran Squad (165pts)
Autocannon , 4x Lasgun, 3x Meltagun
Chimera (55pts)
Heavy Bolter, Multi-laser

Fast Attack (130pts)
Vendetta (130pts)
3 Twin-linked Lascannons

Heavy Support (450pts)

Leman Russ (150pts)
Heavy Bolter

Leman Russ (150pts)
Heavy Bolter

Ordnance Battery (150pts)
Griffon (75pts)
Heavy Bolter
Griffon (75pts)
Heavy Bolter

Astral Claws (wovles) detachment:

HQ (220pts)
Rune Priest (110pts)
Bolt Pistol, Chooser of the Slain , Jaws of the World Wolf,
Living Lightning, Power Armour, Runic Weapon
Wolf Priest (110pts)
Bolt Pistol, Crozius Arcanum, Fang of Morkai,
Power Armour, Saga of the Hunter , Wolf Amulet

Troops (405pts)
Grey Hunters Pack (200pts)
Drop Pod , Meltagun , Meltagun, Wolf Standard

Grey Hunters Pack (205pts)
Drop Pod , Plasma Gun , Plasma Gun, Wolf Standard

Heavy Support (115pts) (happy to swap out for a pred with lascannons)

Long Fangs Pack (115pts)
Squad Leader
M/L Longfangs x4

Aegis Defence line w/quad cannon (100pts)

The list is essentially on a non KP mission, the marines drop in hold out on objectives with russ and griffon fire support, while a vet squad comes tearing up to help reinforce/pop tanks, get the vendetta to come in on +2 on turn 2 to pop some more armour, after armour is gone, 4 pieplates a turn + multiple Autocannon rounds from alot of squads should help.. Also a 20 man stealthy fearless blob with the wolfpriest.. Command Squad sits on Aegis with BS4 interceptor rounds.

Now looking at it I realise I'm really lacking anti AV13+ (aside from vendetta) and I'm not sure how to fix it, the options I thought of was a heavy weapon squad with lascannons with the sneaky LD10 wolfpriest in it, and constantly have it receiving BiD! to knock out any big nasty tanks. Also you may suggest a Manticore instead of the 2 griffons, I tried a manticore a few times and didn't have much luck with it, I also figured it's really only going to be good helping me insta-kill nob-bikers, paladins and nid warriors and better at anti vehicle also, but I've just found the griffons to be more reliable (with scatter reroll), and they're just as effective at killing T3 units and single wound T4 units as the Mantiocre (+2 to wound, then armour save (or not)). I'm not sure what you'd advise there...

Thanks in advance,

Cheers,
Nick

Edit: Removed upgrade costs, fixed long fangs..

I would be really interested to hearing more on this list as I have wanted to do a similar thing for a while, but unfortunately don't know enough to give you proper advice.

You need to remove the point values for all of the upgrades an just put the point value of the unit. Otherwise, GW's lawyers will shut Dakka down.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't see the point of giving the wolf priest Saga of the Hunter. You want him to be leading one of your GH squads, but they're in drop pods and won't be outflanking right?

Also don't think the ADL is necessary. You've got the vendetta to protect you from flyers.

 Grugknuckle wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't see the point of giving the wolf priest Saga of the Hunter. You want him to be leading one of your GH squads, but they're in drop pods and won't be outflanking right?

No dude. His grey hunters are 10 man strong. That's max fit for a SW pod.

He plans to blob his guard platoon, attach Wolf Priest with saga for stealth and plant behind aegis for a 3+ cover save.


Also, OP, you either wrote the Fangs wrong or you did points wrong. Fangs should be 90 as written. Or Squad Leader + 4x Missiles at your points value. I'm not calculating the list to see which you meant.

Emp. wrote:

No dude. His grey hunters are 10 man strong. That's max fit for a SW pod.

He plans to blob his guard platoon, attach Wolf Priest with saga for stealth and plant behind aegis for a 3+ cover save.

Ok...But the problem is that the Wolf Priest won't confer preferred enemy to the guard platoon - per the SW FAQ, the Oath of War only works on units from Codex : Space Wolves - so attaching him to the guard blob is wasting that awesome feature of the wolf priest. Essentially, he's paying 110 points for a character just to get a 1 better cover save? Not at all worth it.

My suggestion was to drop one grey hunter and attach the wolf priest. I didn't think it was necessary to say that of course you'd have to shrink the squad size so that they can both fit in the DP. Alternatively, you could lose the drop pod and use Saga of the Hunter to outflank the Wolf Priest AND the Grey Hunter squad.

Hmmm, you raise a very good point mate. But yeah never really envisioned the priest elsewhere than the blob (doing it for fluffy/modelling reasons haha), so you've got a point there, would I be better off with a WGBL with SotH to stealth up the blob?

Now to be a pain, the list needs to drop to 1500pts, this is what I've masaged so far (had a game against Tau last night with it, and proceeded to kick some fish arse, but I'll probably get pwned by anything else). This is what I've got:


Primary Detachment of Guard:
HQ (50pts)
Company Command Squad (50pts) - (probably should get atleast a HW in there?)


Troops (400pts)
Platoon Command Squad (50pts)
x4 GL
Infantry Platoon (225pts)
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher
Infantry Squad (65pts)
Autocannon , Grenade Launcher


Veteran Squad (155pts)
6x Shotgun, 3x Meltagun
Chimera
Heavy Bolter, Multi-laser (sprint up side and act as threat against tanks, or cuddle up to an objective with the chimera infront..

Fast Attack (130pts)
Vendetta (130pts)
3 Twin-linked Lascannons

Heavy Support (375 pts)

Hyrdar Flack Tank (75pts) - Take on all the skimmers and flyers floating about (negating the skimmer jink is a bloody godsend)
Heavy Bolter

Leman Russ (150pts) - MEQ killing pieplate, also seems to draw alot of fire, snuggle it up behind the ADL also
Heavy Bolter

Ordnance Battery (150pts) - sit out of sight and cause large wound pools
Griffon (75pts)
Heavy Bolter
Griffon (75pts)
Heavy Bolter

Astral Claws (wovles) detachment:

HQ (110pts)
Wolf Priest (110pts)
Bolt Pistol, Crozius Arcanum, Fang of Morkai,
Power Armour, Saga of the Hunter , Wolf Amulet - was currently using to make guard blob super (Fearless, LD10 (for orders) and 3+ due to ADL)

Troops (190pts)
Grey Hunters Pack (190pts) - drop on anything that is causing/going to cause my tanks some hurt
Drop Pod , Meltagun , Meltagun,


Heavy Support (115pts)

Long Fangs Pack (115pts) - whallop armour or infantry
Squad Leader
M/L Longfangs x4

Aegis Defence line (50pts) - allow my guard / tanks to cower behind it, also the tournament we're playing in is allowing it to be 4 lots of 2 pieces, so it becomes alot more usefull..

So that comes in at 1420pts I recon (could be wrong).

Now taking into account of placing the priest with the hunters, would I be better of dropping a hunter, adding a wolf standard, giving the priest a combi-metla (if I can), then getting a wolf guard battle leader to sure up and stealth up a blob squad (or is that a bad idea)?

Last night I used the drop podded grey hunters to keep some broadsides from bothering my tanks, used my griffons against infantry then fired all my AC's into devilfish/hammerheads, aswell as the hydra (paid for itself), the detta came in and popped a d/fish also, whilst the guard blob sat unmolested behidn the ADL. The Leman russ did a good job of IDing crisis suits. So that list worked well there, but I think I'm highly lacking in any ap2 which I imagine is going to cause me grief given the amount of GK players out there...

Thanks in advance again guys..

TheTrans wrote:
Hmmm, you raise a very good point mate. But yeah never really envisioned the priest elsewhere than the blob (doing it for fluffy/modelling reasons haha), so you've got a point there, would I be better off with a WGBL with SotH to stealth up the blob?

I don't think either is worth it just for a cover save that's one better. Look at it this way. How many more guardsmen could you buy with 110 points (the cost of a wolf priest w/ SotH) or even 80 points (the cost of a WGBL w/ SotH)? Then ask yourself how many extra wounds would be saved by a 3+ cover save instead of just a 4+ cover save? I think it would be cheaper just to get more dudes.

Unless of course you're going to add the character to the grey hunters...Then your 110 points is giving that squad a lot more - fearless, preferred enemy, stealth and outflank.

But except for this...I think your list looks pretty tough.

 Grugknuckle wrote:

Ok...But the problem is that the Wolf Priest won't confer preferred enemy to the guard platoon - per the SW FAQ, the Oath of War only works on units from Codex : Space Wolves - so attaching him to the guard blob is wasting that awesome feature of the wolf priest. Essentially, he's paying 110 points for a character just to get a 1 better cover save? Not at all worth it.

My suggestion was to drop one grey hunter and attach the wolf priest. I didn't think it was necessary to say that of course you'd have to shrink the squad size so that they can both fit in the DP. Alternatively, you could lose the drop pod and use Saga of the Hunter to outflank the Wolf Priest AND the Grey Hunter squad.

You miss the point of the squad. Preferred enemy rerolling 1's is not the reason for the priest. He purpose is to fearless and stealth so it can do what it's meant to do; plant and hold.

And don't outflank them that is a horrible idea. Table is 72" across not being hammer and anvil. You cannot assault when you come in and most likely you will be stranded on a side if the opponent just plays middle of the board. That throws away over 200 points.

Emp. wrote:

You miss the point of the squad. Preferred enemy rerolling 1's is not the reason for the priest. He purpose is to fearless and stealth so it can do what it's meant to do; plant and hold.

And don't outflank them that is a horrible idea. Table is 72" across not being hammer and anvil. You cannot assault when you come in and most likely you will be stranded on a side if the opponent just plays middle of the board. That throws away over 200 points.

I did not miss the point of the squad. I'm just pointing out that you're overpaying points. A wolf priest costs 100 points because he gives preferred enemy and fearless to space wolves only. For 10 more points you he'll provide stealth and the ability to outflank. But if you attach him to a guard platoon, all he does is provide stealth and ATSKNF. You could get the same thing for 80 points by taking a WGBL with saga of the hunter. But even then its a waste of points IMO because you could just as easily get 10 (about 10?) more guardsmen for 80 points.

On the other hand, if you attach the wolf priest to a squad of 10 grey hunters with 2 plasmaguns you can decide whether to outflank or not. You probably don't want to out flank unless it's hammer and anvil deployment though. In any case, the Grey Hunters can make maximum use of the Wolf Priests' abilities. Specifically, re-rolling your 1's to Hit (and to wound) with the plasmaguns makes them more effective and less likely to "get hot". Furthermore, it doesn't matter that you cant assault on the turn you arrive because frankly you don't want to - you want to rapid fire and then counter attack + overwatch when they assault you. Don't forget to re-roll your 1's to hit and wound in close combat too.

All of that awesomeness is wasted on the guardsmen. That's all I'm saying.

EDIT : Also don't forget that Space Wolves have acute senses so they're much better at outflanking.

 Grugknuckle wrote:
A wolf priest costs 100 points because he gives preferred enemy and fearless to space wolves only. For 10 more points you he'll provide stealth and the ability to outflank. But if you attach him to a guard platoon, all he does is provide stealth and ATSKNF. You could get the same thing for 80 points by taking a WGBL with saga of the hunter. But even then its a waste of points IMO because you could just as easily get 10 (about 10?) more guardsmen for 80 points.

EDIT : Also don't forget that Space Wolves have acute senses so they're much better at outflanking.

No. Fearless carries over it's only the preferred enemy that the guardsmen don't get. Look at the FAQ.

He has an astropath, so no they aren't better, they are equal.

Any average opponent will be more than 12" from the board edge when he knows you have something outflanking, unless he has a great cover and then just doesn't care about shooting attacks, but even still weight is a quality of its own. Anywho, you are now paying for a 10man squad plus attached Wolf Priest so walk on the side, shoot 2 long range plasma gun shots and 1per model long range bolter shot only to get tied up. You might as well play 200 points under your opponent because what you're doing is throwing away the squad. If you want to make this an effective tactic, you need to drop a grey hunter so that the squad with attached priest is 10, and then you can outflank in a rhino. As per the new 6ed rules, if at least one character has the outflank ability, it confers to the squad and any transport that the character is riding in.

Ok boys, thank you for the in depth back-and-forth about the wolf priest (we'll come back to him) so far against my mates, they've avoided shooting at the blob squad due to its resiliency, thus allowing them to dakka away at multiple things.

No aside from the wolf side of the list (only 3 units), how does the guard side look?(the 1500pt list)

Would it maybe be an idea to give the vet squad demo aswell, to maximize their hit damage?

Cheers,
Nick