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I haven't played an apocalypse game yet, but I've been interested.

First off, is it tied to 5th edition or is it more standalone than that? The reason I ask is that I don't want to spend $60 on a book that will be replaced fairly soon ( as in sometime in the next year, I'm pretty patient ) and I don't want to play 5th anymore.

Assuming it works with 6th edition without too much tweaking, should I get apocalypse, apocalypse reloaded, or both?

Worse, it's based on 4th edition. FW have updated the rules for the various unit types (superheavies, etc) and have a pdf download for 6th, but the core rules for deployment/scoring objectives/etc haven't been updated and you'll probably encounter issues with unit/formation rules that were written for 4th and don't work in modern 40k. For example, references to codex abilities that changed when a new codex was released, or even formations that include units that no longer exist in the most recent codex for that army. FW's IA:Apocalypse books are more recent, so FW units are less likely to be out of date, but the two GW Apocalypse books haven't been updated at all.

On the good side, Apocalypse is intended to be played with house rules anyway, so hopefully you should be able to convince your fellow players to use a reasonable solution for any problems you might encounter.

Anyway, the Apocalypse rulebook contains the main rules for playing an Apocalypse game and some units (FW's 6th update pdf gives you most of the rules, but not all of them), Apocalypse Reload contains only new units/formations, and the FW books (IA:Apoc, IA:Apoc 2 and IA:Aeronautica) contain a lot of new units and some new missions. You'll also find some random formations in the other IA books (related to each book's particular fluff), but I wouldn't bother getting the expensive book just for a formation or two.

Finally, there are no rumors of a new Apocalypse expansion coming out. FW will likely continue to release units that can be used in Apocalypse, but there is nothing that suggests FW or GW will be moving beyond that any time in the foreseeable future.

You'll want both rulebooks, but if you only get 1 get Appocalypse. Its got the basic rules.


Since Appoc is now 2 editions old, you will need to house rule to fill in the gaps.

I reccomend you download the FW superheavy update so you can work those properly in 6th.

Keep in mind that some formations and rules may not work. If they don't. just take the simplest solution and run with it.

Appoc is meant to be casual. Have some beer, grill some burgers, have fun and blow up.

The main thing to remember is that while designed for 4th edition, the entire Apocalypse ruleset consists of a single mission (based around holding a few objectives), Strategic Assets (which you'll just have to house rule if they refer to a USR) and Formations (which you'll just have to house rule if you find a Formation referring to something not in a new codex). Formations also aren't actually needed unless you're looking at Superheavies/Gargantuans. It also does not use the Force Allocation Chart.

There's very little to do to organise an Apocalypse game other than make some rulings on old references in Strategic Assets and Formations, and decide if you want to follow the new method of holding objectives (troop units of any strength, etc) or the 4th edition method (IIRC any unit above 50% strength and undamaged non-dedicated transport vehicles).

It's basically just 40k with a few additions. The biggest issue is, as the game size grows, you need to start clearing more of the day to get the game done, or set up in a location where you can leave it set up for playing on a second day.

Apocalypse is my favorite way to play 40k. Big games are always really fun to me, so I wholly recommend you pick up the book. As was said above, the rules are a bit dated, so be prepared to do some major house ruling, but it is worth a bit of thinking to get your stompas and baneblades on the field.

-cgmckenzie

Thanks for the info.

We may just take a look at streamlining some of the items in 6th that take the most time until GW decides they want to update it.

It's not so much about using super heavies, but rather being able to play a game with around 7k points a side. Although I have my own table in the garage, I don't want a large game to to take an hour per player turn.

Best is to decide on time limits for each side (usually we take 30 mins per side, with 5 mins 'thinking time' beforehand) and have enough people per side so they can work on different parts of the battle at the same time.

With a break in between for lunch you can finish even huge battles (20-30k points per side) in a morning + afternoon.with just 6-8 people.

Stratagems are a bit hit and miss, some are useless now and others (Flank March) severely unbalance it. We don't often use them, although the Vortex Grenade is always fun.

Apocalypse is not competitive in any fashion. Don't play it if you're looking for a fair and balanced game. It's only worth playing if you like seeing a bunch of stuff all die at once and don't care that it was your stuff (which some people do enjoy).

clively wrote:
It's not so much about using super heavies, but rather being able to play a game with around 7k points a side. Although I have my own table in the garage, I don't want a large game to to take an hour per player turn.

Well, Apocalypse does nothing to streamline the game like this anyway. Slow parts of the game are still slow. It's just a new mission and suggestions on how the studio guys play it. So playing Apocalypse for big games isn't going to give you your desired effect. There are mostly just suggestions on how the studio have decided to play large games, but nothing actually set as rules.

clively wrote:
We may just take a look at streamlining some of the items in 6th that take the most time until GW decides they want to update it.

Suggestion: start with wound allocation. A house rule I've seen in some of the games I've played in is that you just roll saves and remove your choice of models. Sure, it means that the sergeant/melta gun/whatever always dies last, but in a huge game it really doesn't make much of a difference in the final outcome and it saves a lot of time over the 6th edition method.

It's not so much about using super heavies, but rather being able to play a game with around 7k points a side. Although I have my own table in the garage, I don't want a large game to to take an hour per player turn.

Honestly, Apocalypse isn't much fun without the big stuff. I guess you can do it, but without all the things that makes Apocalypse special why not just play three simultaneous 2k games?

Also, get used to the idea of an hour per player turn, as that might be on the low side for a 7k game where nobody has any superheavies. The expensive stuff is what lets you play at high point levels, by taking up a lot of points for something that rolls fewer dice than the average infantry unit.

Of course Appoc may not be as much fun without lots of little stuff too.

Its kinda silly when one side is nothing but 2 dozen baneblades.

Not that silly is bad, but if what you want is an upscaled 40k game...


I think a good rule of thumb is no more then 40% of your side's total points be in super heavies. Plenty of grunts to hold objectives and get slaughtered by the big boys.

I play quite a bit of Apoc under 5th and now 6th, and it tends to be more fun than standard games. With many of the games being 20k to 40k per side there are some oddities that pop up

1. Time - Setting time limits for each side's turns are common. Often you will give extra time to turns 1 and 2 because there is so much on the board.

2. pts per player - While its easy to balance sides, you want players to generally have a similar amount of work to do. If 1 guy bring 18k and the other guy brings 2k on the same team, the 2k guy will be BORED waiting for all the other guys actions. Most games keep individuals between 5k and 10k each.

3. Drop the or limit strategems - While many can be used to 'balance' a pts difference in sides you are better off not using them. Many of them tend to either slow down the game or get lost in the shuffle of the game.

4. Add pre-arranged random destructive events - Have radom orbital strikes hit the table, it helps clear off the clutter. Less on the table speeds up the game. 4 orbital strikes that must drift 5d6" every turn or an occasional vortex grenade can spice it up.

5. Have fun - It's going to be a long day and if anyone gets a nasty attitude it can really put a damper on the experience. Normal games don't last that long so the actual logistics of playing the game change quite a bit.

I find that the Forge World Imperial Armor Apoc 6th faq does a good job of updating things to work in 6th. At least for the basic rules part.

Give it a look

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/a/apoc6thupdate.pdf