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Ok thanks to the new Look out sir rules i have found a use for flayed ones sort of.... lol

now we all no Flayed ones are deffinetly the most useless thing in the Necron codex but they are cheap and when in numbers can be abused as look out sir fodder for a C'tan Shard used as a character killer. I dont often do this but in fun games i use my C'tan Shard as a Character hunter with Gaze of Death and time's arrow however most times i get shot down with no problems by my opponent which indeed sucks but then i thought hey what if.... and now withe a unit of maybe 10 flayed ones with him look out sir basically give me 10 wounds worth of useless models to soak up fire while i hunt down my enemies character. Its not all really tournament worthy but for fun its worth 130 points to make your opponents laugh and go Flayed ones wtf???? and then be frustrated as hell to see them taken the shots ment for your character hunting C'tan shard of doom!!!!

That is an awesome idea. Now if only you can get your opponent to let the C'tan join the flayed one unit.

First thing that popped in my head too

r-r-r-rules flail

I'm not sure if that works, actually.
The C'tan is not a character, and doesn't LoS work only on characters?

Nevermind, that flaw has been pointed out already.
And wouldn't warriors be better as fodder? I mean, you're sacrificing an elite slot for nothing.

Youd think they would be, simply because they can shoot/overwatch

 KingCracker wrote:
Youd think they would be, simply because they can shoot/overwatch

Yeah, but he's planning on charging with the C'tan, so the fire power of the warriors is kinda useless.
Of course, this is going on his assumption that hte C'tan is an independent character, which is isn't, so either way, this is a very, very bad idea.

Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

Exactly. As I said, what he is proposing is impossible.

And so, the number one most effective tactic for Flayed Ones yet remains:
-leave them on the shelf.

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Even though he is not an IC a shard is still a character so if you deploy him with the unit wouldnt he still beable to join it???? or am i letting other people get a away with a few things they shouldnt at the gaming club?????? and if not well back to the drawing board to find a use for the worst unit ever.... lol

 TommyPickles wrote:
Even though he is not an IC a shard is still a character so if you deploy him with the unit wouldnt he still beable to join it???? or am i letting other people get a away with a few things they shouldnt at the gaming club?????? and if not well back to the drawing board to find a use for the worst unit ever.... lol

No, Characters cannot join units. ICs can.

Kevlar wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Let's take a look at the only place Monstrous Creatures are mentioned in the IC rules:

BRB pg39 wrote:Independent Characters can join other units. They cannot, however join vehicle squadrons or units that always consist of a single model (such as most vehicles and Monstrous Creatures).

The only mention of MCs is the section given as an example of units that always consist of a single model when talking about what units an IC can join, and even then it says "most" (due to units like the carnifex brood). At no point does it specifically prohibit MCs in general from joining as, or being joined by, an IC on the sheer fact they have the MC type. In most cases you can't do it because: 1) MCs usually are a unit that always consists of one model, and 2) afaik there are no MCs in the game that have the IC rule without another rule specifically prohibiting them from joining other units (see 3rd edition C'tan).

Not being able to join other units is entirely based on lack of the IC rule on MCs and is completely detached from them having the MC type. If the new Chaos codex has a MC that is also an IC, it would be able to join a unit just fine as long as it has no other special rules prohibiting it from doing so.

Well since everyone else already ripped on your idea, I'll rip on your grammar! Use some darn punctuation!

 TommyPickles wrote:
Even though he is not an IC a shard is still a character so if you deploy him with the unit wouldnt he still beable to join it???? or am i letting other people get a away with a few things they shouldnt at the gaming club?????? and if not well back to the drawing board to find a use for the worst unit ever.... lol

Looks like you are getting hood winked. Only "Independent Characters" can join a unit. "Characters" just get the "Precise *" perk and if they are upgrades or otherwise purchased as part of a unit a 4+ LOS!

 Maelstrom808 wrote:


Not being able to join other units is entirely based on lack of the IC rule on MCs and is completely detached from them having the MC type. If the new Chaos codex has a MC that is also an IC, it would be able to join a unit just fine as long as it has no other special rules prohibiting it from doing so.

Go list all the MC's that are IC's please, then orient that fact into what is being said.
I was more referring to 5th, but the point still stands- list IC MC's.

Kevlar wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Feugan

Admiral General Aladeen wrote:

Kevlar wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Feugan

Fuegan is not an MC. He just has a weapon that gives him MC attacks.

 Jihallah wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:


Not being able to join other units is entirely based on lack of the IC rule on MCs and is completely detached from them having the MC type. If the new Chaos codex has a MC that is also an IC, it would be able to join a unit just fine as long as it has no other special rules prohibiting it from doing so.

Go list all the MC's that are IC's please, then orient that fact into what is being said.
I was more referring to 5th, but the point still stands- list IC MC's.

That's not the point.
The point is that there is no rule preventing an MC from joining a unit - rather the lack of there being an MC with the IC rule is what prevents it.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Admiral General Aladeen wrote:

Kevlar wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Feugan

Fuegan is not an MC. He just has a weapon that gives him MC attacks.

As close as your gonna get, ur the one that wanted us to list the impossible.

Admiral General Aladeen wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Admiral General Aladeen wrote:

Kevlar wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:

 Jihallah wrote:
Aren't C'tan MC's anyway? Ye cannot join ye squad even if ye are a IC, as ye are an MC and need a rule like Tyrant guard.

Ye cannot have ye cheese

While he cannot join the squad due to lack of IC status, being an MC has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you may join or be joined. It only matters if one has the IC rule and the other is a unit that does not always consist of one model (and is not a vehicle squadron). Being an MC does not come into play in the slightest.

Yep, doesn't come into play at all, that is why it is specifically mentioned in the independent character rule under which units they can join. Off the top of your head how many monstrous creatures do you know that can join units?

Feugan

Fuegan is not an MC. He just has a weapon that gives him MC attacks.

As close as your gonna get, ur the one that wanted us to list the impossible.

No, no I wasn't. And close does not mean same.

Back to the whole flayed one usage, there are a few options you have available to use them. Not that any of them are great ideas, but here's the few I'm aware of:

Imotekh (sp?)- the obvious one and also the most random, but it does allow you to drop a blob of flayed ones in your opponents backfield due to bloodswarm. The whole point of flayed ones seems to be a tarpit.

Nems on a barge and Obyron in your flayed one blob - this one seems a bit more tactical. Obyron gives your flayed ones some punch and you just fly nems upfield and ghost walk the entire blob to his side.

There are a few iterations of the last one like putting nems and something else in a night scythe but the idea is still the same.

 Jihallah wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:


Not being able to join other units is entirely based on lack of the IC rule on MCs and is completely detached from them having the MC type. If the new Chaos codex has a MC that is also an IC, it would be able to join a unit just fine as long as it has no other special rules prohibiting it from doing so.

Go list all the MC's that are IC's please, then orient that fact into what is being said.
I was more referring to 5th, but the point still stands- list IC MC's.

The end result is the same, but the reasons are not, and that's all I was correcting. Find me a rule that either says MCs can not be ICs, or that MCs that are ICs cannot join units. 5th edition was the same way, and through most of 5th edition there were two MCs that were ICs (Nightbringer and Deciever) and they had to have a special rule in the codex itself to prevent them from joining a unit.

As far as flayed ones go, I've looked and looked, but really with 6th there is almost no reason to take them that something else can't do better/cheaper other than you simply like the fluff/models. The only thing I would use them for in 5th was to outflank to control my opponent's deployment. Without being able to assault now, it makes it almost pointless.

 WhiteWolf01 wrote:


Imotekh (sp?)- the obvious one and also the most random, but it does allow you to drop a blob of flayed ones in your opponents backfield due to bloodswarm. The whole point of flayed ones seems to be a tarpit.

Yeah, I never got that part. Sure, it's cool if they don't land right on top of enemy units, but as soon as they deepstrike, you now have a uni of FO standing right in rapid fire range. Furthermore, you are likely to get assaulted anyway and lose on the bonus attacks for attacking first, further reducing their chances to successfully take the enemy unit down.

Meh. If only they were bigger / heavier models so that you could use them as paperweights.

I mean they do have infiltrate too...so you could stick them down in some ruins close to the enemy and potentially out of sight. But yeah, a real lackluster unit...wraiths blow FOs out of the water. The only thing FOs got on wraiths is RP. I wish FOs could assualt out of DS or reserves, that would make them far better imo.

They didn't change the whole special rule loss to ICs when they join a unit with infiltrate? I've never had to look it up yet and my book isn't on hand. That is, you can't infiltrate if you stick an overlord with them.

Also, with Nems, you can give them CA, which could be nice.

 WhiteWolf01 wrote:
I mean they do have infiltrate too...so you could stick them down in some ruins close to the enemy and potentially out of sight. But yeah, a real lackluster unit...wraiths blow FOs out of the water. The only thing FOs got on wraiths is RP. I wish FOs could assualt out of DS or reserves, that would make them far better imo.

They didn't change the whole special rule loss to ICs when they join a unit with infiltrate? I've never had to look it up yet and my book isn't on hand. That is, you can't infiltrate if you stick an overlord with them.

Also, with Nems, you can give them CA, which could be nice.

Actually if you go by the letter of the Infiltrate rule you can't stick an IC with them at all (for deployment) if they don't also have infiltrate. You can, obviously, join an IC to them mid-game.

Thanks, that is what I thought. Basically they are a distraction unit either way. Next time I get a game in I wanna try them out regardless, just to see how they'll perform in-game.

I've used them once before with Obyron, but it was an odd game. Obyron was called away from the squad and they got stuck in with a lonely Draigo, who refused to fail a single armor save...basically it was a bad example of what they can do, at least I hope.

It seems to me that Flayed Ones are there so that the Necrons had access to one Infiltrating/outlflanking unit. On that note they really are only useful if you have a local opponent who regularly shows up with a unit that Infiltrating/outflanking is a good counter for.

I'd rather say that GW did not want to eliminate 2 former codex units at once after killing the Pariah (I still have NO CLUE why though...) and thus they carried them over.

The fact that they are the least points-effective squad in the entire codex with a cost of ridiculous 35€ (!) for FIVE (!!!) models is another sign for GW having no idea what they're doing.

Seriously, if there was at least 1 proper competitor on the mini market, GW would be bankrupt in a few months.