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The idea is that the 3 Chimera's and 55 Guardsmen *should* be enough to survive the first turn until I can attempt to bring out the other guys. I'll be sticking the Chimera's either behind terrain or guardsmen for a cover save, driving them forward to bring the guns to bear as soon as I can. Later on in the game I'll be dropping the suicide PCS's onto enemy held objectives to maybe clear or just contest them, no guarantee's though.
As always, comments, suggestions and ridicule is always welcome.
I would drop two of the storm trooper squads and replace them with Vets (3 Melta and a Demo charge each). That should free you up to play around with things like adding in Marbo.
Storm troopers can be really fun but are a point sink. If you really insist on using them maybe try three squads of five men and give each squad 2 special weapons. I would really like to use more but i just dont have the special weapons. and then those small strike squads will be cheaper in points and not a high priority target because when they deepstrike down and shoot they are in one giant ball just asking for a battle cannon round or demolisher shell to just kill off a huge sink of points. Ive come to realize over timethat the guard is better when cheap and high in numbers lol.
TheNameless wrote: Only two troop choices? I'd much rather take fewer storm troopers and more veterans. Remember, you can give the vets 4+ saves.
There's 4 troop choices there, 2 vets, 2 Platoons (one with 3 IS, one with 2 IS, both PCS with Flamers riding in the vendettas).
Mohoc wrote: I would drop two of the storm trooper squads and replace them with Vets (3 Melta and a Demo charge each). That should free you up to play around with things like adding in Marbo.
If I did that I'd want to throw harker on them so I'd be able to get them where I could use that demo charge, melta guns and melta bombs. That costs the same as the storm troopers, has +1 cover save, but doesn't have AP3 & +4, and when I outflank with them they may be nowhere near where I need them to be. With the storm troopers I'm going to be pretty sure that I'll get those guys within 12" of my target.
How would you suggest deploying them instead? Chimera or vendetta or something?
tankboy145 wrote: Storm troopers can be really fun but are a point sink. If you really insist on using them maybe try three squads of five men and give each squad 2 special weapons. I would really like to use more but i just dont have the special weapons. and then those small strike squads will be cheaper in points and not a high priority target because when they deepstrike down and shoot they are in one giant ball just asking for a battle cannon round or demolisher shell to just kill off a huge sink of points. Ive come to realize over timethat the guard is better when cheap and high in numbers lol.
They cost ~600 points, which is 1/3rd my army, true, but don't forget about the 3 Chimera's full of plasma and 6 AC's at the gunline who'll all be attempting to grab attention.
I think it looks solid to me, not much that I can think that you really need to change. Aside from personal preferences towards play style but don't make much of a tactical advantage
And as platoons split into seperate units you really end up with 9 troop units. That should be plenty
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/03 04:48:45
TheNameless wrote: Only two troop choices? I'd much rather take fewer storm troopers and more veterans. Remember, you can give the vets 4+ saves.
There's 4 troop choices there, 2 vets, 2 Platoons (one with 3 IS, one with 2 IS, both PCS with Flamers riding in the vendettas).
Oh wow, totally didn't see that. Yeah I guess it's a fine list. I kinda like that you have no heavy armor, your opponents' las cannons (or equivalent) won't find any purchase against these guys.
Armored Company since White Dwarf 296 and don't you forget it.
I was looking at the list again and i saw the2 vendettas and thought that was the only anti tank and was thinking wow theres no anti tank but then forgot about the storm troopers. But all in general the list looks good! i want to get more stormtroopers myself just to have that force that deepstrikes behind the enemy.
Looks fine to me. Have you been reading Ailaros's battle reports? hes had some success with his storm trooper lists.
My only worry would be that with only 3 chimeras, they are going to get targeted pretty early on, especially since the storm troopers/veterans wouldnt be coming in till turn 2 or later. But it seems like you've thought about it.
Looks like this list can be very fun, or just all go horribly wrong with some bad dice rolls :p
Have you thought about putting Marbo in there? He would be able to support the storm troopers, blowing a squad up and making room for them. He might actually survive long enough to do more damage since hell be coming on with 3 other storm trooper squads, too much for the enemy to shoot at!
seanm222 wrote: Looks fine to me. Have you been reading Ailaros's battle reports? hes had some success with his storm trooper lists.
My only worry would be that with only 3 chimeras, they are going to get targeted pretty early on, especially since the storm troopers/veterans wouldnt be coming in till turn 2 or later. But it seems like you've thought about it.
Looks like this list can be very fun, or just all go horribly wrong with some bad dice rolls :p
Have you thought about putting Marbo in there? He would be able to support the storm troopers, blowing a squad up and making room for them. He might actually survive long enough to do more damage since hell be coming on with 3 other storm trooper squads, too much for the enemy to shoot at!
Marbo and Stormies will be in on a 2+ with the Astropath.
This looks like a solid list. I would try and drop a few stormies to make space for an ADL to help your infantry survive. They might go running after 1 round of shooting. You could drop 1 trooper from each squad to fit it in. 1 Stormie won't make a lot of a difference but the ADL will really help your platoons' survivability.
Star Trek taught me so much. Like, how you should accept people, whether they be black, white, Klingon or even female...
TheNameless wrote: Only two troop choices? I'd much rather take fewer storm troopers and more veterans. Remember, you can give the vets 4+ saves.
There's 4 troop choices there, 2 vets, 2 Platoons (one with 3 IS, one with 2 IS, both PCS with Flamers riding in the vendettas).
Oh wow, totally didn't see that. Yeah I guess it's a fine list. I kinda like that you have no heavy armor, your opponents' las cannons (or equivalent) won't find any purchase against these guys.
Chimera's become the lasguncannon bait though. Although I may have thought of a workaround...
seanm222 wrote: Looks fine to me. Have you been reading Ailaros's battle reports? hes had some success with his storm trooper lists.
My only worry would be that with only 3 chimeras, they are going to get targeted pretty early on, especially since the storm troopers/veterans wouldnt be coming in till turn 2 or later. But it seems like you've thought about it.
Looks like this list can be very fun, or just all go horribly wrong with some bad dice rolls :p
Have you thought about putting Marbo in there? He would be able to support the storm troopers, blowing a squad up and making room for them. He might actually survive long enough to do more damage since hell be coming on with 3 other storm trooper squads, too much for the enemy to shoot at!
I've read some of his, but his way of writing them, although entertaining, to me, isn't totally clear on their success. His subsequent posts on the matter though has sold me on 30 stormies for the time being, it's just figuring out how to support them whilst keeping home objectives and grabbing theirs.
The 3 Chimera's may be a huge bullet magnet during the first turn, so I though "maybe keep them in reserve, have my guardsmen soak up bullets during the first turn, then have a chance of getting a huge amount of firepower in the second turn". As it stands currently I'll have 6 units on the board (CCS w/ Astro +5 IS), 4 have to be held in reserve (fly boy platoon commanders and Vendetta's), so I can have the storm troopers and Chimera's in reserve...
It's the guard, bad dicerolls is what makes it fun. Marbo may add to that, but I've been sold on the 3* storm troopers. Maybe at 2k point, with double FoC...
Griddlelol wrote:This looks like a solid list. I would try and drop a few stormies to make space for an ADL to help your infantry survive. They might go running after 1 round of shooting. You could drop 1 trooper from each squad to fit it in. 1 Stormie won't make a lot of a difference but the ADL will really help your platoons' survivability.
The RS is a Regimental Standard. If I position my troops in a way I could get rerolls on any morale checks. Thinking about adding a ADL actually. Maybe swap out a CCS for a LC who'll sit on the quad gun or get a comms relay in there...
How about this?
Spoiler:
CCS, RC, AC, Astropath, 105 Lord Commissar, 70 (joined to any IS)
Looks pretty solid. Ive been tempted to put ACs with my vets in chimeras myself, only thing is theyll probably be moving most of the time, so snapshots only for most of the game :/ If you want them to take down flyers with S7 spam then its no biggie.
have you thought about maybe taking the autocannons off of the vets, and putting a quad cannon on the ADL instead? Have the Lord Commissar use it for some BS5+skyfire/interceptor shooting. Muahahaha!
That was an idea I was having when choosing the LC. However if I were to drop the AC's on the vets I'll have to find another 10 point somewhere to put into the quad gun and then I won't have a re-rollable +2, only a +2 reserve roll. I could throw in the icarus lascannon, but only 1 shot in exchange for that re-rollable is not as good.
Not a tremendous fan of the Vendettas. It seems more and more players are anticipating them for every guard army and they bust out the Anti-Aircraft weaponry.
I'd drop a Storm Trooper squad and Vendetta for a kitted out Vanquisher with a hull las cannon and maybe Multi-Melta Sponsons. 6th Edition has given the Vanquisher a menacing potency in that its main turret is S 8 AP 2 w/ Armor Bane (2d6 armor pen and +1 on the damage chart) and three AP1 weapons (+2 on the damage chart). It's a little sturdier than the flimsy Vendetta.
182nd Ebon Hawks - 2000 Points
"We descend upon them like lightning from a cloudless sky."
Va'Krata Sept - 2500 Points
"The barbarian Gue'la deserve nothing but a swift death in a shallow grave."
KplKeegan wrote: Not a tremendous fan of the Vendettas. It seems more and more players are anticipating them for every guard army and they bust out the Anti-Aircraft weaponry.
I'd drop a Storm Trooper squad and Vendetta for a kitted out Vanquisher with a hull las cannon and maybe Multi-Melta Sponsons. 6th Edition has given the Vanquisher a menacing potency in that its main turret is S 8 AP 2 w/ Armor Bane (2d6 armor pen and +1 on the damage chart) and three AP1 weapons (+2 on the damage chart). It's a little sturdier than the flimsy Vendetta.
Don't touch the Vanquisher with a barge pole. Unless you throw Pask or have a Divination psycher standing by, it's not worth the points for something that hits 50% of the time. Vendettas are just better tank hunters than the Vanquisher simply because for 130pts you're getting 3 TL shots as opposed to 1 BS3 joke, and BS3 TL is better than BS4 from Pask. With Pask it gets decent, but then it's an uber specialied unit, at least vendettas can carry troops too.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/04 12:46:00
Star Trek taught me so much. Like, how you should accept people, whether they be black, white, Klingon or even female...
The choice for the vendetta was a balance between "getting 8 scoring flamers down the board somewhere" and "it's well good". I thought about just a normal Valkyrie but then I'd have only the Melta's for anti tank stuff. And we all known that guard works best in redundancy. If I were going to take a LRBT chassis, I'd try to find a way of outflanking some demolishers or something. That'd mean taking Creed which I think would change the whole flavour, having to give him Kell and a foot army worth his orders. And possible Al'Rahem in Chimera's to grab their objectives.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/04 13:22:06
Griddlelol wrote: Don't touch the Vanquisher with a barge pole. Unless you throw Pask or have a Divination psycher standing by, it's not worth the points for something that hits 50% of the time. Vendettas are just better tank hunters than the Vanquisher simply because for 130pts you're getting 3 TL shots as opposed to 1 BS3 joke, and BS3 TL is better than BS4 from Pask. With Pask it gets decent, but then it's an uber specialied unit, at least vendettas can carry troops too.
Anything a Vanquisher Cannon hits it pens thanks to Armor Bane, and with AP2 conferring +1 to the Pen Charts, it is quite lethal to AV14 vehicles. Adding a Hull Mounted Las Cannon and/or Multi-Melta sponsons makes it even more threatening. Ontop of it being a AV14,13,10 with 3 Hull Points makes it alot more durable than the paper airplane jinking around taking a few pot shots.
Its so easy to telegraph a Guard player taking Vendettas its pathetic. A good enemy will have plenty of Anti-Air mounts to deal with them.
The choice for the vendetta was a balance between "getting 8 scoring flamers down the board somewhere" and "it's well good". I thought about just a normal Valkyrie but then I'd have only the Melta's for anti tank stuff. And we all known that guard works best in redundancy.
Which I totally understand, however, its predictable, and having AV14 with your AV12 tanks doesnt hurt...
182nd Ebon Hawks - 2000 Points
"We descend upon them like lightning from a cloudless sky."
Va'Krata Sept - 2500 Points
"The barbarian Gue'la deserve nothing but a swift death in a shallow grave."
I actually like the OP list more than the repost with the ADL, Comm Link and Lord Commissar.
Working from the original, I would drop one PCS and the Plasma CCS, keep the ISs but make it a bigger blob with a Commisar and Add Harker Plasma/Demo Vets.
I like the option to put PCS in a Vendetta, but you don't have to be a slave to symmetry. Also, Harker's abilities are a more reliable troop delivery system to the far end of the board than the Vendetta's Grav Shoot.
"Ignorance is bliss, and I am a happy man."
"When you claim to be a purple unicorn, and I do not argue with you, it is not because I agree with you."
“If the iron is hot, I desire to believe it is hot, and if it is cool, I desire to believe it is cool.”
"Beware when you find yourself arguing that a policy is defensible rather than optimal; or that it has some benefit compared to the null action, rather than the best benefit of any action."
Its so easy to telegraph a Guard player taking Vendettas its pathetic. A good enemy will have plenty of Anti-Air mounts to deal with them.
Which I totally understand, however, its predictable, and having AV14 with your AV12 tanks doesnt hurt...
True on both counts, I'll see what I could get for 260 points, after shuffling some other stuff about.
foolishmortal wrote: I actually like the OP list more than the repost with the ADL, Comm Link and Lord Commissar.
Working from the original, I would drop one PCS and the Plasma CCS, keep the ISs but make it a bigger blob with a Commisar and Add Harker Plasma/Demo Vets.
I like the option to put PCS in a Vendetta, but you don't have to be a slave to symmetry. Also, Harker's abilities are a more reliable troop delivery system to the far end of the board than the Vendetta's Grav Shoot.
The blobs are supposed to be MSU's. I'll be needing stuff with AoE morale buffs, like the standard and LC. With the ADL I also get a convenient re-roll and cover save.
Would you stick Harker in a chimera or hope they'll be ignored when they come on with the Stormies?
Given your intent to deploy MSU, I see why those choices would be preferable.
It's not so much that I think Harker will be ignored as that i think with 3 ten man ST squads up-field, the enemy will not be able to focus fire on him. Also, Vets have options STs don't. While STs have Krak granades, Harker Vets can take Demolitions for Metla-Bombs and a Demo Charge, as well as having 4 other special weapons instead of 2.
"Ignorance is bliss, and I am a happy man."
"When you claim to be a purple unicorn, and I do not argue with you, it is not because I agree with you."
“If the iron is hot, I desire to believe it is hot, and if it is cool, I desire to believe it is cool.”
"Beware when you find yourself arguing that a policy is defensible rather than optimal; or that it has some benefit compared to the null action, rather than the best benefit of any action."
i want to get more stormtroopers myself just to have that force that deepstrikes behind the enemy.
182nd Ebon Hawks - 2000 Points
Va'Krata Sept - 2500 Points
Also, Harker's abilities are a more reliable troop delivery system to the far end of the board than the Vendetta's Grav Shoot.