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Just wanted to know what people's opinion were on a 145 point daemon prince was with pretty much the same stat line ( does not come with the 3+ armour save, might have +1 to their attack).

Pros of the new daemon prince

Giving it wings makes it into a flying monstrous creature
Giving it "marks" (cant really get marks but becomes a daemon of ______ instead, is better then before in my opinion (at least for tzeench which is what my chaos army is).

Demon of Khorne: Hatred (Demons of Slaanesh), Furious Charge
Demon of Slaanesh: Hatred (Demons of Khorne), Rending, Fleet of Foot, runs +3 inches
Demon of Nurgle: Hatred (Demons of Tzeentch), Slow and Purposeful, Shrouded
Demon of Tzeentch: Hatred (Demons of Nurgle), May Reroll all saves of 1

Can take chaos rewards, which are sometimes risky but do different things such as + 1 S etc.
Can buy up to psychic mastery level 3
Can take biomancy, (+ to S, T/ regenerate wounds etc, good for monstrous creatures)


Cons:
145 points
40 point wings
3+ save is an upgrade that costs 20 points
a daemon with a mark, wings and armour is about 230.
Turning into a psyker gets pricey, i think 25 points per mastery level.
As far as the description goes, (unless veterans of the long war give it), it no longer has eternal worrier.


I personally will still use them, but I believe they will not be a staple in chaos lists any more. Just wanted to know what people's opinions where, and also wanted to see if people thought that them being flying monstrous creatures makes them worth the point increase.

Please don't post pics or links to pics of published rules. Thanks! Manchu

Have you seen the statline? It's worth it

Ozomoto wrote:
Just wanted to know what people's opinion were on a 145 point daemon prince was with pretty much the same stat line ( does not come with the 3+ armour save, might have +1 to their attack).

Now they're WS9, I8, and have 5 Attacks. They're definitely more expensive than they used to be, that's true, and their upgrades are more expensive. However they're being priced more inline now that they're Flying Monstrous Creatures. And to be honest, Daemon Princes are pretty underpriced anyway, and they are super undercosted in the 4th edition codex since they could be a Flying Monstrous Creature for like 140 points.

The loss of Eternal Warrior really really hurts it though, and that's going to be the breaking point. Cost isn't huge for me since it's the only thing in the codex that I know of besides the Defiler that has even gotten an increase in points, everything else has had a points decrease so it's not as bad as you would think.

Personally, for my Daemon Prince I most likely won't be taking Powered Armor. It'll be flying most of the time, so it will only get hit on 6's, and it will still have a 5+ invul and 4 wounds. In combat it will wreck basically anything outside of a Greater Daemon. Marines are hitting it on 5's, wounding it on 5's, and it still has a 5+ invul. This is of course assuming that they even survive the initial onslaught! With 5 attacks (6 on the charge), and Veterans of the Long War, you are hitting vs Marines on a 3+, reroll to hit if you miss, then you wound on a 2+. That's about 4 dead marines.

Granted against TH/SS you will have some problems but weight of fire has always been the way to take them down. That being said I have a feeling that a Nurgle Daemon Prince with 3 Mastery levels, 2 of the powers being biomancy and 1 Nurgle, and wings will be super hard to kill since it can have a 3+ jink save in the air, and the biomancy powers are suh-weeet

TL;DR, the cliffs:
->Let's wait until the codex comes out before we judge the Daemon Prince as useless.

You can see the stat lines in those photos?

It's all a bit pricey for my tastes in HQ. It would be fine in higher point games but that'd be a lot of points. You could almost grab a whole Havoc or Noise marine squad for the same cost as the upgrades alone.

By the by, are we being forced to take ACs and such now as if we were SMurfs? I haven't been keeping up on all the rumors but it looked like we purchase a base squad that's set and then pick up more troops and other extras as we go.

Sorry, I know it's not the best thread to bring this up but since the photo were here, thought I'd give it a go.

 purplkrush wrote:
You can see the stat lines in those photos?

Yessir! haha
The full statline is WS:9 BS:5 S:6 T:5 W:4 I:8 A:5 LD:9 SV:5+ (invulnerable)
Since he's Fearless the LD isn't a big deal haha

It's all a bit pricey for my tastes in HQ. It would be fine in higher point games but that'd be a lot of points. You could almost grab a whole Havoc or Noise marine squad for the same cost as the upgrades alone.

By the by, are we being forced to take ACs and such now as if we were SMurfs? I haven't been keeping up on all the rumors but it looked like we purchase a base squad that's set and then pick up more troops and other extras as we go.

It is indeed pricey, but it's powerful.
Also yes, Aspiring Champions now come included in the basic squads, and you are correct in your assumptions. : )

Hmm, you guys do make valid points. My opinion has been swayed. Now do you think twin DP's will be viable even if you would have to pay 500 points (im a tzeench player so there's no way I am fielding one of them without psychic ability's), when before they would have been about 350.

On a side note, basic sorcerers are 60 points. And the power scourge kinda makes my mouth water. Unless I am reading it wrong. To me it sounds like S 8, ap2, regular initiative and drops the opponents ws down. I hope that chaos lords have acsess to that, unless it is for the mauler fiend or helbrute.

On another side note, it seems like you get to pick from the chaos reward thing, if there was a way that you could pick a chaos boon instead of roll before the game starts or something like that for a certain point, then the daemon prince would have the potential for eternal warrior.

As a third side note, does veterans of the long war give preferred enemy to space marines? If so what counts as space marines, im assuming plain, blood angels, dark angels, BT, SW, but what about sisters and grey knights?

Well. Now that all of the metal daemon princes are finecast, They're dead to me.

Daemon princes will always be cool, and I think you'll still see them, even though lords have gotten a decent buff. Previously, you would only take a DP, because lords offered absolutely nothing over them. I'm glad they fixed that, so you don't see these obligatory DPs flying all over the board lashing things.

Looks like Nurgle Warptime DPs will be missed though :<

Another side note: I am a lil' rattled that the forgefiend / mauler fiend were walkers instead of monstrous creatures. To many damn walkers. Although i cant complain because unlike most people on the internet it seems, I am happy with the update/ new models.

Ozomoto wrote:
Another side note: I am a lil' rattled that the forgefiend / mauler fiend were walkers instead of monstrous creatures. To many damn walkers. Although i cant complain because unlike most people on the internet it seems, I am happy with the update/ new models.

Welcome to the internet, enjoy your stay.

Most people on wargaming forums complain about new stuff, i'm not quite sure why.

I'm quite happy with the demon prince price change though, it means people will actually have to make a choice when writing their lists.

 King Pariah wrote:
Have you seen the statline? It's worth it

not when it costs 300 pts.

300 point boat anchor. Won't be fielded in competitive lists. Allied greater demons are more effective and cheaper.

Kevlar wrote:
300 point boat anchor. Won't be fielded in competitive lists. Allied greater demons are more effective and cheaper.

Only time I can think its worth it if you are lucky enough to roll iron arm and have T 6-8, with S 7-9.

Ozomoto wrote:

As a third side note, does veterans of the long war give preferred enemy to space marines? If so what counts as space marines, im assuming plain, blood angels, dark angels, BT, SW, but what about sisters and grey knights?

No, it grants Hatred (Space Marines). Much better.

The first five are confirmed, but why would you even ask about Sisters? They're not Space Marines!

I believe Grey Knights were included.

 Samus_aran115 wrote:
Well. Now that all of the metal daemon princes are finecast, They're dead to me.

But the plastic kit is awesome.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As a Necron player I am happy to hear about the new Daemon Prince. I can't wait to MSS one and then finish it off with Warscythes.

I like it. the Dameon Prince shoudln't be a go-to HQ choice. It should be RARE.

Fluff wise it is a great achievement/honour/curse to be granted daemonhood. havign every army led by a Nurgle or Slaanesh daemon prince was not in the spirit of the game imo.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
As a Necron player I am happy to hear about the new Daemon Prince. I can't wait to MSS one and then finish it off with Warscythes.

And this.