Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I cannot urge you in strong enough terms: avoid Wayland Games.

I have made the mistake of ordering from them twice, had nothing but delays and problems both times, and have come away frustrated and angry both times.

Last year when GW cancelled RoW sales, Wayland put an announcement on their website saying that they intended to keep shipping to RoW no matter what GW said, and were still taking GW orders from RoW, so I placed a GW order. They then held my money for NEARLY A MONTH before cancelling my order saying that they could not ship to RoW.

I decided to give them another chance this year based on their supposedly improved inventory system, upon which I call major and total shenanigans. All of the items I ordered carried the green light icon, which, and I'm quoting them, means "High Availability: If in stock should ship in 1-5 working days, if not then 3-9." After waiting 10 business days (2 weeks) with the items still showing as green lighted but my order still showing as processing, I requested a refund/cancellation so I could get the items elsewhere, and happened to mention in the (epic) DakkaDakka thread "Maelstrom Games: Taking the Biscuit?" that I thought their claims as to order fulfillment timeframe were [akin to something that falls periodically from the back end of the genus Equus, from a spot right below where the vertebral column ends].

While they have not bothered answering my refund request (36-48 hours ago and counting), someone from Wayland appeared on Dakka within minutes to imply that I couldn't read and then, get this: threatened to cancel my order (which I had already asked them to do) and sent me a PM demanding that I retract what I had said because it was obviously my misunderstanding for believing that the nine-business-day turnaround they were advertising meant that they would ship my items within 9 business days.

I won't deal with them again, and given that their staff make a habit of spending time on forums confronting anyone who dares to criticise their inaccurate shipping timeframe claims rather than working to fulfill orders within the promised timeframe, I would recommend that no-one else do so either. I'm sure they'll be here in a few minutes to send me another PM and tell everyone that nine business days doesn't really mean nine business days and that I'm totally wrong.

Thanks for the heads up!

Cross-posting from the Maelstrom thread:

 azreal13 wrote:
Management are within their rights to refuse service at their discretion.

This guy was pretty discourteous, I think this is a measured and polite response.

There is a time to refuse service to a discourteous customer, and that is not after you already accepted their money and they're waiting for you to fulfil your legally binding obligations. Far better in my opinion to just do your job and prove them wrong, and not subscribe to the CMoN school of customer relations.

I've not had any trouble with Wayland, quite the opposite in fact. Back in May I ordered some GW LotR items to a BFPO. They shipped them, but due to a cockup on the forces postal end they got sent back. They offered to ship it again, but fearing the same result I had them hold onto the order until I was able to pick it up while on leave in Aug. Unfortunately when I stopped by on leave the person who knew where my order was was not in, so they arranged to express ship it to a hotel I was staying at a couple days later. I've also placed a couple other orders to my home address in Canada and had no trouble with them.

Though to be honest I never worry to much about how long it takes things to get to me (within reason, say 6 weeks or so), as I have enough of a back log to last me years.

Had problems with it too, mostly caused by the fact that their "in stock" indicators are lying. You can easily order an item which is listed "in stock", and then wait for weeks until they receive it. In my case they promptly replied to all questions and refunded my money as soon as asked, but still, I'm disappointed in that store.

PS: I checked now, and they seem to have new site with extra "in stock" information in addition to the colored circles. Did not tried that, hope it works better now.

Hmm, I tried to get the 8th ed fantasy codex awhile back only to discover the embargo but they had already taken the money from my account before letting me know they couldn't ship. It was about a week before the money came back, although they got in contact with me pretty quickly when I queried it. I'd use them in the future if they could ship GW...oh well, always ebay...

Librariarch wrote:
I cannot urge you in strong enough terms: avoid Wayland Games.

I have made the mistake of ordering from them twice, had nothing but delays and problems both times, and have come away frustrated and angry both times.

Last year when GW cancelled RoW sales, Wayland put an announcement on their website saying that they intended to keep shipping to RoW no matter what GW said, and were still taking GW orders from RoW, so I placed a GW order. They then held my money for NEARLY A MONTH before cancelling my order saying that they could not ship to RoW.

I decided to give them another chance this year based on their supposedly improved inventory system, upon which I call major and total shenanigans. All of the items I ordered carried the green light icon, which, and I'm quoting them, means "High Availability: If in stock should ship in 1-5 working days, if not then 3-9." After waiting 10 business days (2 weeks) with the items still showing as green lighted but my order still showing as processing, I requested a refund/cancellation so I could get the items elsewhere, and happened to mention in the (epic) DakkaDakka thread "Maelstrom Games: Taking the Biscuit?" that I thought their claims as to order fulfillment timeframe were [akin to something that falls periodically from the back end of the genus Equus, from a spot right below where the vertebral column ends].

While they have not bothered answering my refund request (36-48 hours ago and counting), someone from Wayland appeared on Dakka within minutes to imply that I couldn't read and then, get this: threatened to cancel my order (which I had already asked them to do) and sent me a PM demanding that I retract what I had said because it was obviously my misunderstanding for believing that the nine-business-day turnaround they were advertising meant that they would ship my items within 9 business days.

I won't deal with them again, and given that their staff make a habit of spending time on forums confronting anyone who dares to criticise their inaccurate shipping timeframe claims rather than working to fulfill orders within the promised timeframe, I would recommend that no-one else do so either. I'm sure they'll be here in a few minutes to send me another PM and tell everyone that nine business days doesn't really mean nine business days and that I'm totally wrong.

As you have posted publically I will respond publicly.


I PM'd you previously on the other thread to point out that you had perhaps misread our site. In the hope you might realise and retract your previous remarks. The traffic light system as it clearly states on every page of our site is not an in stock status but an availability status. So something could be out of stock but easily available from suppliers. We implemented it as customers wanted an indication of how long things could take. However sometimes things take a few days longer, its the nature of the supply chain in this industry.

You happened to place an order when we were undergoing the most significant changes in the company's history, we did communicate this. It was Monday 8th October that following a 3 day stock check we moved to live stock levels. We put a message on the front of the site to warn that we had a 10 day bedding in period. This was because we also implemented lots of other changes at the same time, we would have a major impact on all sorts of things. All of these changes were announced and constantly repeated every few days on facebook leading up to the change so that our customers knew that we were undergoing some significant changes.

You mentioned in an earlier thread that you had emailed us about your order, and above you mention you have requested a refund. Refunds are promptly actioned, but I mentioned previously emails do not get read as all the addresses we use are unmonitored and they are clearly identified as such. As stated previously we offer support via our helpdesk, the links are in most of our emails and the helpdesk is manned 7 days a week from 8.30am until 6pm. It is not some myth and the people manning it are there to support customers and resolve issues. If you pm me your order number I will make sure your refund is actioned instantly.

Contrast us with the other business you were discussing, that we offer support and discuss openly issues with our customers. We don't profess to be perfect but your attack using rude language on another thread was unwarranted.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jihadnik wrote:
Hmm, I tried to get the 8th ed fantasy codex awhile back only to discover the embargo but they had already taken the money from my account before letting me know they couldn't ship. It was about a week before the money came back, although they got in contact with me pretty quickly when I queried it. I'd use them in the future if they could ship GW...oh well, always ebay...

It does say on each GW product where we can ship them, it annoys us just as much as it annoys you that we cannot ship them to you. But because we have large number of items that we can ship to you guys it is really difficult for us to prevent you adding specific items to your cart. Also it would also have to take into account what you added to cart when you were not logged in and geo located ip stuff can be fooled. The warehouse staff get a daily email of non EEA GW orders and are supposed to action cancellations and refunds. It was much more convoluted and complicated behind the scenes before our recent changes, but now we can split your orders into the items we can send and not and action them far more quickly.

rich1231 wrote:


As you have posted publically I will respond publicly.


I PM'd you previously on the other thread to point out that you had perhaps misread our site. In the hope you might realise and retract your previous remarks. The traffic light system as it clearly states on every page of our site is not an in stock status but an availability status. So something could be out of stock but easily available from suppliers. We implemented it as customers wanted an indication of how long things could take. However sometimes things take a few days longer, its the nature of the supply chain in this industry.

You happened to place an order when we were undergoing the most significant changes in the company's history, we did communicate this. It was Monday 8th October that following a 3 day stock check we moved to live stock levels. We put a message on the front of the site to warn that we had a 10 day bedding in period. This was because we also implemented lots of other changes at the same time, we would have a major impact on all sorts of things. All of these changes were announced and constantly repeated every few days on facebook leading up to the change so that our customers knew that we were undergoing some significant changes.

You mentioned in an earlier thread that you had emailed us about your order, and above you mention you have requested a refund. Refunds are promptly actioned, but I mentioned previously emails do not get read as all the addresses we use are unmonitored and they are clearly identified as such. As stated previously we offer support via our helpdesk, the links are in most of our emails and the helpdesk is manned 7 days a week from 8.30am until 6pm. It is not some myth and the people manning it are there to support customers and resolve issues. If you pm me your order number I will make sure your refund is actioned instantly.

Contrast us with the other business you were discussing, that we offer support and discuss openly issues with our customers. We don't profess to be perfect but your attack using rude language on another thread was unwarranted.

I did not use email. I used your "submit a ticket" system. 2 days ago. And I was firm but polite. And I saw the confirmation page.

There's not a lot of ambiguity in "High Availability: If in stock should ship in 1-5 working days, if not then 3-9." I think I understood that to mean that you'd ship my stuff within 9 business days. And you haven't. Tell me I'm wrong again, please.

You also mentioned that you had sent out an email explaining the delay. I've checked my email, including the spam filter, and no such email ever reached me.

The long and short of it is that if you hadn't strung me along the last time I ordered from you, I would probably have been prepared to cut you a bit more slack this time, but what's the explanation for holding on to someone's money for close to a month and then canceling an order? I have full documentation of all of this, by the way.

Additionally, when you have a reputation for claiming things are in stock that aren't, and then you say that you have a new system in place and that you can ship items in nine business days and then don't, and then come out swinging when someone calls you on it, what it looks like to me is that you're up to your old tricks and being defensive about it.

I was not contrasting you (or comparing you) with Maelstrom (who, for the record, have always done well by me until quite recently and may yet ship my remaining order). I am now comparing you with businesses that don't string me along, and you are not looking too great in the comparison. In any case, "we're much better than the other people who also have a reputation for stringing people along" is hardly a ringing self-endorsement.

And just for future reference, threatening to cancel my order (because you don't like that I dare to criticise you) when I've already asked you to do just that and you haven't bothered is not much of a threat and just makes you look petty.

I have to remark that in this thread you have mentioned that you have emailed/submitted a ticket and asked for a refund? But In your PM to me you state in the last line that you won't tell me your order details as you want to see how long the order takes to ship.

Can you give me your helpdesk ticket ID so that I can let you know what has happened as you don't seem to have received the replies.


I really do not like your use of "string you along" when it is absolutely not the case. You ordered, we are a little slower than normal because of the significant changes going on which we have communicated.

I didnt threaten to cancel, I said I would I would cancel your order, which it seems is exactly what you asked for in the helpdesk ticket you have requested.

I am not arguing with you on a public forum, but I believe you are being unreasonable. Saying you did one thing publically but claiming another in a PM is wrong. Which I give consent for mods to read.

As before sometimes things take a little longer, if you used a free shipping voucher it does state on its terms and conditions page that things might take longer than normal and you ordered around the time of our stock check which we publicised the date repeatedly and its impact
These are not excuses for poor service but when we give so much information to customers well in advance and it is ignored it is incredibly frustrating, as there is not much more we can do apart from turn up in person and see each customer to explain.

We do not have a reputation for claiming things are in stock when they are not, we have only just moved to live stock levels, prior to this there were availability indicators which you have had explained in earlier posts.

rich1231 wrote:

We do not have a reputation for claiming things are in stock when they are not, we have only just moved to live stock levels, prior to this there were availability indicators which you have had explained in earlier posts.

You must live in a fantasy world because you really do have that negative reputation,

I have ordered many times from Wayland with a friend. It was only once that one item took a very long time to ship. But it was the post's problem. They misplaced that one box for some time. But it arrived eventually.
What kind of negative reputation about stock levels? Before this month they didn't even had a stock level meter. I think the problem is at the customers side thinking that the green lights mean, that the item is in stock.

rich1231 wrote:
I have to remark that in this thread you have mentioned that you have emailed/submitted a ticket and asked for a refund? But In your PM to me you state in the last line that you won't tell me your order details as you want to see how long the order takes to ship.

Can you give me your helpdesk ticket ID so that I can let you know what has happened as you don't seem to have received the replies.


I really do not like your use of "string you along" when it is absolutely not the case. You ordered, we are a little slower than normal because of the significant changes going on which we have communicated.

I didnt threaten to cancel, I said I would I would cancel your order, which it seems is exactly what you asked for in the helpdesk ticket you have requested.

I am not arguing with you on a public forum, but I believe you are being unreasonable. Saying you did one thing publically but claiming another in a PM is wrong. Which I give consent for mods to read.

As before sometimes things take a little longer, if you used a free shipping voucher it does state on its terms and conditions page that things might take longer than normal and you ordered around the time of our stock check which we publicised the date repeatedly and its impact
These are not excuses for poor service but when we give so much information to customers well in advance and it is ignored it is incredibly frustrating, as there is not much more we can do apart from turn up in person and see each customer to explain.

We do not have a reputation for claiming things are in stock when they are not, we have only just moved to live stock levels, prior to this there were availability indicators which you have had explained in earlier posts.

You told me you did not want me as a customer and demanded my order number so you could cancel it. I responded that I would find it much more entertaining to let you wonder which order was mine and then post how long it took you to send me my items. I was yanking your chain, and I thought it might help other customers receive items faster if you were placed in the position of having to ship all of your Australasian orders faster. And you can give the mods whatever you like. Apart from my use of profanity in my initial post, for which I have already apologised, I stand behind everything I've said. But since you were obviously not interested in taking responsibility for your own actions yesterday I thought it might be fun to give you enough rope to hang yourself as they say.

I did not use a free shipping voucher. Anything else I can refute? This whole conversation has been you telling me that if I'd done "x" it's my fault, and in each case I have not done "x." You are running out of excuses where I am the bad guy here. Are you now going to claim that because I placed my order when the moon was waxing gibbous it's my fault? Because if so let me stop you right now and point out it was waning crescent.

Sorry if holding you to what you claimed would be the shipping timeframe is unreasonable. I guess I'm unreasonable.

I think that taking someone's money, holding it for close to a month (as last time) and claiming you have sent an email you haven't and then rattling off inapplicable excuses whilst at the same time not refunding an order for 2 days after you've been asked to (this time) fits the definition of stringing me along and I stand by that as well.

Speaking of which, if you do not have a reputation for stringing people along, why was it so easy to find threads with multiple people claiming that you'd done it to them on all of the other forums where I posted the same information about you in the obligatory Wayland complaint thread today? Is the whole world being unfair to you?

And I did not keep the ticket number because I could not at the time envision the hoopjumping I'd be doing to get my money back. I guess that probably means it really is all my fault for being unable to foresee the soaring heights of unprofessionalism to which Wayland Games would be ascending.

Finally, you ARE arguing with me in a public form. And you are not doing very well.

Deep sigh, if you are having trouble with an order, just contact their helpdesk through a ticket. When I had a question about my order I politely asked and hey guess what? I got an answer on the very same day. Sure as hell beats being a jerk.

I too had major problems with their lack of politeness, I made a post on a status of theirs on facebook about their delivery times, to which I was told I had no problems with 2 previous orders.... I'd never ordered from them, after being told over the phone that my order would have a 3-4week wait before sending out. When I called them out on this they deleted my comments then removed me from their facebook page! It seems they lie to make the problem not look as bad as it is, and if you tell people how it is with your own experiences they try and delete any trace of it! Worse then pretty poor imo, I have nothing good to say about their customer service, well, service in general tbh

 BrookM wrote:
Deep sigh, if you are having trouble with an order, just contact their helpdesk through a ticket. When I had a question about my order I politely asked and hey guess what? I got an answer on the very same day. Sure as hell beats being a jerk.

I did that 2 days ago. It was not answered. Hence my "being a jerk."

Kevv6 wrote:
I too had major problems with their lack of politeness, I made a post on a status of theirs on facebook about their delivery times, to which I was told I had no problems with 2 previous orders.... I'd never ordered from them, after being told over the phone that my order would have a 3-4week wait before sending out. When I called them out on this they deleted my comments then removed me from their facebook page! It seems they lie to make the problem not look as bad as it is, and if you tell people how it is with your own experiences they try and delete any trace of it! Worse then pretty poor imo, I have nothing good to say about their customer service, well, service in general tbh

I have no idea who you are but, we make it really clear that we cannot discuss specific orders on Facebook. Its not because we are being secretive, but we have a helpdesk system for dealing with customer complaints and issues. We cannot respond really to order queries on FB as, its a public place and some issues cannot be discussed publicly. For example, and not your issue what happens if a customer complains about a delayed order and we investigate and their card payment has been identified by our 3rd man system as a fraudulent transaction, we cannot post that in public as it would be unreasonable. If we delete or ban users from Facebook, it is only after repeated requests or they have used foul language. Our Facebook page is visited by lots of children and we have to take care, no matter if everyone swears in real life we still have to act to protect them from more adult themed discussion. Its not being rude of us, we are completely open in our communication, hence we posting in places like this etc.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Librariarch wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
Deep sigh, if you are having trouble with an order, just contact their helpdesk through a ticket. When I had a question about my order I politely asked and hey guess what? I got an answer on the very same day. Sure as hell beats being a jerk.

I did that 2 days ago. It was not answered. Hence my "being a jerk."

As mentioned already I can absolutely guarantee if you submitted a ticket it would have been replied to and I can even pull the mail server logs for any time to prove it has been sent they do sometimes get caught by spam filters etc as they have system generated content in. So If you let me know who you are and an email address I will pull out the help-desk reply you have been sent and email it to you directly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I didn't say you did use a free shipping voucher, as I have no idea who you might be or what your order number is.

Regarding your abusive first post, you must understand if you spoke that way to a member of my staff in our store you would be asked to leave. Being online should not mean that you cannot remain civil.

However I did explain that you ordered in our busiest ever time, which we communicated months in advance that it would have some impact. A few days might be frustrating.

But you wont tell me your order number, who you are, ticket number or anything. Excuse me if I think that is unreasonable that you are attacking us without any way of us investigating the situation.

We have 130,000 plus happy customers. But we cannot and do not pretend to be perfect which is the entire point of the large number of changes and improvements we are always striving to make.

Again, you say you requested a cancellation, and in PM said otherwise. As I have no way of knowing who you are if you did raise a ticket it will be actioned. Or will have been already.

On another note the emails did go out. Again, as you wont identify yourself I have no way of investigating why you didn't receive one.

I have now posted a ticket for a second time.

I don't care what you pull as long as long as you do it in private and you don't ignore this ticket like you did the last one.

I'm done arguing with you.

I think your interactions with me have more or less demonstrated to anyone who can read this that everything that everyone else has said about you is spot-on, and I will never deal with your company again. You've certainly taught me my lesson: don't ever give someone a second chance to treat you poorly.

UPAW-703861

Just to clarify, your first ticket was responded to yesterday morning 23 hours ago. It was not ignored. At the end of the reply we sent you were asked to respond with your preference to cancel or ship. As your request asked for both and we wanted your instruction. The ticket ID was TIRR-377776

I will get the other ticket actioned right away.

Librariarch, I feel to see where has rick1231 has done something wrong?
you act like a child.
I had stuff that I waited for half a year, wrote them patiently, and the did say the mailed it, but seems to be lost. I got a refound and a week later it arrived. If you make a tantrum in a forum, it won't help you in my opinion.

rich1231 wrote:
Just to clarify, your first ticket was responded to yesterday morning 23 hours ago. It was not ignored. At the end of the reply we sent you were asked to respond with your preference to cancel or ship. As your request asked for both and we wanted your instruction. The ticket ID was TIRR-377776

I will get the other ticket actioned right away.

Hahahaha. Very funny. I told you if you could ship within the day to do so, otherwise to cancel and refund. YOU NEVER REPLIED, not to EITHER email address you'd been given. I checked both spam filters, and since one was a hotmail and the other a NZ government account, there is no way both got lost unless the problem was on your end. If you have any more misinformation to spread, I will not be reading it.

Librariarch wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
Deep sigh, if you are having trouble with an order, just contact their helpdesk through a ticket. When I had a question about my order I politely asked and hey guess what? I got an answer on the very same day. Sure as hell beats being a jerk.

I did that 2 days ago. It was not answered. Hence my "being a jerk."

Ah yes, anti-social behaviour for the win. Yes, you go lad, show them how it's done!

I don't think I can understand why this shouldn't just be taken to PM. Wayland seems MORE than helpful, and that is actually surprising given your attitude...

 tigerstein wrote:
Librariarch, I feel to see where has rick1231 has done something wrong?
you act like a child.

With the way the thread has gone, I have to agree with tigerstein here. This thread has made me more sure that I'll order from Wayland, not less.

 motyak wrote:

 tigerstein wrote:
Librariarch, I feel to see where has rick1231 has done something wrong?
you act like a child.

With the way the thread has gone, I have to agree with tigerstein here. This thread has made me more sure that I'll order from Wayland, not less.

Yup. It was all just an elaborate PR stunt to drum up business for Wayland. I admit it.

 Gorlack wrote:
I don't think I can understand why this shouldn't just be taken to PM..

Quite.

I hope the issue(s) are resolved to the satisfaction of all concerned.