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Scenario:
In a recent game, a Dark Eldar Voidraven Bomber equipped with a Night Shield and Flicker Field performed a bombing run on a lychguard unit, and stopped where the flyer model was 5" from the lychguard. The void bomb killed 2 lychguard, and 2 of the Lychguard made their invulnerable saves, deflecting (2) S9 AP2 "hits" onto the Bomber.

I've found where the Bomber is allowed a jink save, or in this case, a Flicker Field save. Would the Night Shield negate the range of the dispersion shield?

I think I have the answer, but wanted to see others opinions in case I'm missing something.

DE FAQ
Page 63 – Night Shields.
In the second sentence, change “reducing the range of enemy
units” to “reducing the range of the weapons of enemy units”.

If the range of the dispersion shield is only 6", the Night Shield reduces the range of the dispersion shield by 6", then the dispersion shield isn't within range of the bomber to be able to hit it.

Thanks in advance.

Iirc the night shield is ineffective within 6" as the model is supposed to be able to see it clearly.

In the same way that cc attacks can not be reduced to less than 1, a weapons range cannot be reduced so much so that it cannot fire. However it would get the ff save, or jink if it had followed the rest of the requirements for this rule.

You are correct. I had not re-read the Night Shields rule. No effect on weapons with a 6" range. Thanks for the quick response.

The dispersion shield isn't a weapon that the Lychguard are firing.

It looks like (from your description) that the nightshield only reduces the range on 'enemy' weapons. The Dispersion shield is not an enemy 'weapon', and neither are the void bombs. Apart from that, nightshields don't work at a range of 6" or less too.

@ phish, very welcome
@ rigeld, I think this is one of those instances where the thread devolves in to a raw rai debate. Personally I'd allow it, it just seems the obvious fair option

Another thought. Does it matter that the void mine is a blast marker? Flyers can't be hit by blast/templates.

Q: When a Lychguard with a dispersion shield is hit by a blast or
template weapon the template isn’t relocated. Can the hit itself still be
deflected? (p35)
A: Yes.

Is the hit still a blast hit, or just a 'hit'?

Was it a zooming flyer?

IIRC only snapshots can hit a zooming flyer >.<

@ phish, that doesn't make much sense, as the hits are dictatedby the location of the blast marker... seems to be a biy if a fail by gw that imo... I could get it if the blast was snap fired, and scattered as normal though the rule as is doesn't make much sense to me.

If I had to call on this I'd say its still to be classed as a blast hit, as I dont think any other weapon chsnges its 'type' for any reason, especially as a result of an armour save

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:
Was it a zooming flyer?

IIRC only snapshots can hit a zooming flyer >.<

Except for things that automatically hit, which this would.

Besides, it's not a weapon firing at the flyer, it's an ability. Only weapons need snap shots to hit flyers.

A) It's not a weapon, so per the DE errata, Night Shield doesn't affect it.
B) The hit is not coming from a blast weapon; it's a new hit, which doesn't keep any special rules (like Melta, or Ignores Cover, or whaever) of the original attack.

If thats the case then surely it must lose its strength and ap value too?

The dispersion shields are effectively mirrors, reflecting what hits them back at the attacker.

Does it specifically say in the codex that hits lose their type?

 kitch102 wrote:
If thats the case then surely it must lose its strength and ap value too?

The dispersion shields are effectively mirrors, reflecting what hits them back at the attacker.

Does it specifically say in the codex that hits lose their type?

No, instead it specifically says they keep their Strength and AP. It doesn't mention special rules, so they aren't kept.

Just a re-hash so I can explain this to myself. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

-DE Bomber drops the bomb (blast marker) S9, AP2.
-2 dispersion shields are activated by saving with Invuln., auto-hitting an unengaged enemy within 6".
-Nightshield won't work due to range and the dispersion shield, despite now having a range (6"), Str. and AP value isn't really a weapon.
-The hit lost "blast" so the flyer can still be hit.

So basically, don't sit flyers down right next to lychguard that you just bombed and roll high on your jink save.

methinks this quote from the FAQ might be relevent

Q: How do maelstroms, novas and beams – or indeed any weapon
that doesn’t need to roll To Hit or hits automatically – interact with
Zooming Flyers and Swooping Flying Monstrous Creatures? (p13)
A: Only Snap Shots can hit Zooming Flyers and Swooping
Flying Monstrous Creatures. Therefore, any attacks that use
blast markers, templates, create a line of/area of effect or
otherwise don’t roll to hit cannot target them. This includes
weapons such as the Necron Doom Scythe’s death ray or the
Deathstrike missile of the Imperial Guard, and psychic
powers that follow the rule for maelstroms, beams, and
novas.

It isnt a blast, so no, it isnt relevant

In the Necron FAQ, it says that the blast marker is not repositioned, but the model(s) suffers hits instead. Don't have it with me so I cannot quote it. If that FAQ quote is correct and shots that hit automatically(which means they wouldn't roll to hit) technically wouldn't be able to hit a flyer. If that is the case, I apologize for blowing up your stuff Phish.

It isnt a shooting attack, so the requirement for weapons to snapshot when firing doesnt apply

All righty. I'll roll with that