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Suppose i have 2 full squads of Sternguard (20 men), all with combi-weapons and in Drop Pods.
Which do you think is the optimal TAC loadout (p.e. 5x melta and 5x plasma etc)??

Keep in mind that they can combat-squad out of the pods, potentially targeting up to 4 targets.

Thanks!

at least 3 with combi melta and two melta guns, depending on if you usually face a lot of armour, possibly 10 with melta guns.

As for the other ten, again depends what you usually face, lower toughness units, flamers can be really good, 8 combi flamers and two heavy flamers can really kill a lot of models, best tally so far is a platoon of guardsman or epidermus with 14 plague marines in on shooting phase.
Against TEQ or higher toughness, plasma guns, while in pods you are bound to get within rapid fire range so you can unload 20 plasma shots at one unit, or 10 if combat squadded.

I tend to combat squad my sternguard, gives the opponent two extra targets to go for, also if they lose a few guys to shooting and you are using combat tactics, choose to run away that has saved my sternguard from being locked in combat so many times!, plus its a picture on your opponents face when that happens...

It depends what you're facing. If eldars, go with combi flamers. If TEQ, combi plasmas, if GI vehicle spam, combi meltas, etc.

If your gonna do it like that, with 2 squads all combi. I'd do 5 combi plas with 5 combi flamer in one squad. And then 3 combi melta with 2 melta, and 5 combi plas in the other squad.

If your using someone like Vulkan I would do the second squad with 5 combi melta, 2 melta, 3 combi flamer.

I actually fully outfit my 3 squads with 8 combis of one type plus 2 corresponding heavy/special weapons. (i.e., heavy flamers with combi flamers, plasma guns with combi plasmas) All of them are in pods (like you) and are one hell of an alpha strike. Flamers, as said above, are incredible... Those things can pump out ridiculous amounts of wounds, and plasma is good vs. MEQs and MCs. Honestly, it depends on who you're going to fight and what they're bringing, but plasma is perhaps the best middle ground as it can kill vehicles in 6th without TOO much effort (rear armour+hull points, and you'll get rear shots as you are in pods) and threaten heavy infantry and MCs while your special issue ammo chews up normal infantry. Maybe take 3 combi meltas per squad, one heavy flamer and 6 combi-plasmas. I play against tyranids, eldar, guard and dark eldar regularly and Sternguard in pods are so awesome that I always run them.

I would mix it up with the assumption that you are going to combat squad. If you are popping a transport, then having combi plas for the troops inside is handy. Even combi plas is still very good against most vehicles.

All combi-melta. Look at it this way: you already have special ammo that is good against everything but terminators and vehicles, and terminators are much rarer than vehicles. Combi-meltas make the squad extremely effective against pretty much any target in the game, so they're the obvious choice.

Except combi plasma are twice as effective against most targets in the game. and combi flamers are super effective against some targets in the game, or really anything in cover.

spartiatis wrote:
Suppose i have 2 full squads of Sternguard (20 men), all with combi-weapons and in Drop Pods.
Which do you think is the optimal TAC loadout (p.e. 5x melta and 5x plasma etc)??

Keep in mind that they can combat-squad out of the pods, potentially targeting up to 4 targets.

Thanks!

In a drop pod 10 melta and declare combat squad. Pew pew two dead vehicles.

Since you generally want to equip your sternguard to take out the most threatening and expensive targets in one turn, usually a vehicle, I've gone through plasma at 12" and melta at about 0-6 and 6-12 inches to determine their effectiveness. Ignoring gets hot and targets at a range greater than 12" (which they shouldn't be if you are podding in), we notice that against AV10 to 11 targets Plasma guns always generate more glances per shot than Melta, while generating fewer vehicle destroyed results. Vs. AV1 Plasma strips 0.89 HP per gun while Melta only strips 0.67. For AV11 Plasma Strips 0.67 while melta strips 0.65. At AV's above 11, melta is better, stripping 0.61 for 12, 0.56 for 13, and 0.48 for 14, while Plasma strips 0.44 for 12, 0.22 for 13, and none for 14. At 6 - 12 inches, plasma outperforms melta only against AV12, against AV13 or 14, melta still gets more glances. However, hull points aren't the only way of destroying a vehicle. Getting a destroyed result outright achieves the same effect. At the 6 - 12 inch range, Melta and Plasma are nearly equally capable of destroying a target, with Plasma having a MINOR advantage against AV10 and melta outperforming against AV12 and 13. Within 6" however, melta greatly outperforms in terms of vehicle destroyed results, producing 0.32 vehicle destroyed results against AV10 and 0.194 against AV14. Interestingly enough, this tells us that against any armored target, the most melta shots we need to blow it up would be 6, assuming poor luck. As an additional note, the gets hot from plasma wasn't factored in, nor was its performance against infantry or vehicles, where it outshines melta.

So I guess the realistic question is what you want each sternguard squad to do. Assuming you equip them all with combi-weapons, I would suggest if you are using multiple 10 man squads to deploy them with 6 combi-meltas and 4 combi-plasmas, divided evenly between the two combat squads. It gives you good odds of harming the toughest targets in the game, no matter what they are, while also giving you the potential to be able to split your fire (3 combi-meltas has about a 60% chance of killing a land raider, so more than half the time you will be able to split your fire onto another target.

I usually only have 8, however, since they usually are joined by Tycho and Corbulo. The C:SM, however, can have 10 and include specials on top of that due to their roomier drop pods. I guess BA have too many mirrors and blood coolers in theirs or something.

I like the load out
Squad 1:
5 combi-melta, 3 combi-flamer, 2 heavy flamer
Squad 2:
5 combi-plasma, 5 combi-melta

Gives you a lot of options and a fun tactic I use with Squad 1 is to drop in, melta the tank, and flamer the squad that gets out. Lots of fun.

Forgot my loadout; I take all melta. There are numbers games with plasma, but I can't combat squad really with 8 and I just want my target to die for sure. This can backfire, of course, if there are no worthy targets. But I can usually find something. Also, I am exceptionally unlucky with gets hot! :(

I was saying plasma because sometimes the target you want to die is not necessarily a vehicle. Sometimes you just need that volley of wounds.

I also look at it this way. Combi melta and Combi plasma cost the same.

However a melta is usually 10 points, while a plasma is 15. Usually there is a reason for something like this.

Main problem is getting either gun in enough quantities to outfit a bunch of models is a pain in the ass -_-

It's usually minor, but melta also has more instagib potential. Gets around annoying FNP and many multiple wound models. Plasma, though, is better in many cases. I just mount plasma on other units.

The way I see it Special Issue Ammo can almost do everything plasma can, the melta shot is far more complementry, and if you take vulcan its TL. Melta's also ID T4 which is mentioned above.

As far as a meltagun being 10 points and the plasma being 15, no one has ever accused GW of intelegently pricing special weapons. How much plasma did you see in 5th edition.....about none.

You didnt see plasma in fifth edition because everyone was hiding in boxes that plasma could not reliably destroy. You needed meltas to have a good chance to kill vehicles.

Now that is not so much the case and the additional shots really help the plasmas case.

I am not saying all plasma, I am saying that if I were going for the combat squadding I would want it so one could kill the transport, and then the other could kill the squad inside.

Now if you are not running 10 men combat squadded then it is a different argument.

I agree with Leth in general. I don't think there is a good one size fits all answer here. Plasma is demonstrably better in 6th than in 5th. But when you need melta... you really need it. And it doesn't kill your expensive sternguard for your enemy occasionally. I'm going to call someone foolish for taking plasma, because it could be true that there are no good targets for melta.

Resurrecting this thread instead of starting my own.

I am going to run 5 Sterguard with a Termy Librarian as a swiss army knife type unit. In my list, I already have 2 LC's, 5 ML's, 2 Demolisher Cannons, 1 PG, 1 PC, and 2 TL-AC's.

I plan on putting 4 Combi's onto the Sterns and GoI/footslogging them around to support the line wherever they are needed.

I am looking at some combination of Plasma and Melta as I don't have the bits for flamers.

Currently thinking two CombiPlas and two Combi Melta to give them a decent chance to hurt TEQ, MC's, or light armor; and still have a chance (a less than ideal but still possible chance) to pop a heavier piece of armor.

Any ideas or constructive criticisms are welcome.

I prefer melta, so armored targets are a viable choice. I even go so far as to have 9 combi meltas when I drop in Tycho with the Sternguard. Sadly, BA pods are too small to combat squad them with Tycho and Corbs on board.

This changes if you foot slog. There, I'd say definitely plasma, as getting to melta range could be hard. I don't like foot slogging anything though, even in 6th. Rhinos are cheap. Use them, even if they die quickly.

 LordRogalDorn wrote:
I like the load out
Squad 1:
5 combi-melta, 3 combi-flamer, 2 heavy flamer
Squad 2:
5 combi-plasma, 5 combi-melta

Gives you a lot of options and a fun tactic I use with Squad 1 is to drop in, melta the tank, and flamer the squad that gets out. Lots of fun.

I only take 2 cmg and 2 mg on a sternguard i use,but the above load-out appeals to me quite a bit and i may change my ways.

I tend to run two ten man squads in pods and prefer a 5/5 mix of combi melta/flamers. I find this gives me verry nice flexibility, allows for the transport kill/ cargo roast effect, and that the special ammo takes care of most of my plasma needs. I also use a contemptor mortis in a podw 2x kheres, so that also tends to eliminate my need for plasma combis.

If you are podding them, then there's no reason to not take Combi-Meltas.

Typically I run 5x Combi-Melta and 5x Combi-Flamer. I combat squad, pop the transport with melta, then flame the creamy insides.

My choice to play like this is solidified by using Vulkan as my HQ as well.

If I'm running Lysander, I typically only bring a couple meltas and let the special issue ammo do the work.

Yea my lysander squad has two heavy flamer's and that's it. Good unit

I'd run a squad of 8 with 2 heavy flamers and 4 combi-meltas. Put them in a drop pod, maybe even add a prescience libby and you're all but guarantied to kill whatever you land next to.

 Leth wrote:

However a melta is usually 10 points, while a plasma is 15. Usually there is a reason for something like this.

Plasmagun has better range than meltagun, so you probably get more opportunities to shoot, netting you more shots during the game. However, with combis you ever get one shot, so this advantage does not apply. Short range of melta means you you usually won't get many shots anyway, so this makes it good for combi-weapons. Same goes for the flamer.

Yeah, the Lysander squad shouldn't need anything upgraded, and I'd say its a toss up weather or not to take the heavy flamers or allow for more special ammo shots to benefit from the Bolter Drill.

I just made up 10 using bits from eBay

3 combi melta
2 combi plasma
Combi flamer
Heavy flamer
3 spare bodies
Pod

Having done that, with all the gluing of bolters onto meltaguns to make combimeltas,

Look like this http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/429620-Combimelta%20SGT.html

I wish I had of known about this

http://chapterhousestudios.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=85_113&product_id=150

Magnetic combiweapons. Gold!

Have some coming in the mail.

Id personally roll with two 10 man squads, one maxed with combi plasma, the other combi melta. Land, combat squad, vaporise some stuff, plenty of special ammo should they survive the turn along with more targets.

Loricatus: Yeah, those kits are nice, I ordered a bunch a while ago and love them. They're small and fidley, but the kit comes with all the options and the magnets for $5!!!!