Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
mwnciboo wrote: Having worked with US Army and the US Marines, I prefer the USMC on the basis of they are more like British Forces in that everything is done on a shoestring, and your logistics is never enough so you spend alot of time "liberating" things from more well stocked allies..... either that or buying it from ebay.
So Generation Kill wasn't exaggerating then?
"And if we've learnt anything over the past 1000 mile retreat it's that Russian agriculture is in dire need of mechanisation!"
Hey at least the Marines had the PX or NEX. Us Brits had the NAAFI , to put that in context imagine a SPAR in a portacabin that has been ram-raided and had 90% of the stock stolen. Whats left is Chocolate, and it is 40 Degree C plus in the shade, overpriced, out of date and crap. The Yanks had A&W burger, Pizza Hut, Coffee Street, Nap Hendrix, Starbucks, you name it etc, we had SPAR own brand Fig rolls.
Us Brits used to descend on the NEX and PX like a Plague of locusts visiting ancient Egypt.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2013/02/12 23:39:38
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
mwnciboo wrote: Having worked with US Army and the US Marines, I prefer the USMC on the basis of they are more like British Forces in that everything is done on a shoestring, and your logistics is never enough so you spend alot of time "liberating" things from more well stocked allies..... either that or buying it from ebay.
So Generation Kill wasn't exaggerating then?
It wasn't exaggerating at all. The issue with the Corps is we have to keep innovating and stay on the bleeding edge while maintaining readiness/combat operations. All of that ON a shoe string budget. How we pull it off? Steal a ton of gak from the army and navy. The only people better at robbing folks blind are Seabees.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
Absolutely true, but the best thing is that it makes you more cohesive, and makes for a better make do and mend, beg steal or borrow ethos. I've never heard a British or USMC unit say "Sorry we cannot do that Operation, no Logistics (or should that be no PX?)" .
It would normally go "You got a pair of boots? You got a Rifle? Right then STFU and get moving!". Or more accurately "Dry your eyes Princess, zip up your man suit, suck it up and crack on!"
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/13 08:07:07
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
You'd be hard pressed to get any individual Marine to admit he can't do anything much less a group of them. Logistics for the field, PX is where you get your pogey bait and other useless gak Mama Corps says you don't need.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
Okay then...You've Convinced me what do I need to do to make an MEU?
Add in rules for LCAC's, Ch-46 Sea Knights, UH-1N, AV-8B etc?
Look at this and if you could hunt me out an ORBAT or TO&E for a 1986 USMC MEU that would be great.
I know the M1 Abrams was new so the M60 is likely Main armour, but what about the rest of the unit?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/13 17:23:34
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
If you need help with that, count me in - at least the theory part.
Im pretty much useless in Swedish gear of the 1980s (..but I bet here must be at least one swedish reservist, or even former one), but I do know FDFs (thou Im lacking personal experience from Jalkaväkiprikaati-80, Infantry Brigade-`80 TO&E, but Im quite familiar with the theory part and equipment used back then) gear.
But again, should be noted, Finland too would propably stay extra-neutral as long as possible, and might even engage NATO personel violating its borders or aerospace.
M-60 is spot on, LAV-25s have been in service with the Corps since '83, our Amphibs are older then that...
Total adding stuff:
LCAC's, Ch-46 Sea Knights, UH-1N, AV-8B, AAV-7A1, CH-53, F-18... you probably have our arty already, we don't use anything special compared to the army. Assault boat rules? Something generic that any force can use to make an amphibious landing maybe, and trained Amphibious assault troops get to skip a negative effect on the assault. Another possible "special" unit the Marines could take would be ANGLICO (Air Naval Gunfire LIaison Company, it's usually a small det, not a full company) who can provide a bonus or call off map support fire like the IG Master of Ordnance.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
If you need help with that, count me in - at least the theory part.
Im pretty much useless in Swedish gear of the 1980s (..but I bet here must be at least one swedish reservist, or even former one), but I do know FDFs (thou Im lacking personal experience from Jalkaväkiprikaati-80, Infantry Brigade-`80 TO&E, but Im quite familiar with the theory part and equipment used back then) gear.
But again, should be noted, Finland too would propably stay extra-neutral as long as possible, and might even engage NATO personel violating its borders or aerospace.
Yup consider yourself Conscripted, I've had some good feedback for Sweden already (infact most of a list done!). I will work this as a kind of "Indepenent" Intelligence Brief, using Sweden and Finland, holding out against WARPAC and NATO, infact that would be a good scenario for the USMC. For Example:-
"USMC lands in DENMARK to reinforce the Danes - The Soviets Spetsnaz invade the Island of "Gotland" belonging to Sweden and setup a long range Missile Launcher, A USMC unit on the Danish Island of "Bornholm" comes under heavy attack including Chemical bombardment. US President authorises strike on "Gotland" accidentally killing Swedish Nationals with a cluster munition strike. Sweden Declares both WARPAC and NATO as Enemies to their Neutrality - All Hell breaks lose - Finland and Sweden form a Bilateral Defence pact and work together to resist WARPAC and NATO aggression".
@KalashnikovMarine
Yeah ANGLICO rings a bell, that is pretty simple to do, I will add in a Naval Gunfire Support Spotter as an FOO.
MEU Special Rule - Amphibious assault
How about a doubling of "assault range" on a beach? The whole doctrine of aggressively, relentlessly storming the beach, moving forward regardless to secure the Beachhead and not get stuck on the Beach? So that would be a 6" move with an 8" Assault but only from Assault / Landing Craft?
or
STOM - Ship To Objective Manoeuvre
An MEU Infantry unit can contest an Objective at 8" Range rather than the Normal 4" Range?
That TOE is useful but what date is it for, all the other lists are 1986 (with a little bit of massaging for things like AH-64). It was written in 2001, but what period does it cover.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/14 22:17:12
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
Yeah ANGLICO rings a bell, that is pretty simple to do, I will add in a Naval Gunfire Support Spotter as an FOO.
MEU Special Rule - Amphibious assault
How about a doubling of "assault range" on a beach? The whole doctrine of aggressively, relentlessly storming the beach, moving forward regardless to secure the Beachhead and not get stuck on the Beach? So that would be a 6" move with an 8" Assault but only from Assault / Landing Craft?
or
STOM - Ship To Objective Manoeuvre
An MEU Infantry unit can contest an Objective at 8" Range rather than the Normal 4" Range?
That TOE is useful but what date is it for, all the other lists are 1986 (with a little bit of massaging for things like AH-64). It was written in 2001, but what period does it cover.
I'd say the assault rule is spot on
the TOE is more modern unfortunately, I think late 90s/early 2000s, but our organizational structure hasn't changed too much since we implemented the MEU system. I'm still digging for an exact cold war TOE, going to ask my professor tonight for other possible resources.
Why do you need to massage the lists for Cobras? They saw service in 'nam with the Hueys so they should fit in just fine.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/15 02:00:22
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
The Apache was introduced until April 1986, and really wasn't delivered in numbers until 2-3 years later, plus it was held in the US training and developing it operationally, it was not in Germany till much later.
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
The Apache was introduced until April 1986, and really wasn't delivered in numbers until 2-3 years later, plus it was held in the US training and developing it operationally, it was not in Germany till much later.
Blegh sorry! I was up for roughly 48 hours at that point. Things were getting blurry.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
The plan for the Marines in the event of a Cold War gone Hot scenario was to land pretty much the entirety of the Corps in the Kola Peninsula, push inland as far as possible and take the airfields and naval bases in the area, and then pray that they survived the counterattack and could hold the northern front. Meanwhile a much smaller chunk of the Corps was to be sent to Norway (where the Corps had (and still does) stockpiled TONS of military equipment, everything from ammo up to Abrams) and use the Marines (with the help of fresh Norwegian conscripts) to act as a blocking force to prevent the Soviets from advancing from the North.
Sometimes I wish the Air Force was a bit more like the Marines :( decisions decisions >.<
CoALabaer wrote: Wargamers hate two things: the state of the game and change.
The Apache was introduced until April 1986, and really wasn't delivered in numbers until 2-3 years later, plus it was held in the US training and developing it operationally, it was not in Germany till much later.
First AH-64 Apache's in West Germany were deployed in 3rd Armoured Divisions organic helicopter attack wing in 1987 while covering the Fulda Gap. They were also the first unit to deploy with the helicopter.
The Apache was introduced until April 1986, and really wasn't delivered in numbers until 2-3 years later, plus it was held in the US training and developing it operationally, it was not in Germany till much later.
First AH-64 Apache's in West Germany were deployed in 3rd Armoured Divisions organic helicopter attack wing in 1987 while covering the Fulda Gap. They were also the first unit to deploy with the helicopter.
,
Yeah the 3rd were the first unit, But Fort Rucker Aviation unit had them from April 1986 to develop the Operational Conversion syllabus, but the roll out in significant numbers to Germany took years.
calgar 2.5 wrote: Do you have an ETA on the Scandinavian campaign PDF? This could be the way to get a couple friends in on this.
Okay, at a minimum the Lists will be available by the end of the month, if you want to make your own missions up, great we aren't constrained by History here so you can be very creative. Anyway just to prove I'm on it here is the Draft Armoured Company.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/16 10:20:27
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
Fort Rucker was a development unit, not an actual deployment,so 3rd claim status as first 'combat' unit.
Given their position in the Fulda Gap, the 3rd's Aviation unit would have been in the thick of the action should the USSR have decided to attack. So while not that many of them, they would certainly have seen plenty of action till shotdown.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/16 10:24:57
Although not on the Website, mention it is my Cold War Blog, and he will probably help you out.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/17 00:18:55
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
Although not on the Website, mention it is my Cold War Blog, and he will probably help you out.
Sweet. I can convert some TPZ Fuchs's into Patria's. I'm assuming QRF also makes Centurion's already?
Also, question about the whol Sweden vs Norway thing. How does that work? Norway was a NATO member by '86, and Sweden had strong ties with the US, I just don't see tht working out.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/17 02:49:19
Ultramarines Legion 138th Company
Ultramarines Legion 19th Reserve Armour Company
Sweden, in my opinion, is fiercely neutral. E.g If you don't attack me, I won't attack you, but if you do attack me I will bleed you dry. It has an ambivalence borne of self interest, I wouldn't see NATO attacking or invading Swedish Terrority. Sweden and Finland were in that very awkward position of being a buffer zone between the WARPAC and NATO in Scandinavia, NATO would not do anything that would jeopardize their cordial (if ambivalent) relations with Sweden. The USSR was pretty bellicose, so the Finns and Swedes didn't want to show bias to NATO for fear of the USSR using this, or engineering a "Casus Belli" and giving the USSR a convenient excuse to invade and annex them.
NATO were rather hoping this would happen because it would give the Finns and Swedes common cause with NATO and make them potentially Allies of Convenience or even bring them into the Fold of NATO altogether.
It was a very tense area, and the actions and reactions of the Finnish and Swedish Governments could not be relied upon to react in a given fashion and it would be highly situationally dependent.
This is my reading of the situation back then, and I am happy for people to put forward counter arguments.
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
alot of the Finnish Stuff is Soviet, and can be proxied by elements such as the TPZ FUCHS as the PATRIA Apc.
Ah, my time has come.
Few notes about that domestic APC, officially known as XA-180 and later 185 - where the type number comes is a bit unclear to me, but its not important. All variants in service (with exception of SAM-system) go under nickname "Pasi" (common male finnish name), and is led from words "Panssari Sisu", literally "Armored Sisu", Sisu being large finnish truck manufacturer of its time (and btw, means also guts, persistence or will strenght in finnish language), which created the orginal concept and produced it until 1997 when it was shifted to patria. I wont tell the whole story, but should be noted that Patria wasnt founded until 1997 and when it was, the new vehicle was "re-named" to become "Patria Pasi XA-xxx", as before it was known "Sisu Pasi XA-xxx". Also, there were two other APCs preceeding Pasi (from 1970s and Pasis competitor from early 80s), but only pototypes were produced.
The fuchs is propably best "alternative" available - I am working with resin 1:100 XA-180/185 along with finnish cold war era truck Sisu A-45, but due to the lack of blueprints Pasi takes time. Im having good blueprints for "proto-sisu" (nickname for A-45) but its been busy with "real" schoolworks. For the infantry I would recommend QRFs soviet motorised infantry, with some helmet shaping and paintwork these will do decent infantry with M62 steel helmet and M62 cammies. The RPG-7 is propably the weakest link, but IMO it reminds well enough 55 S 55.
Back to subject:
The jalkaväkiprikaati-80s infantry organisation didnt "include" APCs, as when it was designed in late 70s, there was no succesfull domestic APC available in large quantities, as the BTR-60 was issued to mechanized infantry units only. The casual infantry company would been mounted on tractors(!) and trailers, and trucks in some scale. So the role of Pasi until the very late 1980s would been quite limited, and it wasnt until Jääkäriprikaati-90 when "casual" infantry received APCs as a personal transport.
Also, there werent that many XA-180/85 around in mid 80s, I can get the exact numbers tomorrow if I remember to check them. But for the mobile and "better" infantry formations/reserves operating in well roaded areas the Pasi would propably been the choice.
But yeah, I can give you some sort of basic listing what FDF had back in 1986, but this aint everything:
Utility Vehicles (finnish army didnt, until 2000s, have "standardised" light utility vehicle, and till today we have quite a gakload of different off-road capable light utility vehicles in service) - UAZ-469 (propably the most numerous and the most liked one due to the HC offroad capabilities - available from Peter Pig under designation of GAZ-469)
- LAnd Rover (different models - wasnt very common)
- GAZ-69 (in limited numbers, last ones were purschased in 1971, so the ones still in service would be taken from long-term storages - available from QRF)
- Loads of different vehicles, Toyota land cruisers, range rovers etc.
- UAZ-452 (mostly as a radio van and ambulance, but Ive seen at least one converted into MP-van)
- Ambulances were VW type 3 transporters, alongside offroad capable UAZ-452s.
Trucks:
- Domestic ones (fex. allready mentioned Sisu A-45 and the SA-150 which eventually replaced A-45)
- ZIL-131 (around 200 before second purschase batch bought in late 80s)
- ZIL-157 (not sure about this, propably been removed from service in mid 80s)
- Ural-375 (not sure was this issued to the utility role, but at least as a rocket launcher basis)
- KrAZ-255 (best off-road truck of its class _ever_)
APC/IFVs:
- BTR-60PB (used by mechanized infantry in armored brigade - also earlier models, but mostly they served in training duties and as a basis for HQ&comms vehicles).
- XA-180 (propably around 50 units in service at 1986 - only fraction of these were armed in that point, as the orginall variant didnt have armament of anykind, first only UN-vehicles were equipped with ring mounting and DsHK, later with NSV)
- MT-LBv (NOT used in 1986 - we had 10 purschased in 1984 for testing purposes, and the main batch wasnt purschased before 1988)
- BTR-50PK (I checked these, they were acting as a APC in mid 80s, at least in some point armored brigades recon units used these - Im not sure in which role they were acting in mid 1980s. Some of these were command & comm fitted too))
- BMP-1 (without AT-3 launch capability, used by parts of armored brigades mechanized infantry)
Tanks/AFVs:
- Charioteer (were used as a training vehicles by the officer school untill 1980, and thats when they were put into museum)
- Comet (okay, now the interesting part - these were stated to be obsolete in 1950s when these were bought, but high command in its eternal wisdom, by some reason, decided to store some of these vehicles untill 2006! Propably would been used as a basis for conversion - ARV or something like that, at least one such was constructed and was used by Satakunta artillery brigades testing facility till 1990s)
- T-54 (some units, mostly training duties but still in limited wartime service)
- T-55 (update program started in 1989, so these would be in orginal condition in mid 80s. Could be fitted with mine rollers and then being employed by armored engineer)
- T-72M1 (yup, around half brigade of these avilable, as batches arrived in thrue the 1980s and last one was in 1988)
- PT-76 (used by armored brigades recon formations untill 1991)
SPAAS:
- ZSU-57-2 (by armored brigades AA unit - constant attempts and concepts to upgrade these were made thru the 80s, officially 84-88 but these plans didnt acctually do anything)
Artillery:
- No SPGs of anykind in service until 1991.
- Heaviest artillery batteries (130mm +) were equipped wih AT-S and ATS-59 tracked tractors, lighter pieces (mostly 122) were pulled with trucks.
I will doublecheck the whole list tomorrow when I get my notes from school.
Checking done, most obvious fails fixed - added info about SPGs
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2013/02/18 14:38:37
Awesome, What I really need is the Infantry setup... E.g
How many Squads in a Platoon, Company etc, What equipment they carried. What an AT Platoon Carried, what a Mortar section used. Whether they had GPMG platoons, or whatever.
So would it be an Officer, NCO and three Squads? 8 man Squads or Fireteams? Or Gun groups and Rifle Groups, or 12 man Squads with 3 fireteams of 4 etc etc.
Cheers, this stuff is brilliant!!!
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
mwnciboo wrote: Awesome, What I really need is the Infantry setup... E.g
How many Squads in a Platoon, Company etc, What equipment they carried. What an AT Platoon Carried, what a Mortar section used. Whether they had GPMG platoons, or whatever.
So would it be an Officer, NCO and three Squads? 8 man Squads or Fireteams? Or Gun groups and Rifle Groups, or 12 man Squads with 3 fireteams of 4 etc etc.
Cheers, this stuff is brilliant!!!
Basic tactical "block" was brigade (Jalkaväkiprikaati) - Led by HQ-company, and basis was formed by 4 infantry battallions, and supporting assets were recon company, engineer company, antitank company (not sure about equipment of this, but propably armed with ATGM, if so it would most likely be PstOhj 82/82M aka AT-4 "spigot" or PstOhj 83M aka TOW - as the 95 S 59-61 "Musti" was battallion level AT-asset - organisation of the platoon might be same, tho), supply company, comms company, artillery regiment (Two firebatteries, first with 3x 122 H 63 (Soviet D30) and second with 3x 122 H 63 OR 3x some of the 152mm guns in service - in late 80s, these were replaced with/upgraded to 152 H 88 standard) and two anti-air companies (with ZU-23-2, no idea about organisation - main objective was to protect artillery)
The infantry battallion (Jalkaväkipataljoona) was formed from four Infantry companies and HQ-, AT-(company was formed from three antitank-platoons, every platoon had 4 squads, one of them was operating 95 S 59-61 heavy recoilles rifle, others were armed with disposable heavy and light AT-launchers, light was 66 KES 75 aka M72A2 LAW, and the heavy 112 RsKes APILAS aka, well, APILAS. Each squad had 6 members, and the total size of a platoon was around 31-32 personel depending on how many vehicles the unit had), mortar- (HQ squad and three mortar detachments/platoons, each with 3 mortar teams, and each team is made up by 7 man crew, and in battallion level they are with 120mm mortar) ,supply companies, and was reinforced with FO- & comms company.
Infantry Company (Jalkaväkikomppania) is the part Im having problems atm - I havent found the excat TO&E yet, but I know that it propably included three infantry platoons and support/mortar platoon with 82mm mortars (the organisation of the mortar platoon is same than mortar detachment, but with 82mm mortars). I keep searching. My personal guess is that the Company was formed from three rifle platoons and single mortar platoon
Infantry Platoon (Jalkaväkijoukkue) was formed from four (4) riflesquads (+officer, vice leader/platoon NCO, Runner/RTO, Medic and Driver), each with 8 personel. Every rifle squad had LMG (domestic 7.62 KvKK 62, or in case of armored brigade, 7.62 KvKK PKM), and in paper, one of the four squads was equipped with light anti tank weapon (55 S 55), but during peace time excercises every squad got one due to the large number of enemy APC/IFVs being expected - also, if required, light disposable AT weapons (66 KES 75) would also be issued. Full strenght platoon had strenght of 37 men.
Sorry about the (exceptionally) poor english here n there, I was quite tired when I wrote this and my brains arent working with full lights.
This is Excellent English, and is pretty damn amazing considering it's not your First Language, you type like a native even the colloquialisms and turns of phrase are used correctly which is usually a dead giveaway. But in your case I would never have guessed.
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
This is my reading of the situation back then, and I am happy for people to put forward counter arguments.
Probably just American ignorance here, but I would assume that Finland would still be sore about the Winter War. As far as I know, the Soviets would still want to annex Finland. Just my 2 cents.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/18 01:53:15
Ultramarines Legion 138th Company
Ultramarines Legion 19th Reserve Armour Company
This is my reading of the situation back then, and I am happy for people to put forward counter arguments.
Probably just American ignorance here, but I would assume that Finland would still be sore about the Winter War. As far as I know, the Soviets would still want to annex Finland. Just my 2 cents.
I would have thought so, but I also know that the Finns dont like the Swedes much either.
The Apache was introduced until April 1986, and really wasn't delivered in numbers until 2-3 years later, plus it was held in the US training and developing it operationally, it was not in Germany till much later.
First AH-64 Apache's in West Germany were deployed in 3rd Armoured Divisions organic helicopter attack wing in 1987 while covering the Fulda Gap. They were also the first unit to deploy with the helicopter.
,
Yeah the 3rd were the first unit, But Fort Rucker Aviation unit had them from April 1986 to develop the Operational Conversion syllabus, but the roll out in significant numbers to Germany took years.
calgar 2.5 wrote: Do you have an ETA on the Scandinavian campaign PDF? This could be the way to get a couple friends in on this.
Okay, at a minimum the Lists will be available by the end of the month, if you want to make your own missions up, great we aren't constrained by History here so you can be very creative. Anyway just to prove I'm on it here is the Draft Armoured Company.
OK a few thoughts on this.
The Swedes basically had four kinds of brigades, namely armoured, mechanised, infantry and Norrland. That would create basically four types of companys.
Swedish armoured company would have EITHER centurion, OR S-Tanks. They wouldnt mix the two. There were four armoured brigades in the 1980's, two with centurion and two with S-Tanks. So they almost certainly would never operate together. A company would have 4 platoons of three OR 3 platoons of four (they tinkered with the organisations). Company HQ was an inf group in TGB-11 jeep effort. Each company would have an attached mechanised platoon of 3 x PBv-302 with two inf in both (one fitted with GPMG and one with Carl Gustav).
The IKV-91 tank destroyer was only used in the infantry and norrland brigades. Armoured companies would use a platoon of six TGB-11 fitted with TOW as an anti tank unit.
Banderkannons were only used in Norrland brigades. Im not too sure why as they were very heavy, used lots of fuel and wouldnt be particularly mobile in heavy snow, but there you go! Armoured, mechanised and infantry companies would use FH-70 towed 155mm guns.
Close artillery support was towed 105mm batteries for Armoured and mechanised companies, 120mm mortars for infantry and Norland companies.
Swedish units made extensive use of TGB-11 jeeps with 90mm RCL strapped to the back. Each Norrland and Infantry company would have a platoon of 4 of them attached and maybe extra ones at brigade and battalion level.
I'll try and produce a more definitive list. By the by, what pointing system are you using?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/18 11:12:24
Point 1, I've will leave the list as is, I'm not producing endless lists for every kind of possible force (Players will got nuts if I do 3 force lists for the Swedes and one for the Bundeswehr!). That is madness. If someone wants to play a mixed forced fine, if some wants to play historically accurate one great, just pick forces of all the same Platoons. I might put it in the Information at the top, if you buy a HQ, all the Platoons need to be the same type of vehicle as the HQ.
Point 2 - Points are based on the previous system I have used for "Stopping the Red tide"..
Point 3 - I know, I keep saying this but I need to be clear. This is not 100% Historically accurate, we blur the realism to achieve a relatively Fair / Balanced game , this means fudging with reality. This is a Wargame in a Historical context not a Historical Simulation so there is a difference between being broadly in line with real equipment and stats, and being absolutely 100% historically accurate.
Towed Artillery is pretty much out, because of the huge amount the WARPAC & NATO had (thousands of hours for me working it all out), I went with Self propelled only because frankly the lists become ridiculous and it was mechanised Warfare Centric. With the Scandanvian stuff I may consider something else as it was more Infantry and Artillery based.
Collecting Forge World 30k????? If you prefix any Thread Subject line on 30k or Pre-heresy or Horus Heresy with [30K] we can convince LEGO and the Admin team to create a 30K mini board if we can show there is enough interest!
either that or buying it from ebay. 
