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Personally I would play against anything fielded against me. Don't even need primer.

Though a painted tabletop standard for me would be basic colors on the model with details covered. I honestly don't see a need to do the base up at all. I have not had a chance to play anyone besides my wife, but with the huge numbers of battle reports I have watched base detailing is rare. I am surprised to see so many people saying it is standard.

Side note: I like your HQ to outshine the rest of the models, unless they are also at a very high standard.

table top ready means looks good and is readily recognizable from my veiw point across the table...or taken with a normal camera (2mp digital ie normal cell phone cam normally owned digital cam, instamatic or polaroid) across the table from it (no zoom) ..
does not have to pass as a great display piece or be usable in a diorama...does not need to look good thru a magnifier or on a higher end camera (10-15mp with zoom) ...
exact painting method and combination of methods are not critical ..

Don't let DakkaDakka scare you the community here tends towards a higher standard than most ( not a bad thing ) Don't let the community here fool you either ..while it has a good representive cross refernce of wargamers on it its still less than 1 in 10,000 wargammers and most of the painting methods while good are not new ..highlighting and shading ..using a combo of drybrushing edging and washes will really pop a mini ..and make a so so army look great ..but my great grandfathers lead napoleonics are painted that way with a "white" varnish over top for coating (lead paints, sepia Ink wash and a near clear lead bases varnish over top ..shudder.. ) we just do the same thing with acrylics, and synthetic Inks, and urathane or acrliyc clear coats

I think painting should count for total score in tournaments but I also think people "over think" the paint score. It's pretty standard and not subjective.
People don't just go around saying "Hmm I think that army is about a 12..."
There is a score sheet stuff like...
Entire army based? Yes/No 1pt
3 colors? Yes/No
Highlights/shading? Yes/No
Conversions? Yes/No

So basically they just check off the boxes and that's you score. Then they take all the highest score and get personnal with them to decide who wins best painted.

So as long as your entire army is painted, and based your good. It's not "subjective" at all. Basically you have a bunch of standard stuff to get X number of points then there are bonus points for things like conversions, etc.

Thought I'd post this. It's the result of 1:45 of work. Pick one up and you'll notice the lack of most details, but in successive hordes spawning from the tervigons, they'll look just fine. Nothing smaller than a #2 flat brush was used.

For me, I won't play a model on the tabletop unless I have completely finished all the painting, basing, details and I am 100% happy with the model. Some models, with more details, such as HQs or Special Characters, I will spend more time on than say....standard troops, but that's due to more details on the model.

If I'm playing someone, I like to see their whole army painted as I like to compare paint schemes, techniques etc. however, I'm not going to whine and moan if you haven't finished painting your models, it's your army and who am I to tell someone how to paint and what they can or cannot play due to paint schemes?

I feel like I need to weigh in here.

Tabletop standard is what I like to play against, but my definition of tabletop standard is basically just 'has paint on it'. I think the tournament definition of 3 paints + base is fairly reasonable. I mean, that equates to flesh, clothes and metal. And as for basing, IT"S EASY! even if all you want to do is paint the base brown then at least it looks like it isn't just a mount!

So, i guess you could split my bigoted opinions in to two parts. The standard of painting on DakkaDakka is stupidly high, TT is merely some paint has been aimed in the direction of the model in my opinion. I say this because it does not put off people who are new, or have difficulty painting, as a previous poster mentioned. And because while i am not great, I used to suck real bad, but at least painted everything.

That said however, I don't believe a model is really finished until at least some effort has been thrown at the base. With the new textured paints this is an easy thing to do, but even just gluing some sand on and painting it brown improves the whole thing.

As a previous poster mentioned, the miniatures in the third post are great, and while they may be quick for the poster to produce, are way above what I would consider minimum table top quality level. But, everything is in the eye of the beholder...

I've also noticed a significant level of creep in painting standards over the past four years especially. It seems like now if you want even a lukewarm response you need to use OSL, or have high levels of freehand, or do NMM. While I may not paint stunningly, I was rather taken aback when I was informed that I needed to 'paint the teeth on that ork so they look like they are rotten" (the teeth in question being somewhat less than 1/2mm square). While it is great that the galleries are full of inspirational figures, painted to a standard that I aspire to, it seems a shame that the community believes that EVERYONE should paint to the level of 'eavy metal painters.

I believe that while the aspirational stuff is great, the community doesn't have enough respect for straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painting. I say this not based on being miffed at a comment on my stuff, but based on the comments I read on others posts.



Rant ends...

Wagguy80 wrote:
I think painting should count for total score in tournaments but I also think people "over think" the paint score. It's pretty standard and not subjective.
People don't just go around saying "Hmm I think that army is about a 12..."
There is a score sheet stuff like...
Entire army based? Yes/No 1pt
3 colors? Yes/No
Highlights/shading? Yes/No
Conversions? Yes/No

So basically they just check off the boxes and that's you score. Then they take all the highest score and get personnal with them to decide who wins best painted.

So as long as your entire army is painted, and based your good. It's not "subjective" at all. Basically you have a bunch of standard stuff to get X number of points then there are bonus points for things like conversions, etc.

ok thats a fine way to judge it but remind me, how does the look of an army effect your skill as a player? pretty sure that if I were to play someone the result would be the same regardless of if my model was painted or not :/ it just seems like it should be part of seperate category IMO :/

also I kinda have to agree with the earlyer point that with wash's, glazes and GWs new painting by numbers range it's pretty hard not to chuck out a good looking army in a short space of time. even more so if you go back every now and then to add a few more details




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 goblinzz wrote:
I feel like I need to weigh in here.

I've also noticed a significant level of creep in painting standards over the past four years especially. It seems like now if you want even a lukewarm response you need to use OSL, or have high levels of freehand, or do NMM. While I may not paint stunningly, I was rather taken aback when I was informed that I needed to 'paint the teeth on that ork so they look like they are rotten" (the teeth in question being somewhat less than 1/2mm square). While it is great that the galleries are full of inspirational figures, painted to a standard that I aspire to, it seems a shame that the community believes that EVERYONE should paint to the level of 'eavy metal painters.

I believe that while the aspirational stuff is great, the community doesn't have enough respect for straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painting. I say this not based on being miffed at a comment on my stuff, but based on the comments I read on others posts.

I see where you're coming from but I think it's more of fact that a well painted model will generate a lot of praise as there is nothing to improve on where as a "straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painted" should still get praise (after all if you did a good job then you should be praised) but should also recieve oppinions on how to make the model better. it's not a bad thing, it's just people trying to help make your models look as good as they can

 DPBellathrom wrote:

 goblinzz wrote:
I feel like I need to weigh in here.

I've also noticed a significant level of creep in painting standards over the past four years especially. It seems like now if you want even a lukewarm response you need to use OSL, or have high levels of freehand, or do NMM. While I may not paint stunningly, I was rather taken aback when I was informed that I needed to 'paint the teeth on that ork so they look like they are rotten" (the teeth in question being somewhat less than 1/2mm square). While it is great that the galleries are full of inspirational figures, painted to a standard that I aspire to, it seems a shame that the community believes that EVERYONE should paint to the level of 'eavy metal painters.

I believe that while the aspirational stuff is great, the community doesn't have enough respect for straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painting. I say this not based on being miffed at a comment on my stuff, but based on the comments I read on others posts.

I see where you're coming from but I think it's more of fact that a well painted model will generate a lot of praise as there is nothing to improve on where as a "straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painted" should still get praise (after all if you did a good job then you should be praised) but should also recieve oppinions on how to make the model better. it's not a bad thing, it's just people trying to help make your models look as good as they can

This is always a touchy issue, when you bring your own experience of forums in to things, it's real easy for me to come across as a conceited ... So, the high level models deserve the most comments, yes, that's obvious. Criticism, (constructive) is always welcomed. And while I've seen some seriously harsh criticism out there (not of me) which I believed was undeserving, what I'm getting at more here is some of the type of advice I've seen doled out. For example, I've given people some advice about basic stuff on their 'my first model' type posts, things like thinning paint, drybrushing and inks. I try to stick to basic advice, without coming across as a know it all hole (god knows if I am successful or not). But I've seen people put up work that frankly would benefit from basic painting techniques being mastered (producing solid cover, ensuring no primer showing through, edge highlighting...), and seen others tell them to 'paint the eyes of that terminator like they are glowing, you know OSL'.

BABY STEPS PEOPLE! One day, they will be ready for that!

It's probably a natural fail of having an arena where pros are posting along side total noobs, it raises the expectations REALLY high, so when a model is 'merely' a good mid-level solid paint job ( the sort that would get complimented at a local club level), it blends into the background, as it does not stand out as being outstandingly good or bad here.

 goblinzz wrote:

 DPBellathrom wrote:

 goblinzz wrote:
I feel like I need to weigh in here.

I've also noticed a significant level of creep in painting standards over the past four years especially. It seems like now if you want even a lukewarm response you need to use OSL, or have high levels of freehand, or do NMM. While I may not paint stunningly, I was rather taken aback when I was informed that I needed to 'paint the teeth on that ork so they look like they are rotten" (the teeth in question being somewhat less than 1/2mm square). While it is great that the galleries are full of inspirational figures, painted to a standard that I aspire to, it seems a shame that the community believes that EVERYONE should paint to the level of 'eavy metal painters.

I believe that while the aspirational stuff is great, the community doesn't have enough respect for straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painting. I say this not based on being miffed at a comment on my stuff, but based on the comments I read on others posts.

I see where you're coming from but I think it's more of fact that a well painted model will generate a lot of praise as there is nothing to improve on where as a "straight forward, solid, if non- 'fancy' painted" should still get praise (after all if you did a good job then you should be praised) but should also recieve oppinions on how to make the model better. it's not a bad thing, it's just people trying to help make your models look as good as they can

This is always a touchy issue, when you bring your own experience of forums in to things, it's real easy for me to come across as a conceited ... So, the high level models deserve the most comments, yes, that's obvious. Criticism, (constructive) is always welcomed. And while I've seen some seriously harsh criticism out there (not of me) which I believed was undeserving, what I'm getting at more here is some of the type of advice I've seen doled out. For example, I've given people some advice about basic stuff on their 'my first model' type posts, things like thinning paint, drybrushing and inks. I try to stick to basic advice, without coming across as a know it all hole (god knows if I am successful or not). But I've seen people put up work that frankly would benefit from basic painting techniques being mastered (producing solid cover, ensuring no primer showing through, edge highlighting...), and seen others tell them to 'paint the eyes of that terminator like they are glowing, you know OSL'.

BABY STEPS PEOPLE! One day, they will be ready for that!

It's probably a natural fail of having an arena where pros are posting along side total noobs, it raises the expectations REALLY high, so when a model is 'merely' a good mid-level solid paint job ( the sort that would get complimented at a local club level), it blends into the background, as it does not stand out as being outstandingly good or bad here.

don't worry you didn't come across like that lol and yeah, I agree that you need to use baby steps but then again I guess the quicker they find out about OSL and the like the better

Interesting but I must say that it is relative to whom you play with, what your playing group accepts.
I am more than happy to play against painted forces, that is they resemble an army (3 colours, 1wash and painted base).
Tourneys should have this as a baseline but well done (it is possible to present good figures with basic painting; unfortunately just as easy to present a lump of plastic painted with a toilet brush).
Some groups are happy to field varying degrees of 'completed' armies. Consider how you would play a game of chess? Would you be happy playing with cardboard counters or do you prefer onyx/quartz carved traditional pieces?
Ultimately play and enjoy!

With the new paint ranges now available (washes, textured paints, etc), I think the foundational elements of "basic tabletop", e.g., painted within the lines, compete coverage, and 3 colors allows you to turn out figures that look fine on the tabletop.

If I had advice to offer to those trying to improve on their table top standard, it would be:

1. Use the full range of paint types and modeling options available to you. Everyone puts out washes now, the sell tufts of grass so that you don't have to mess around with static grass etc.
2. Use the largest brush you can possibly get away with. The 000 doesn't automatically guarantee better results
3. I am a huge fan of flat brushes. I find that I can do most of my work with those.
4. Expand your horizons beyond white and black primer. There are tons of other colors that can speed up your painting and improve your results.

http://fromthewarp.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/how-i-paint-ultramarines-dark-and-very.html

that blog post should be compulsory reading for everyone before painting their first model. Seriously a pair of rattle cans and you could churn out a marine army in no time at all.