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I'm a new 40K player and I've been a bit curious about WHFB too. I was wondering if anyone could suggest a new player friendly army for me. I was looking at the sticky thread with information about the factions, and a couple of the factions I tried to read about were a bit incomplete so I decided to just go ahead and ask here.

A few questions about armies:

Are the armies very expensive, like they are with 40K? It's taken me 3 months to get to 1,250 points of Imperial Guard infantry. I don't have a lot of money to sink into the game right now, so I was wondering if some armies are more expensive than others. I'm very nervous about having to spend $100+ just to get started, especially if I pick the wrong army.

Is Skaven a good choice for a newer player? I know nothing about the armies, but I thought that the Skaven seemed cute and would be fun to try to paint.

I'm not very good at painting, would most players allow me to play with an army that isn't very well-painted?

Can I use the same paints on WHFB models that I use on my 40K models without hurting them? I use Army Painter paints.

A few questions I had about the game:

I've tried to watch a few battlereports online, but the dice rolling seemed really confusing and a lot different than 40K. Especially the magic. Does magic play a huge role in the game?

If I got into WHFB, where would I get those little square movement trays I see everyone using in battle reports?

Do most people consider WHFB's current edition to be pretty solid? As I mentioned, I play 40K a little bit and the rules seem very complicated, and subject to change via FAQs. My friend bought the new Dark Angel Marines book and the developers released a FAQ less than a week later.


Thank you very much to anyone who can help me.

I guess what you first need to do it to take a trip to your local GW start and start reading. As well you can pick up the rule book for 20 bukcs ie the little paper back on.

Yes to everything you said.

I used an online system to find out what army I wanted to play. I then tested option for the codex out online. Then I went about picking everything up that I wanted. Its a really great thing to have as it lets you test something to see if you like it. That is unless you like to buy things that really do not work and or that you might not like playing.

The simple point is that it gave me a heads up before I bought the items.

Yes to everything else, but your going to be doing a lot of cleaning and painting. I would also look out because there are going to be some new dex dropping in the next few months. The reason I say this is so that you do not buy codex thats about to see a change. I know, been there and done that and watched my army get shreaded a few times.

Tarval wrote:
I guess what you first need to do it to take a trip to your local GW start and start reading. As well you can pick up the rule book for 20 bukcs ie the little paper back on.

Yes to everything you said.

I used an online system to find out what army I wanted to play. I then tested option for the codex out online. Then I went about picking everything up that I wanted. Its a really great thing to have as it lets you test something to see if you like it. That is unless you like to buy things that really do not work and or that you might not like playing.

The simple point is that it gave me a heads up before I bought the items.

Yes to everything else, but your going to be doing a lot of cleaning and painting. I would also look out because there are going to be some new dex dropping in the next few months. The reason I say this is so that you do not buy codex thats about to see a change. I know, been there and done that and watched my army get shreaded a few times.

Thanks for the reply. What is this online system you mentioned?

I dont know if we are allowed to talk about it or not. So I will let others take that question. I am thinking that if you did some googling you might find it.

 Iron Dragon wrote:
A few questions about armies:

Are the armies very expensive, like they are with 40K? It's taken me 3 months to get to 1,250 points of Imperial Guard infantry. I don't have a lot of money to sink into the game right now, so I was wondering if some armies are more expensive than others. I'm very nervous about having to spend $100+ just to get started, especially if I pick the wrong army.

Is Skaven a good choice for a newer player? I know nothing about the armies, but I thought that the Skaven seemed cute and would be fun to try to paint.

I'm not very good at painting, would most players allow me to play with an army that isn't very well-painted?

Can I use the same paints on WHFB models that I use on my 40K models without hurting them? I use Army Painter paints.

Depending on the army you go with, they can get very expensive. For example, Vampire Counts - my Core for 2000pts is 50 Skeletons and 25 Ghouls. That's 7.5 boxes. Just for minimum Core.

Warhammer Fantasy doesn't really have a 'beginner' army. All armies have their strengths, weaknesses and quirks. Skaven are just another army - they're rather heavy on model count though, moreso than Vampires.

Playing with unpainted/poorly painted armies depends entirely on your local scene. That said, it's not hard to get a fully painted, tabletop quality army done these days with the abundance of things like colour spray primers and dips.

Don't beleive the crap GW feeds you. Any paint will work on any model. I use a combination of Vallejo, GW, Army Painter and P3 paints for my models.

 Iron Dragon wrote:
A few questions I had about the game:

I've tried to watch a few battlereports online, but the dice rolling seemed really confusing and a lot different than 40K. Especially the magic. Does magic play a huge role in the game?

If I got into WHFB, where would I get those little square movement trays I see everyone using in battle reports?

Do most people consider WHFB's current edition to be pretty solid? As I mentioned, I play 40K a little bit and the rules seem very complicated, and subject to change via FAQs. My friend bought the new Dark Angel Marines book and the developers released a FAQ less than a week later.

There's a lot of dice rolling, it's a GW game. They like you rolling buckets of dice. Magic is also quite different to 40k psychics, even in 6th edition. It's more reliable to get spells you want at higher master levels (or with multiple casters), winds of magic randomly distribute power dice and dispel dice every turn, and overall magic is far more effective in Fantasy than psychics are in 40k. Magic is very influential in Fantasy - basically why you never see an army without at least one level 4 wizard.

The movement trays are sold by a lot of places, plus it's quite easy to make your own. That said, I find it hard to go past GW's modular movement tray pack. It's cheap (even compared to other companies), and you get two 10x10 trays for 20mm bases, with the other side marked with 8x8 for 25mm bases, plus plenty of edging. Just figure out the size you want, score and snap where you want it, and stick the edging on.

8th edition is generally considered to be the best edition yet for Fantasy. There's obviously people out there that don't like it, but it's generally seen as a step in the right direction and a solid rule set. It did scare away the tournament crowd, however, due to its random movement killing the regiment dance gameplay of 7th edition.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Iron Dragon wrote:
A few questions about armies:

Are the armies very expensive, like they are with 40K? It's taken me 3 months to get to 1,250 points of Imperial Guard infantry. I don't have a lot of money to sink into the game right now, so I was wondering if some armies are more expensive than others. I'm very nervous about having to spend $100+ just to get started, especially if I pick the wrong army.

Is Skaven a good choice for a newer player? I know nothing about the armies, but I thought that the Skaven seemed cute and would be fun to try to paint.

I'm not very good at painting, would most players allow me to play with an army that isn't very well-painted?

Can I use the same paints on WHFB models that I use on my 40K models without hurting them? I use Army Painter paints.

Depending on the army you go with, they can get very expensive. For example, Vampire Counts - my Core for 2000pts is 50 Skeletons and 25 Ghouls. That's 7.5 boxes. Just for minimum Core.

Warhammer Fantasy doesn't really have a 'beginner' army. All armies have their strengths, weaknesses and quirks. Skaven are just another army - they're rather heavy on model count though, moreso than Vampires.

Playing with unpainted/poorly painted armies depends entirely on your local scene. That said, it's not hard to get a fully painted, tabletop quality army done these days with the abundance of things like colour spray primers and dips.

Don't beleive the crap GW feeds you. Any paint will work on any model. I use a combination of Vallejo, GW, Army Painter and P3 paints for my models.

 Iron Dragon wrote:
A few questions I had about the game:

I've tried to watch a few battlereports online, but the dice rolling seemed really confusing and a lot different than 40K. Especially the magic. Does magic play a huge role in the game?

If I got into WHFB, where would I get those little square movement trays I see everyone using in battle reports?

Do most people consider WHFB's current edition to be pretty solid? As I mentioned, I play 40K a little bit and the rules seem very complicated, and subject to change via FAQs. My friend bought the new Dark Angel Marines book and the developers released a FAQ less than a week later.

There's a lot of dice rolling, it's a GW game. They like you rolling buckets of dice. Magic is also quite different to 40k psychics, even in 6th edition. It's more reliable to get spells you want at higher master levels (or with multiple casters), winds of magic randomly distribute power dice and dispel dice every turn, and overall magic is far more effective in Fantasy than psychics are in 40k. Magic is very influential in Fantasy - basically why you never see an army without at least one level 4 wizard.

The movement trays are sold by a lot of places, plus it's quite easy to make your own. That said, I find it hard to go past GW's modular movement tray pack. It's cheap (even compared to other companies), and you get two 10x10 trays for 20mm bases, with the other side marked with 8x8 for 25mm bases, plus plenty of edging. Just figure out the size you want, score and snap where you want it, and stick the edging on.

8th edition is generally considered to be the best edition yet for Fantasy. There's obviously people out there that don't like it, but it's generally seen as a step in the right direction and a solid rule set. It did scare away the tournament crowd, however, due to its random movement killing the regiment dance gameplay of 7th edition.

I really appreciate the extensive reply. I was looking online at the prices for Skaven and yeah, it does seem like they're as expensive as 40K. It's frustrating that if I want to play, it'll require another big investment. I guess I should look around locally for WHFB players and see if I can observe some of their games, before I pick up any models. I do think I'll go with Skaven though.

Having Island of Blood bitz on ebay makes Skaven more affordable. The entire skaven end can be bought for $40-$45 and 20 clan rats can be bought for about $17.50. The bad side of skaven is you need rats and generally a lot of them. 2 IoB armies would bea great start, this gives you 2 blocks of 40 clanrats with weapon teams, a Chieftain BSB, and an engineer (actually 2 of these), Rat Ogres are OK 2 are useless, 4 is actually a decent unit. Then add a rare either a pair of WLCs or a Hell Pit, a gray seer would be cool too, a box of nightrunners to make some gutter runners as well, here is a 1250 list I have to help introduce people to the game:

Gray Seer, Dispel Scroll 265
Chieftain, BSB, Enchanted Shield, Dawnstone 100
Warlock Lvl1, Doomrocket, Warp Energy Condenser 115
24 Clanrats, Shields, Full Command, Poisoned Wind Mortar 193
36 Clanrats, Shields, Full Command, Warpfire Thrower 252
5 Gutter Runners, Slings, Poison Attacks 90
Hell Pit Abomination 235
1250

To be honest this could be done with 1 IoB set at $45, 20 more clan rats at $18, a box of night runners $30 ( you will want about 10 of these eventually so the box is a good buy), hell pit $55, Gray Seer (might get lucky and find one from the Screaming Bell Kit, sit him on a rock and good to go) $10 so $158 these are based on ebay prices.

As for painting a recommend with Skaven a gray scale technique where you prime them white then use really water down paints, even washes only to paint here are some examples I saw on Warseer:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?337324-My-painting-guide-to-my-skaven-and-in-general&p=6153092#post6153092
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?336964-Speed-paint-Greyscale-washing-vs-dipping

Hargus56 wrote:
Having Island of Blood bitz on ebay makes Skaven more affordable. The entire skaven end can be bought for $40-$45 and 20 clan rats can be bought for about $17.50. The bad side of skaven is you need rats and generally a lot of them. 2 IoB armies would bea great start, this gives you 2 blocks of 40 clanrats with weapon teams, a Chieftain BSB, and an engineer (actually 2 of these), Rat Ogres are OK 2 are useless, 4 is actually a decent unit. Then add a rare either a pair of WLCs or a Hell Pit, a gray seer would be cool too, a box of nightrunners to make some gutter runners as well, here is a 1250 list I have to help introduce people to the game:

Gray Seer, Dispel Scroll 265
Chieftain, BSB, Enchanted Shield, Dawnstone 100
Warlock Lvl1, Doomrocket, Warp Energy Condenser 115
24 Clanrats, Shields, Full Command, Poisoned Wind Mortar 193
36 Clanrats, Shields, Full Command, Warpfire Thrower 252
5 Gutter Runners, Slings, Poison Attacks 90
Hell Pit Abomination 235
1250

To be honest this could be done with 1 IoB set at $45, 20 more clan rats at $18, a box of night runners $30 ( you will want about 10 of these eventually so the box is a good buy), hell pit $55, Gray Seer (might get lucky and find one from the Screaming Bell Kit, sit him on a rock and good to go) $10 so $158 these are based on ebay prices.

As for painting a recommend with Skaven a gray scale technique where you prime them white then use really water down paints, even washes only to paint here are some examples I saw on Warseer:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?337324-My-painting-guide-to-my-skaven-and-in-general&p=6153092#post6153092
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?336964-Speed-paint-Greyscale-washing-vs-dipping

Yeah, see, I don't know what most of that information means. I realize it's an army list, but I still need to make my final decision and pick up a Skaven codex and the game's main rulebook. I'm currently discussing buying some Skaven from someone here on Dakka, I think he's going to help me figure out what I need to get started. But overall, $158 doesn't sound too bad. I've spent more than that on my Imperial Guard so far. The battle box was $100 just on its own.

As for painting... I am a terrible, terrible painter as evidenced by my Imperial Guard army.. lol. http://imageshack.us/a/img405/4936/dsc00045in.jpg

I thought it would be really cute and funny to have a bunch of mouse units running around the battlefield. And I was going to name them after Redwall characters such as Martin, Luke, Mattimeo and so on.

All those items noted are magic items from the rulebook or the skaven codex, you should be able to get the mini rulebook from the same person you buy the IoB bitz from for about $25-$30 dollars the army book (codex) you can probably find used as well so maybe add another $50 on that $158, honestly you could scrap the hell pit for now and a few points for a 1k list in the above but it's kind of lacking a heavy hitter which the hell pit does well. I bought my skaven army book used and the original receipt from the UK was still in it, pretty cool.

Hargus56 wrote:
All those items noted are magic items from the rulebook or the skaven codex, you should be able to get the mini rulebook from the same person you buy the IoB bitz from for about $25-$30 dollars the army book (codex) you can probably find used as well so maybe add another $50 on that $158, honestly you could scrap the hell pit for now and a few points for a 1k list in the above but it's kind of lacking a heavy hitter which the hell pit does well. I bought my skaven army book used and the original receipt from the UK was still in it, pretty cool.

So the auctions on ebay where they're selling 20 clanrats for $25 aren't a very good deal? For example I was looking at these. http://www.ebay.com/itm/310556920130?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I watched a couple of auctions expire last night, and didn't bid on them because.. I don't have the codex yet, so I don't know if those are the kind of models I need.

To answer your points in order:

1) Yes, they can be. Some armies are much more expensive than others due to high model counts because of cheap (point-wise) units. Ogres, Warriors of Chaos, and Bretonnia have lower model counts because individual models tend to more points. Skaven, Empire, Vampire Counts, and Tomb Kings tend to have high model counts due to low-point troops. There is always the second-hand market (e-bay and the like) to save on costs.

2)Skaven are a pretty good choice, because they are reasonably easy to play. But you have to be pretty dedicated to painting rats; you'll likely field between 100-200 models in an army of them. And it will cost a pretty chunk of change too.

3)So long as you put forth the effort, most players won't care overmuch about your quality of painting. From four feet away details are hard to see anyway.

4)Yes, the plastic used for WFB models are the same as is used on 40K models. The same tools work just fine.

5) Depends on the armies involved. Some do fine with minimum magic, others really need magic to do well. It's a bit confusing at first, but you'll pick it up pretty quickly once you start actually using it.

6) Movement trays can be purchased from GW, independant manufacturers, or you can make them yourself. I use thin sheets of basswood and strips of balsa from the local hobby store for mine.

7) Opinions are divided. Some loathe it, some love it... most of us find it workable despite some quirks that make little sense. A lot of the rules will be familiar from 40K... which will make the differences all the more jarring when you encounter them.

 Iron Dragon wrote:

Hargus56 wrote:
All those items noted are magic items from the rulebook or the skaven codex, you should be able to get the mini rulebook from the same person you buy the IoB bitz from for about $25-$30 dollars the army book (codex) you can probably find used as well so maybe add another $50 on that $158, honestly you could scrap the hell pit for now and a few points for a 1k list in the above but it's kind of lacking a heavy hitter which the hell pit does well. I bought my skaven army book used and the original receipt from the UK was still in it, pretty cool.

So the auctions on ebay where they're selling 20 clanrats for $25 aren't a very good deal? For example I was looking at these. http://www.ebay.com/itm/310556920130?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I watched a couple of auctions expire last night, and didn't bid on them because.. I don't have the codex yet, so I don't know if those are the kind of models I need.

You are paying more for OOP models, plus IMO hand weapon and shield works a little better as they get parry saves I like these: http://www.ebay.com/itm/WFB-Island-of-Blood-Skaven-Clanrats-w-Hand-Weapons-20-S-/200887452306?pt=Games_US&hash=item2ec5d34292 also has the rulebook for $25 http://www.ebay.com/itm/WFB-Island-of-Blood-Mini-Rulebook-S-/200887452246?pt=Games_US&hash=item2ec5d34256 I'd be tempted to grab 1-2 of those clanrats and that book, keep your eyes peeled for a Skaven end of the IoB, there is one on their for $20 or $40 BIN but they want $15 for shipping and that is kinda high. You could possibly contact the seller of the auctions of the rats and rulebook and see if they have a skaven set they can throw together for you for a custom auction.

 Vulcan wrote:
To answer your points in order:

1) Yes, they can be. Some armies are much more expensive than others due to high model counts because of cheap (point-wise) units. Ogres, Warriors of Chaos, and Bretonnia have lower model counts because individual models tend to more points. Skaven, Empire, Vampire Counts, and Tomb Kings tend to have high model counts due to low-point troops. There is always the second-hand market (e-bay and the like) to save on costs.

2)Skaven are a pretty good choice, because they are reasonably easy to play. But you have to be pretty dedicated to painting rats; you'll likely field between 100-200 models in an army of them. And it will cost a pretty chunk of change too.

3)So long as you put forth the effort, most players won't care overmuch about your quality of painting. From four feet away details are hard to see anyway.

4)Yes, the plastic used for WFB models are the same as is used on 40K models. The same tools work just fine.

5) Depends on the armies involved. Some do fine with minimum magic, others really need magic to do well. It's a bit confusing at first, but you'll pick it up pretty quickly once you start actually using it.

6) Movement trays can be purchased from GW, independant manufacturers, or you can make them yourself. I use thin sheets of basswood and strips of balsa from the local hobby store for mine.

7) Opinions are divided. Some loathe it, some love it... most of us find it workable despite some quirks that make little sense. A lot of the rules will be familiar from 40K... which will make the differences all the more jarring when you encounter them.

Thanks so much for the extensive reply, Vulcan! Those answers to help me with quite a few questions that I had. I'm starting to think that I really need to get the codex and rulebook first and decide how I want to proceed. Right now, I'm 90% sure I want to play as Skaven.