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So is the best combo IG with GK allies or GK with IG allies?

< Taken by the void dragon. >

Neither.

The only constant in the future of tournaments is change and an arms race depending on editions.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

 Che-Vito wrote:

anthXIII wrote:
So is the best combo IG with GK allies or GK with IG allies?

Tyranid Zoats with Squat Allies.
This is a very subjective question, with no 'right' answer.

My guess: Things will continue as they have, the game will swing between incredibly unbalanced, to marginally balanced, and back again. It's how GW makes money (writing vague rules quickly, and creating a market for models that have not previously sold well.)

How many tournaments have you been to recently? IDK about there not being a "right" answer... the SWIG combo is popping up all over the goddamn place. Now that I think about it, IG as allies is super prevalent right now. Vendettas are unquestionably the best flyer, and for the low low cost of 120 points (CCS and a squad of vets) you have access to three of them.


And as far as the "your wallet" comment in concerned, I am VERY strongly of the opinion that GW added the allies matrix as a way to get people to go out and buy more models.

Marines commandeering the IG forces just to get access to their motorpool/air support. So lame, but so very like the actual fluff.

I have one word for you: 5 Tervigons (see, one of them is a number ) Put that in your pipe and smoke it!

I've seen people talking Guard with Wolf allies as the best. Guard provide artillery and flyers, Wolves shut down psykers with Njal and access to strong melee fighters, ATSKNF, and cheap heavy weapons squads.

Don't know for sure yet. I've seen Blood Angels + Guard, Furioso Dreadnought spam with Vendetta and Basilisk fire support, a pretty brutal marine killer list.

anthXIII wrote:
So is the best combo IG with GK allies or GK with IG allies?

Guard with SW Allies, or DA with Guard Allies.

Rune Priests in blobs are filthy. Back that with Artillery carriages and Vendettas/Vultures.

Azrael in a blob is similarly filthy. Back that with Deathwing/Bikes and a Vendetta or Two with Vets/CCS inside.

 Che-Vito wrote:

And as far as the "your wallet" comment in concerned, I am VERY strongly of the opinion that GW added the allies matrix as a way to get people to go out and buy more models.

Of-course they did!

The entire GAME was made for it.

Not that it makes it a bad addition. I am a tau purist (not even kroot), yet I enjoy the allied armies I fight.


However, it seems that unless "skys of fire" have some re-balance changes to the old fliers, to win a tournament you must be at least partly IG or necron. just nothing can compete with their airforce.

 BoomWolf wrote:

 Che-Vito wrote:

And as far as the "your wallet" comment in concerned, I am VERY strongly of the opinion that GW added the allies matrix as a way to get people to go out and buy more models.

Of-course they did!

The entire GAME was made for it.

Not that it makes it a bad addition. I am a tau purist (not even kroot), yet I enjoy the allied armies I fight.


However, it seems that unless "skys of fire" have some re-balance changes to the old fliers, to win a tournament you must be at least partly IG or necron. just nothing can compete with their airforce.

I agree, you can't expect to win without buying
A) Allies to gain access to their flyers
B) Fortifications to get quad gun/icarus
C) Expensive FW addons to existing armies (I.E. the Hydra Flak Tank or the CMP Dread)

Notice that the operative term here was BUYING.

The two big tournies that Im aware of, NOVA and The Seattle Heart of Fire Tournament, a 70 player, 2000pt 40K tournament both had winning lists that didnt have a single flyer in them.

I think we need more players playing more games without flyers to see how much effect flyers actually have on the table top.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

I agree, a lot of topping armies don't even have fliers, its more about versatility than anything. Surprisingly Tyranids have been making a few top appearances and they are widely regarded as the worst army in the game.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

Tyranids are NOT the worst army.They are at least ahead of Sisters, BT, BA and, in my opinion, Eldar.

 Spartan089 wrote:
I agree, a lot of topping armies don't even have fliers, its more about versatility than anything. Surprisingly Tyranids have been making a few top appearances and they are widely regarded as the worst army in the game.

They were regarded as bottom 5 in 5th ediion... but in 6th, that has changed. A lot! I find that Tyranids give me a great chance against every army in the game. (Yes, including Night Scythe lists). I'd say as a stand alone codex, Tyranids are a top 3 army. I'd put Crons and Daemons ahead. They are however notoriously difficult to use just right. But Emperor save you if your opponent knows what he's doing!

To the OP, the future of Tournaments is in allies, as I don't think any of the Imperial Armies are great alone. However, with allies they can become highly competetive.

So far in 6th, I've won two tournaments with a no flyer, no allies, no fortifications Space Wolves army.

 Spartan089 wrote:
Surprisingly Tyranids have been making a few top appearances and they are widely regarded as the worst army in the game.

Folk who regard Nids as a bad army are simply wrong and foolish. Put simply; they don't know what they're talking about.

Nids have an awful codex with poor internal balance. So few good units.

But those good units are excellent.

orks with tau allies, aka greentide + tau with fire warriors on quad gun and broadsides too best of the two armies.

 CaptainGrey wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:
Surprisingly Tyranids have been making a few top appearances and they are widely regarded as the worst army in the game.

Folk who regard Nids as a bad army are simply wrong and foolish. Put simply; they don't know what they're talking about.

Nids have an awful codex with poor internal balance. So few good units.

But those good units are excellent.

Basically they just haven't played a good Nids list. Let's be honest here, they're not popular in tournaments because they're very different to play than say the Skittles bag'o'marines.

Martel732 wrote:
Tyranids are NOT the worst army.They are at least ahead of Sisters, BT, BA and, in my opinion, Eldar.

I would disagree abour the sisters they are just underplayed but with all those meltas and flamers the sisters will be krumping you inside and out and lets not forget the dreaded organ gun being s8 ap1 that will be putting a reasonable sized whole in most things it shoots at and they will probably be dropping 1-2 tervigons a turn if they are smart enough to focus fire

Nids are good vs those who dont know how to fight nids. Beat them with guard, BA, and a silly number of times as eldar. Havent lost a game to them yet. Most i table or the opponent concedes without the game ending.

My nids are genestealer cult heavy and were shelved in 5th. 6th sees no reason for me to bring them out. I refuse to play the abomination of fluff and gameplay the Tervigon. Doesnt mean i dont know how to beat them though.


IG+SW does seem to be the best of all worlds. GK bring force weapons, but you lose the great buffs SW ICs bring.