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Lets say you have a DE force with GK allies. The GK force being desperate allies. Even though the rule book states that they cannot score, could grand strategy supersede this and make a GK unit scoring anyway?

Grand strategy would be used on a GK unit. None in particular though.

*question rephrased

The only allies that don't score are Desperate Allies, IIRC.

Dr. What wrote:
The only allies that don't score are Desperate Allies, IIRC.

that is correct.

allies of conveinence are scoring units normally.

Remember that the rules for AoC say that your units treat AoC as enemy units. but units do not count up objective points you, as the player, do.

A better question is can he use grand strategy to make some space marine stuff scoring. It hasn't been faq'd to only work on codex gk iirc

 tuiman wrote:
A better question is can he use grand strategy to make some space marine stuff scoring. It hasn't been faq'd to only work on codex gk iirc

It has not been FaQed.

Grand strategy can only be used on units from Codex Grey Knights (The context of the ability tells us this is true).

 DeathReaper wrote:

 tuiman wrote:
A better question is can he use grand strategy to make some space marine stuff scoring. It hasn't been faq'd to only work on codex gk iirc

It has not been FaQed.

Grand strategy can only be used on units from Codex Grey Knights (The context of the ability tells us this is true).

It say "units in your army"

Are allies not part of your army?

 tuiman wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 tuiman wrote:
A better question is can he use grand strategy to make some space marine stuff scoring. It hasn't been faq'd to only work on codex gk iirc

It has not been FaQed.

Grand strategy can only be used on units from Codex Grey Knights (The context of the ability tells us this is true).

It say "units in your army"

Are allies not part of your army?

The Grand Strategy rule says units in your army. The context tells us that means units in the GK army.

P.81 GK Codex, Unit composition heading tells us that you can only include one of each unique unit in "Your Army"

P.81 GK Codex, Army List Entries heading tells us "Each unit in the Grey Knights army list contains the following information."

Your Army = GK army list.

Grand Strategy P.22 tells us to nominate a certain type of unit in Your Army.

Conclusion: The Grand Strategy ability works on Grey Knight units only.

And then 6th edition came along:

Allies = part of your army

part of your army = part of your grey knight army

so grand strategy can work on allies?

I dont want to drag this out because its not what the OP asked (and to be fair, my fault for bringing it up) and the last topic on this got very heated and locked down.

But you can make a valid argument for both sides and it really needs an faq ruling tbh

 tuiman wrote:
And then 6th edition came along:

Allies = part of your army

part of your army = part of your grey knight army

so grand strategy can work on allies?

I dont want to drag this out because its not what the OP asked (and to be fair, my fault for bringing it up) and the last topic on this got very heated and locked down.

But you can make a valid argument for both sides and it really needs an faq ruling tbh

and codex trumps BRB, therefore the your army referal in the GK Codex specifically refers to the GK Codex.

P.S. the OP has his answer so we should probably just let this go to an FaQ.

Agreed, and I apologize for being OT

Let me rephrase the question then. Lets say you have a DE force with GK allies. The GK force being desperate allies. Even though the rule book states that they cannot score, could grand strategy supersede this and make a GK unit scoring anyway?

To that I would reply with a very confident "perhaps maybe."

Yes; the GS rule is mnore advanced than the ally rules

Yes, the Grandmaster could use Grand Strategy to make some of the GK units scoring to override the Desperate Allies rule on not scoring.

Codex > main book. So yes, currently i believe there is rules-support for an allied grand master making appropriate GK units scoring in that scenario.

wouldn't it be moot anyways as whatever they score, they just deny anyways as desperate allies are denial units to your army (they are treated as enemy units)? Unless I'm missing something here.

Desperate Allies are not denial units to your army (they are part of your army, after all) and are explicitly not denial units to your opponent's army.

Desperate Allies are only treated as enemy units by the units from the other detachment. As you are not a unit in your army, you do not treat the Desperate Allies as enemy units for determining scoring (or victory points in Purge the Alien).

overlordweasel wrote:
wouldn't it be moot anyways as whatever they score, they just deny anyways as desperate allies are denial units to your army (they are treated as enemy units)? Unless I'm missing something here.

No, for two reasons. 1 you do not treat them as enemy models, your army does. 2, Desperate Allies are never Denial units.

Desperate allies are neither scoring nor denial.

The idea that units you purchase with your own points as a part of your FoC, and they deny objectives from your own scoring units is ridiculous.